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Offlineshaggy101
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Registered: 08/17/00
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Last seen: 3 years, 8 months
where does sorrow dwell?
    #2453612 - 03/20/04 07:04 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

well as far as dualism goes I dont really see good and evil
but I do see love and hate

hate when fire is set, a burning quick reaction
that can go into slow bitterness
and love, the ability to see with eyes of truth

yet what the fuck is sadness?

a emotion brought on buy pain

its gray though
like if im sad, it can turn into despair and anger and work its way to hate
yet it can also strengthen me to love
by showing me how much I care
and revealing more truth than I feel I can handle

like they say "there beauty was increased by sorrow"
the pain
and sorrow made the outcome something more desirable

yet we wouldnt choose sorrow..would we?..do we?
I think im in love with her sometimes
digging warm ageless claws into me

i dont get it


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Invisiblepsyka
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Registered: 06/09/03
Posts: 1,652
Re: where does sorrow dwell? [Re: shaggy101]
    #2453665 - 03/20/04 08:34 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

You want things in the outside world to be ok so that it is easier to find contentment and solitude within. Sorrow occurs when you understand you have no control over that variable in which case, you have a very small influence of control. Your behaviors can only react to it and your actions are just a reflection of who you really are.

You cannot find happiness outside of yourself. Its a conscious decision that you can learn to accept.

It is my personal and unargued theory that selfishness is ultimately the source of negative emotion. No offense, of course, we are only human :smile:

Peace


--------------------
As the life of a candle,
my wick will burn out.
But, the fire of my mind
shall beam into infinite.



Edited by psyka (03/20/04 08:37 AM)


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Invisiblekaiowas
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Re: where does sorrow dwell? [Re: shaggy101]
    #2453731 - 03/20/04 10:20 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

just keep in mind these are only my thoughts :grin:

Anger, worry, sorrow, frustration, boredom, and any other negative emotions are caused by you, not what happens externally.  Normally when you feel any of these emotions it is because you have an addiction.

What I mean by addiction is it is any desire that makes you upset or unhappy if it is not satisfied.  Addictions (or emotionally back demands) being out fear of not being fulfilled. Addictions bring out jealousy and paranoia that someone or something make take away anything that provides fulfillment. boredom comes when you aren't trying to make progress towards your demands.  Anger arises when we can't control the situation (as in when someone disagrees with your opinion).  You have anxiety when you are worried and fearful about what's happening(if that makes sense :wink:). Overall it is unhappiness when the external world doesn't supply us with whatever demand we want.

"In life, you win some, and you lose some"

This is how life works, and you may say "so what?"  If you think about this for a second you may realize that if you can't control what externally happens, then feeling bad about what happens isn't really necessary.  now I'm not saying suffering doesn't have a use, I think it does, and I will get to that.  Because in life "you win some and you lose some" you may also realize how useless it is to think that trying to change the people and the things outside of your mind as a means to become happy.  It's because life will never provide us with all of our demands. now even half of our demands will be met. 

Now I'm not saying you can't be right, I'm not saying to repress your emotions, and I'm not saying you hsouldn't have desire.  Also I am not saying anything about extreme situations either, such as lack of food, shelter, or health, death, etc.  We can keep all of that, after all it is apart of the experience.  What I am saying is that instead of demanding to happen, prefer it to happen instead.  If we make it so we prefer things to happen rather than an emotional backed demand of your version of the way things should be, you will start to see negative emotions more as a misunderstanding or misinterpretation of the world.

In order to intellectualy realize this, it is important to accept the world as it is now. If you want to go do something about that you don't agree with in the world, by all means DO IT!!!  It's a part of you, don't ignore your feelings, confront and realize them. you can still disagree, but you don't have to feel angry or upset about it because you understand that you can't always control what externally happens. For the most part, you are responsible for how you feel. 

shouldn't we all have control of our emotions?  can't we change them??  I think we can, through focus. we can learn something in an instant, if there is enough focus. If you ever feel a negative emotion, realize that you are demanding something our of the world,  and then ask yourself.  "what would I want right now that would make me happy?"  the answer is your addiction.  The more you catch yourself the easier it is.  you can change it to a preference by repetition (that is, the more you catch yourself the more likely it'll be that the next time this comes around, you won't feel AS negative).  This is just one way of course.

Use your ego and rational mind as a way to use suffering instead of suffering using you.  everytime you suffer, see WHY you suffer, andm ost of the time, it can be changed.  when we suffer we learn do we not?

What do we all want?  to be happy!!!  In some shape or form, it's happiness that is the end.  realize, that happiness is also the means to that end.


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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Offlinefalcon
In the green

Registered: 04/01/02
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Re: where does sorrow dwell? [Re: shaggy101]
    #2453779 - 03/20/04 11:01 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

I think im in love with her sometimes
digging warm ageless claws into me


great metaphor, really captures the feeling


--------------------
Quote:

OrgoneConclusion said:
I have done it before and it never has an effect on the true believer so what is the point?




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OfflinePHARMAKOS
addict
Registered: 09/13/02
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Re: where does sorrow dwell? [Re: falcon]
    #2455420 - 03/20/04 09:19 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

what i find interesting is some kinds of sadness are kind of enjoyable
like i sometimes get into grey-mopey moods that i secretly enjoy and thus keep myself from getting out of
or like someitmes just lieing on the floor and indulging in self pity for a while is a good exercise
as long as you snap out of it
MARIJUANA IS A DRUG


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Offlinefalcon
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Registered: 04/01/02
Posts: 6,835
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Re: where does sorrow dwell? [Re: PHARMAKOS]
    #2455477 - 03/20/04 09:47 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Some kinds of sadness dredge up memories of joy lost or forgotten and you get to remember the joy and the loss.


--------------------
Quote:

OrgoneConclusion said:
I have done it before and it never has an effect on the true believer so what is the point?




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OfflineSquatting_Otter
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Registered: 02/13/04
Posts: 97
Loc: point no point
Last seen: 12 years, 7 months
Re: where does sorrow dwell? [Re: shaggy101]
    #2455656 - 03/20/04 11:04 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

are you guys serious?


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InvisibletrendalM
point of inflection
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Re: where does sorrow dwell? [Re: Squatting_Otter]
    #2455992 - 03/21/04 01:40 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Please read the forum rules...


--------------------
You're here because you know something.
What you know you can't explain,
But you feel it;
You've felt it your entire life.
That there's something wrong with the world.
You don't know what it is, but it's there....
Like a splinter in your mind...
Driving you mad.


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OfflineSquatting_Otter
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Registered: 02/13/04
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Last seen: 12 years, 7 months
Re: where does sorrow dwell? [Re: trendal]
    #2456829 - 03/21/04 10:58 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

???


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: where does sorrow dwell? [Re: Squatting_Otter]
    #2457115 - 03/21/04 01:27 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

What part of that didn't you understand?


--------------------
You're here because you know something.
What you know you can't explain,
But you feel it;
You've felt it your entire life.
That there's something wrong with the world.
You don't know what it is, but it's there....
Like a splinter in your mind...
Driving you mad.


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OfflineSquatting_Otter
Freedom Code

Registered: 02/13/04
Posts: 97
Loc: point no point
Last seen: 12 years, 7 months
Re: where does sorrow dwell? [Re: trendal]
    #2457124 - 03/21/04 01:29 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

well, I asked them if they were serious. An honest question. Is this a joke or not? And then you stepped in and told me to read the rules.. this suggests that I am breaking the rules. This makes me go

???


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InvisibletrendalM
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Registered: 04/17/01
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Re: where does sorrow dwell? [Re: Squatting_Otter]
    #2457131 - 03/21/04 01:31 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Yes, they are serious. You will know if someone is making a joke here.


--------------------
You're here because you know something.
What you know you can't explain,
But you feel it;
You've felt it your entire life.
That there's something wrong with the world.
You don't know what it is, but it's there....
Like a splinter in your mind...
Driving you mad.


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Offlineshaggy101
Male

Registered: 08/17/00
Posts: 1,816
Loc: ..still waiting for godot
Last seen: 3 years, 8 months
Re: where does sorrow dwell? [Re: trendal]
    #2475850 - 03/26/04 06:21 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Psyka- I agree with you ...is love selfish?

PHARMAKOS-
Exactly,
but the promblem comes for me that I may feel a litte enjoyment in being blue, but I have a deep powerful love(lust?)
for sorrow
and I am speaking of not just being a little depressed or sad.. but heart breaking, oath making sorrow.
It is engaged in a internal conflict with my love of love and happiness  :smile:

falcon- thanks,
and I think you said it.
sorrow is the missing feeling you feel when you remember happiness
alone it can be negative
but its not alone it is with you and you can see that it is part of this world to experience it... it is just so hard to see that it will lead you to joy and new found happiness
when it can also lead you to hate and biterness.

kaiowas-you sound like a buddhist :sun:

squating otter-im not sure I understand what you meant
but trendal may have answered it

Trendal- nice quote :grin:


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Offlineshaggy101
Male

Registered: 08/17/00
Posts: 1,816
Loc: ..still waiting for godot
Last seen: 3 years, 8 months
Re: where does sorrow dwell? [Re: kaiowas]
    #2475897 - 03/26/04 07:05 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Anger, worry, sorrow, frustration, boredom, and any other negative emotions are caused by you, not what happens externally.




This is something I have been facing up to lately, and trying to remember in life moments that it is my choice to react as I wish to the external world....I control my feelings, but that doesnt mean I think its unhealthy to at times let your emotions control you.

Quote:

What I mean by addiction is it is any desire that makes you upset or unhappy if it is not satisfied. Addictions (or emotionally back demands) being out fear of not being fulfilled. Addictions bring out jealousy and paranoia that someone or something make take away anything that provides fulfillment. boredom comes when you aren't trying to make progress towards your demands. Anger arises when we can't control the situation (as in when someone disagrees with your opinion). You have anxiety when you are worried and fearful about what's happening(if that makes sense ). Overall it is unhappiness when the external world doesn't supply us with whatever demand we want.

"In life, you win some, and you lose some"

This is how life works, and you may say "so what?" If you think about this for a second you may realize that if you can't control what externally happens, then feeling bad about what happens isn't really necessary. now I'm not saying suffering doesn't have a use, I think it does, and I will get to that. Because in life "you win some and you lose some" you may also realize how useless it is to think that trying to change the people and the things outside of your mind as a means to become happy. It's because life will never provide us with all of our demands. now even half of our demands will be met.
 




I see the reasons for my emotions, and after the emotion is ran its course I make adjustments accordingly...
yet seeing this leaves me with
1. the knowledge of what I need in this world to be happy with me.. my addictions as you say
2. the understanding that there is a "me" seperate from the conditions and circumstances of the world outside of me.

who dwells in this world
the me inside  ...the me who gets poked by sticks ..or both?
finding happiness within myself
is for me- to understand, and judge myself..if I am satisfied ..so be it
if not
where do I search to find the happiness..the assurance that I am who I think I am and want to be?
within?
in the world outside I can see the fruits of my being
and understand the source
better from contemplating the effect.

in other words I agree but cannot be completely happy within
until I see an end to conscious/sub-conscious effects that are not in unison with me yet are within my control.

Quote:

Now I'm not saying you can't be right, I'm not saying to repress your emotions, and I'm not saying you hsouldn't have desire. Also I am not saying anything about extreme situations either, such as lack of food, shelter, or health, death, etc. We can keep all of that, after all it is apart of the experience. What I am saying is that instead of demanding to happen, prefer it to happen instead. If we make it so we prefer things to happen rather than an emotional backed demand of your version of the way things should be, you will start to see negative emotions more as a misunderstanding or misinterpretation of the world.

In order to intellectualy realize this, it is important to accept the world as it is now. If you want to go do something about that you don't agree with in the world, by all means DO IT!!! It's a part of you, don't ignore your feelings, confront and realize them. you can still disagree, but you don't have to feel angry or upset about it because you understand that you can't always control what externally happens. For the most part, you are responsible for how you feel.





you worded that perfectly :cool:

 
Quote:

Use your ego and rational mind as a way to use suffering instead of suffering using you. everytime you suffer, see WHY you suffer, andm ost of the time, it can be changed. when we suffer we learn do we not?

What do we all want? to be happy!!! In some shape or form, it's happiness that is the end. realize, that happiness is also the means to that end. 




that is a very cool thought!
happiness seems to be our natural state, but as hard as it is to see it
sorrow can- if you choose to- strengthen happiness
showing you who you are in the proccess

This post has helped me see my life a little clearer
and although I still cannot say I completely understand my love of sorrow and where it will lead me,
I can say once again I see beyond it
and that it could be no other way for me
:heart:


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