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Invisibleagar
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SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER * 3
    #3982155 - 03/28/05 11:18 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)



All the time, I see numerous questions about how long should I soak - WBS - or this or that grain, or various combinations of grains.

The function of soaking any grain, is to allow it to absorb it?s maximum natural capacity of moisture, without germinating the seed, or allowing it to rot.

12 hours works sometimes, 24 hours works, so does 36 hours.

The point of this post is - TIME isn?t all that important.

The amount of moisture absorbed by the grains - IS.

HOW YOU CAN TELL WHEN WBS/GRAINS HAVE ABSORBED MAXIMUM MOISTURE.

As any dry WBS/grain absorbs moisture, it expands in size. When it STOPS expanding, it has absorbed it?s approximate maximum natural moisture capacity. Some grains absorb moisture much faster than others, due to the type, and hardness of their hull, as well as the size of individual grains.

Naturally, mixtures of differing WBS/grains in the same soak container, expand at differing rates. A general rule of thumb is that all dry WBS/grains - as they absorb moisture - expand in size 20 to 30 percent . Then stop, because they are fully hydrated .

WHAT THIS MEANS IS: If you are going to soak WBS/grains to hydrate them.

Fill a container 2/3rds, to ? full of the dry WBS/grain, then add enough water to cover them. Then watch the WBS/grain mixture over time (inspect after 5 or 6 hours). If you only added enough water to just cover the WBS/grains, you will note - as they expand. The WBS/grains will enlarge, pushing itself up above the previous surface water level in the container. Add more water, so the WBS/grains remain submerged (exclusive of floaters).

Once the WBS/grain has completely stopped expanding. It has reached its approximate natural moisture retention capacity. Soaking it longer, does no harm. So long as it doesn?t germinate, begin to badly ferment, or rot.

SO, THERE YOU HAVE IT.

THE ANSWER TO THE OFTEN ASKED PROVERBIAL QUESTION OF HOW LONG TO SOAK WBS/GRAINS IS?????..
NO SET TIME.

SOAK, (AT LEAST)--- UNTIL THE WBS/GRAIN COMPLETLY STOPS EXPANDING (which generally ranges from 12 to 36 hours under normal room temperature conditions).

Experience has taught me this rule of thumb.

By filling a soak container 2/3rds to ? full of dry WBS/grains, then adding water enough to almost fill the container. Once the WBS/grain content has expanded to the point the container is nearly FULL & the content stops expanding any appreciable amount. It is at or very near to being fully hydrated. However, I allow it to soak it a few hours longer, to insure it is.

LEARN TENACITY - HAVE PATIANCE.
WITHOUT IT - YOU WILL NOT SUCCED AT THIS HOBBY.
]


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Offlinepsilocyben
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: agar]
    #3982387 - 03/28/05 11:54 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

way to be proactive agar-
your time was not spent in vain as i am sure that this will answer more than one person's question.

i was not blessed with patience, although, i must say that i have acquired a taste for it.

thanks


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: psilocyben]
    #3982417 - 03/28/05 11:59 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Lol at final answer. You know you'll get asked the same question again in a few days...he he


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Invisibletahoe
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: RogerRabbit] * 1
    #3982552 - 03/29/05 12:17 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

well too bad i soaked for 18 hours and my seed didnt suck up shit.


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Invisibleagar
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: psilocyben]
    #3982654 - 03/29/05 12:34 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

psilocyben said:
way to be proactive agar-
your time was not spent in vain as i am sure that this will answer more than one person's question.

i was not blessed with patience, although, i must say that i have acquired a taste for it.

thanks




Successful cultivation is based on a degree of knowledge, ability, circumstance, means & art. Normally, no two cultivation circumstance are identical. Meaning, everyone?s circumstance differs to the degree - what works for one person, doesn?t for another. Which creates inherent difficulties in answering individuals questions.

Just like this topic. Some say soak, others say soak - then simmer. I am a believer in - simple - is better & the less labor & steps involved - the better. Soaking - by itself - works for me. Soaking, then simmering works for others.

The object is to get the moisture content of WBS/Grains OPTIMAL

To dry, colonization is slow, often stalls & stops. To wet, colonization slows, stalls & bacterial type contamination often sets in.

The ART of the matter is FINDING WHAT WORKS FOR YOU - IN YOUR INDIVIUAL CIRCUMSTANCE. Even though the method may differ from others, or even the majority.

With soaking alone, to short a soak results in to dry a mix. With a soak & simmer, often grains burst open, get to wet, or result in a mix with starch/sludge in it.

The art is finding a method - you can succeed - with.

Both work.

Sadly - some do not have the patiance to experiment & find out - for themselves - what works for them. Then rely on "questionable" methods & fail.


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Invisibleidiotek

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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: agar]
    #3982690 - 03/29/05 12:41 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

i've PC'd popcorn kernels and had them soak up a LOT of water, and then made jars right afterward.. had ready-to-noc jars without having to wait for soaking after like 2 hours tops.. not including wait-time for the cooling off afterward..

they also worked very well and colonized quickly/normally..

would this leech any nutrients out of the substrate?


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OfflineStrange_Design
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: tahoe]
    #3982701 - 03/29/05 12:42 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

then you have some weird seed tahoe ^^, and i would like to fully endorse agar's notions here, used much the same, for a long while and it always comes out right.

perfect description, sometimes noted measures, like 2/3 then expansion. are better than just soak for 24 etc. having something to look at, and look for, really helps someone who might be new at doing this.

nice way to put it and will help many i am sure.

well done..


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Invisibleagar
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: tahoe]
    #3982798 - 03/29/05 12:56 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

tahoe said:
well too bad i soaked for 18 hours and my seed didnt suck up shit.




:eek: SHIT.......... :grin:

You are supposed to soak the seed in  :tongue2:WATER :tongue2:, not SHIT :smirk:

......... :wink: :grin:


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OfflineShortyMcAffy
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: agar]
    #3983870 - 03/29/05 04:03 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

agar what do you most commonly use to spawn. From the looks of it you like WBS, is this what you have found to be best for you?


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Invisibleagar
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: ShortyMcAffy]
    #3983929 - 03/29/05 04:19 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

SPAWN. It depends on cost, availability & what is on hand (at the moment). I generally stick with plain old WBS (Bird Basics Brand @ PetSmart 40lbs @ $8).

If you intend to use a grain as substrate. 60 / 70% WBS 30 / 40% RYE.

H/poo (weathered)& pasturized is prefered substrate. At least - at the moment - until I can get compost situated & going.


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OfflineShortyMcAffy
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: agar]
    #3983987 - 03/29/05 04:33 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Once the snow melts in my area, Im heading to my neighbors house and getting all of the horseshit i can. They have had horses for as long as I can remember so that means so dank horseshit should be around.


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Invisibleagar
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: ShortyMcAffy]
    #3984014 - 03/29/05 04:39 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

:thumbup: :wink:


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InvisibleMrMaddHatter
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: agar]
    #3984037 - 03/29/05 04:50 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

agar said:
LEARN TENACITY - HAVE PATIANCE.
WITHOUT IT - YOU WILL NOT SUCCED AT THIS HOBBY.
]




Patience is the secret to it all :crazy2: :thumbup:


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Invisibleagar
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: agar]
    #3996341 - 03/31/05 06:41 PM (11 years, 8 months ago)

BUMP....  :wink:


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OfflineMushroomFriend
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: agar]
    #4016023 - 04/05/05 07:47 AM (11 years, 8 months ago)

:lol:


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InvisibleDK1
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER *DELETED* [Re: agar]
    #4021500 - 04/06/05 02:05 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Post deleted by DK1

Reason for deletion: I want to delete all my posts



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Offlineonetime
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: DK1]
    #4032831 - 04/09/05 01:10 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

i thiught that soaking was for the germination of the endo spores so that they will be weaker in the pressure cooker and die and that simmering was to add moisture as that is when they crack and the insides get nice and moist


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Invisibleagar
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: onetime]
    #4032851 - 04/09/05 01:18 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Besides hydration, SOAKING does germinate endospores. Then, PC'ing kills the bastards.


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Offlinescatmanrav
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: onetime]
    #4032860 - 04/09/05 01:21 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

A soak helps with bacteria I think. I've recently been not soaking with a few batches, just simmering slow to get water content up or soaking in water rasied to a boil for a few hours and then simmering some more to finish getting water in..really very little contam rate...slightly higher then normal but I may have also PCed a batch a little less or something. No molds though, all bacteria.

A simmer shouldnt crack to many of the grains...personally, I like a few grains cracked though which I cant seem to get with soaking..even 48 hours...so I simmer too..soaked just didnt have enough water for me. Soaking DEFINATLY adds water though, along with germinating bacteria, and for some, this is enough.


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Offlinelordoftheshroomz
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Re: SOAKING WBS - GRAINS & TIMES - FINAL ANSWER [Re: agar]
    #4032872 - 04/09/05 01:26 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

agar said:
Then, PC'ing kills the bastards.



:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:
for some reason that jus made me laugh


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Amazon Shop for: ½ Pint Jars, Agar, Pressure Cooker, Rye Grain, Wild Bird Seed

Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics >> Mushroom Cultivation

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