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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: it stars saddam]
    #6678563 -

it stars saddam said:
Psychedelics are the greatest class of drugs ever imo.


At least there's something we can agree on.


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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: it stars saddam]
    #6678568 -

From the shallow range of drugs that I have experienced, psychedelics are far superior... and they will be pretty hard to top :tongue:

My throat is so damn dry though... I must remember to keep swallowing saliva... :lol:

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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: Silversoul]
    #6678579 -

Silversoul said:
it stars saddam said:
Psychedelics are the greatest class of drugs ever imo.


At least there's something we can agree on.


I tried LSD for the first time last Friday, and have since almost completely lost interest in opiates, which I was abusing somewhat heavily before. I think LSD is probably the most valuable tool available to modern psychologists, which is what Timothy Leary was trying to tell everyone.

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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: it stars saddam]
    #6678610 -

Sometimes, I think of my life as being divided into pre-LSD and post-LSD.


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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: Silversoul]
    #6678623 -

The way I feel when I'm tripping reminds me of how I felt all the time when I was really little. Like a toddler, except smarter, haha.

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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: it stars saddam]
    #6678627 -

Quote:
Sometimes, I think of my life as being divided into pre-LSD and post-LSD.


That's an awesome way of looking at it. It definitely applies to my life and the chemicals within mushrooms.

Edited by Wee (03/17/07 08:29 AM)

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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: Wee]
    #6678646 -

Wee said:
I'm a little hesitant to try LSD, but I think that I eventually will.


I was the same way. After my 5g mushroom nightmare trip 2 years ago, I was extremely reluctant to start experimenting with psychedelics again. But my ex-girlfriend got me 2 hits of acid for my birthday, and for months they just sat in my drawer. One morning I woke up (last Friday), and through my intuition I just knew that this was the perfect day to take LSD. And it was. I took 2 hits and had a beautiful trip.

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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: Wee]
    #6678665 -

Back onto the topic of LSD. Letting others manufacture something that is so fucking personal and will forever change my outlook on life is very hard to do, but I must trust that these people are good, honest folk that have the intention of spreading knowledge- I just find that so difficult.

Edited by Wee (03/17/07 08:30 AM)

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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: Wee]
    #6678687 -

.

Edited by Wee (03/17/07 09:01 AM)

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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: Wee]
    #6678700 -

.

Edited by Wee (03/17/07 08:30 AM)

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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: Wee]
    #6678714 -

.
I edited these to keep this relatively on topic. Last night was wild, my apologies.

Edited by Wee (03/17/07 08:31 AM)

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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: Wee]
    #6678721 -

You're tripping.

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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: it stars saddam]
    #6678733 -

Pascal entirely missed the point of God. When Jesus spoke of the Kingdom of God, he wasn't speaking of some dogmatic, bureaucratic organization, or some God you should believe in just because you're afraid of what will happen if you don't. Like Jesus once said, "If a blind person leads another blind person, both of them will fall into a ditch." Anyone who would pretend to believe in God simply because they're taking a wager, and have not experienced what is right in front of them, might as well be agnostic for their lack of experience or motives other than ignorance.

Perhaps if Christians and others interested in "God" realized what Jesus was talking about in the first place, they wouldn't have to use deductive reasoning and wagers and fear of death to convince themselves and others of God's existence. As the Gospel of Thomas records in such people who fail to understand anything about Jesus' perspective, "They said to him: Tell us who you are so that we can believe in you. He replied: You analyze the appearance of the sky and earth, but you don't recognize what is right in front of you, and you don't know the nature of the present time." Pascal's wager is a wager of hellfire, but what does hell have to do with the present or the Kingdom of God? Using Pascal's wager, your existence will not change in the slightest, and the point of trying to understand Jesus' experiences will be lost on you completely.


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.

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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: it stars saddam]
    #6678738 -

it stars saddam said:
You're tripping.


Fuck yeah. This is ridiculous.

Edited by Wee (03/17/07 08:32 AM)

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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: Wee]
    #6679380 -

we intend to buy a lottery ticket
the chances are low we may win
the shame negligeable in losing
the political side effects hard to assess
but it helps to think some miserable slob will certainly win
the impact on muslim relations is probably more positive than not as we will likely buy more falafels if we win.


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:brainfart: _ :finger:

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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: Ravus]
    #6679456 -

Ravus said:
Pascal entirely missed the point of God. When Jesus spoke of the Kingdom of God, he wasn't speaking of some dogmatic, bureaucratic organization, or some God you should believe in just because you're afraid of what will happen if you don't. Like Jesus once said, "If a blind person leads another blind person, both of them will fall into a ditch." Anyone who would pretend to believe in God simply because they're taking a wager, and have not experienced what is right in front of them, might as well be agnostic for their lack of experience or motives other than ignorance.

Perhaps if Christians and others interested in "God" realized what Jesus was talking about in the first place, they wouldn't have to use deductive reasoning and wagers and fear of death to convince themselves and others of God's existence. As the Gospel of Thomas records in such people who fail to understand anything about Jesus' perspective, "They said to him: Tell us who you are so that we can believe in you. He replied: You analyze the appearance of the sky and earth, but you don't recognize what is right in front of you, and you don't know the nature of the present time." Pascal's wager is a wager of hellfire, but what does hell have to do with the present or the Kingdom of God? Using Pascal's wager, your existence will not change in the slightest, and the point of trying to understand Jesus' experiences will be lost on you completely.


:thumbup:


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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: Silversoul]
    #6679516 -

Silversoul said:
Ravus said:
Pascal entirely missed the point of God. When Jesus spoke of the Kingdom of God, he wasn't speaking of some dogmatic, bureaucratic organization, or some God you should believe in just because you're afraid of what will happen if you don't. Like Jesus once said, "If a blind person leads another blind person, both of them will fall into a ditch." Anyone who would pretend to believe in God simply because they're taking a wager, and have not experienced what is right in front of them, might as well be agnostic for their lack of experience or motives other than ignorance.

Perhaps if Christians and others interested in "God" realized what Jesus was talking about in the first place, they wouldn't have to use deductive reasoning and wagers and fear of death to convince themselves and others of God's existence. As the Gospel of Thomas records in such people who fail to understand anything about Jesus' perspective, "They said to him: Tell us who you are so that we can believe in you. He replied: You analyze the appearance of the sky and earth, but you don't recognize what is right in front of you, and you don't know the nature of the present time." Pascal's wager is a wager of hellfire, but what does hell have to do with the present or the Kingdom of God? Using Pascal's wager, your existence will not change in the slightest, and the point of trying to understand Jesus' experiences will be lost on you completely.


:thumbup:


That's awesome stuff Ravus :thumbup:

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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: it stars saddam]
    #6679527 -

it stars saddam said:
Imagine that when you die, you are sent into an eternity of hellfire, unless you are an atheist. If you believe in any gods, you go to hell. If you are an atheist, you just die; your consciousness no longer exists. Wouldn't you rather believe that there's not a God, just in case?

Is this any more ridiculous than Pascal's original wager? If so, why?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal%27s_wager#Explanation


Yes it is more ridiulous as it is even less relevant to our reality than Pascal's. Pascal's was derived from spirituality and underlying human goodness; yours is merely linked to fear of hell and suffering, nothing more.


--------------------
let yourself be silently drawn by the stronger pull of what you really love

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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: mr_kite]
    #6680583 -

mr_kite said:
it stars saddam said:
Imagine that when you die, you are sent into an eternity of hellfire, unless you are an atheist. If you believe in any gods, you go to hell. If you are an atheist, you just die; your consciousness no longer exists. Wouldn't you rather believe that there's not a God, just in case?

Is this any more ridiculous than Pascal's original wager? If so, why?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal%27s_wager#Explanation


Yes it is more ridiulous as it is even less relevant to our reality than Pascal's. Pascal's was derived from spirituality and underlying human goodness; yours is merely linked to fear of hell and suffering, nothing more.


Haha, and Pascal's Wager isn't entirely dependent on fear? That's what Pascal's Wager is all about; he's saying that you might as well believe in God (that is, the Judeo-Christian God) because there is a chance that he exists (a chance equivalent to that of the Easter Bunny's existence), and if he does, you're going to suffer for having not believed in him.

And what evidence have you for this "underlying human goodness," and what relevance does it have to this thread or Pascal's Wager?

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Re: Pascal's Wager from an Atheistic Perspective [Re: it stars saddam]
    #6680640 -

it stars saddam said:
Imagine that when you die, you are sent into an eternity of hellfire, unless you are an atheist. If you believe in any gods, you go to hell. If you are an atheist, you just die; your consciousness no longer exists. Wouldn't you rather believe that there's not a God, just in case?

Is this any more ridiculous than Pascal's original wager? If so, why?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal%27s_wager#Explanation


It's the equivalent counterpart to Pascal's Wager. The idea of believing in "God just in case" seems somewhat absurd. If you're not a genuine believer in "God," wouldn't He, an Omniscient being, see through the deception? Wouldn't He know that you're only "believing" in order to avoid eternal hellfire?

I think it's foolish to try and gamble on "God"-- whether He exists or doesn't exist is irrelevant to this life, at least for me. If He exists, the universe is the same as it is now. If He does not exist, life goes on the same way that it has for millenia.

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