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Offlinedoc34
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WBS exploded Grains= possible solution to problem?
    #2889269 - 07/14/04 01:25 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Ok,first,I have been using "Penningtons" brand WBS from wally world and I have had outstanding results with it.

A few weeks ago,I decided to purchase some "Higgins"brand WBS from my local feed store,(Just to try something different) and I had way too many exploded grains and the mycelium was struggling really hard trying to colonize it and it resulted into a 3 week period to reach 100% colonized.Compared to the "store"bought which does it in less than 10 days!
Everytime I purchase grains(WBS,corn,Millet)from  the feed stores this happens,but everytime I purchase from a department or pet store it works perfect everytime.

Conclusion:

Grains purchased from a department store or a pet shop have been stored in storage bins(silo's)Processed at the plant,stored in warehouses,transported to the department/pet store,then stock rooms,then they set on the store shelf for how long who knows.Not to mention being transported to all of these different places and stores in hot trucks.
These grains have a lower moisture content(drier)because of this,sounds reasonable.Plenty of time to dry out!
The grains from your feed stores are processed at the factory and make one stop,yup feed store,which bags it up on site(as compared to being processed at the manufacturer)and usually do not set as long as the other department store,pet shop stuff does,therefore it is way more fresher and the moisture content would be higher,thus resulting in exploded grains,just as if you cooked them too long.

If you are having problems with exploding grains-try and air dry the grains for a day or two to reduce the moisture content before you try to implement the Tek you use and see if that doesn't improve your results----It has mine!

I took what was left of the "Higgins"brand and air dried it in the sun for 5 days and when I used it again(same tek)---yeah,it was perfect.


I hope someone can benefit from this as I have!

Good luck

:cool: :thumbup:


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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: WBS exploded Grains= possible solution to problem? [Re: doc34]
    #2889759 - 07/14/04 03:12 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

You should test this theory of yours by drying both batches in the oven and determining the moisture content this way.


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Offlinedoc34
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Re: WBS exploded Grains= possible solution to problem? [Re: Anno]
    #2889970 - 07/14/04 03:55 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

I can do that.But my methods may not be accurate enough to provide the correct info(scales)I'm sure I could give a relatively close measurement,but,just being close,would alter the results significantly,I can still give it zap and see what I come up with though.
I'll have to get more WBS.So give me a couple of days and I can get my results to post.I have too much going on right now,at the moment.


If the grains are simmered for 30 minutes-they will soak up as much as they can before they burst(hopefully none)simmering longer = exploded grains(more moisture).
If there is bursting,just reducing the simmer time would result in less exploded kernels.
If the grains are fresh(higher moisture content)and we simmered them for 30 minutes,there will be alot of exploded Grains,if we reduced the simmer time,there would still be exploded grains(if the grains do in fact hold more moisture),so buy air drying them before use would bring the moisture level down(drier),so that when we simmered,less exploded grains.


Do this sound like a possibilty though?

Or am I just high?

Like I said,when I dried it out it worked perfect-100% colonized in 9 days.Same prep,same tek.


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Anonymous

Re: WBS exploded Grains= possible solution to problem? [Re: doc34]
    #2889999 - 07/14/04 04:00 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

i just soak my WBS in water for 12-24 hours. comes out perfect every time.


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Offlinedoc34
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Re: WBS exploded Grains= possible solution to problem? [Re: ]
    #2890138 - 07/14/04 04:30 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

So do I VVVV

rinse it well
let it soak overnight(12-24)
rinse
simmer for 30 minutes
rinse while hot to remove any 'gel' that may have formed
drain for 20 minutes(covered with cling wrap to retain moisture on top layer).
mix it up real good(just in case some of the top layer dried out)
load into jars(tyvek,disc w/polyfill,ring)
pc at 15psi for 90 minutes
remove once pressure has dropped and shake them good
let cool overnight(12 hrs approx)
innoculate with liquid innoculant(karo 2 tsp-100mlh2o)

I have never had a problem except when I buy from the feed stores (fresher grains=higher moisture content)


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Anonymous

Re: WBS exploded Grains= possible solution to problem? [Re: doc34]
    #2890337 - 07/14/04 05:12 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

i don't simmer.


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Offlinedoc34
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Re: WBS exploded Grains= possible solution to problem? [Re: ]
    #2890374 - 07/14/04 05:21 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

cool,I'm glad it works that way for ya :thumbup:

Thats what this forum is about personal experience,fact,and opinion :cool:

Thats why were here to share in those :thumbup:

I assume you add the water content prior to pc'ing correct?Or do you not add any water after soaking at all?

Would you please care to elaborate on your technique?


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Invisibleblink
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Re: WBS exploded Grains= possible solution to problem? [Re: doc34]
    #2890386 - 07/14/04 05:24 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

You soak overnight, but you simmer afterwards?
Why not one or the other?


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Offlinedoc34
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Re: WBS exploded Grains= possible solution to problem? [Re: blink]
    #2890753 - 07/14/04 06:57 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Soaking the grains allow for the endospores to germinate(just pc'ing them in their dormant state,some can and will survive the higher temps)and when you soak for 12-24 hours those endospores will germinate making them little bastards easier to kill,then when we pc and murder them,lol(I loved that line MAGASH!)

Just soaking doesn't provide the optimum moisture content.

So by simmering ,the grains are forced to obsorb water to their optimum amount with minimal exploding grains,You can also add the waterbefore pc'ing as I have seen results of other growers doing that with success,but,I am sorry,I would like to know how your results are when you add no h2o and you don't simmer?

From my understanding you would have to soak the grains up to 48-72 hours or more to get close to that optimum amount and by that time the grains have germinated and then your screwed.
Thats my experience on the "soak only" tek.


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Anonymous

Re: WBS exploded Grains= possible solution to problem? [Re: doc34]
    #2891246 - 07/14/04 09:54 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Just soaking doesn't provide the optimum moisture content.

ah... but it does.

you'll get good at telling when they've soaked long enough, but it's not an exact science and it doesn't need to be precise.

every time i make grain jars, all i do is soak overnight, rinse, drain, load in jars to the halfway point, and pc.

each jar comes out full of plump, unexploded, unsticky, shakable individual grain kernels. i'm quite proud of my spawn skills, but there's really nothing to it.  :grin:


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Offlinedoc34
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Re: WBS exploded Grains= possible solution to problem? [Re: ]
    #2891590 - 07/15/04 12:32 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

i'm quite proud of my spawn skills, but there's really nothing to it.   




You should be  :thumbup:

But simmering has been shown to be a viable option VVV
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat...rt=1#Post866271
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat-Number-2825503.html
:cool: :thumbup:

Edit=I forgot the link


Edited by doc34 (07/15/04 12:44 AM)


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InvisibleATWAR
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Re: WBS exploded Grains= possible solution to problem? [Re: doc34]
    #2891894 - 07/15/04 01:56 AM (12 years, 4 months ago)

I don't see how going through the extra work to remove moisture from the grain just to add it back helps to prepare it properly. You should simply adjust your cooking time. But if it works, it works...

Simply soaking WBS proved to be enough for me as well. It is a "dirty" grain IMO, I am an advocate of rye use...


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Re: WBS exploded Grains= possible solution to problem? [Re: ATWAR]
    #2893320 - 07/15/04 02:26 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

I don't see how going through the extra work to remove moisture from the grain just to add it back helps to prepare it properly 





Well,I couldn't use it because it kept exploding the grains,so,I air dried it,to reduce the moisture content and it works perfect.

The only theory that I can think of is as follows:

take a fresh grain of corn(prepared as outlined in this thread)simmer and pc=exploded grain of corn
take a dried grain of corn and repeat the process,simmer and pc=perfect

Does that seem logical?

Quote:

I am an advocate of rye use...





I am too,its one of the ingredients in the WBS :tongue:

:cool: :thumbup:


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Re: WBS exploded Grains= possible solution to problem? [Re: doc34]
    #2893556 - 07/15/04 03:39 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

I understand the logic for your method, I just don't see why you couldn't soak or simmer the grain for a shorter period instead of drying it out. In any case, I know it works, I have seen your results... They oysters especially loved it and I was rather impressed...


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Offlinedoc34
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Re: WBS exploded Grains= possible solution to problem? [Re: ATWAR]
    #2893704 - 07/15/04 04:43 PM (12 years, 4 months ago)

You can do that too,but I'm lazy,lol.

But,my whole point really was that if you have exploding grains it maybe that you are purchasing a fresher product as compared to an older(drier)product,trying to save money.Most feed stores sell their products cheaper than wal-mart and they move them alot faster.Wal-Mart brands/pet stores brands set forever until someones comes along and says" oh yeah might as well get that while I'm here and I wont have to go to the feed store".

Just like the name of this post says "possible solution to problem"it is open to discussion,and your feed back is greatly appreciated,I just had a thought and posted it.

Speaking of oysters-They like the cherry shavings as they are coming around to be about colonized now.I must update.Thanks for reminding me.


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Amazon Shop for: ½ Pint Jars, Rye Grain, Scales, Wild Bird Seed

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