Home | Community | Message Board


SoulSpeciosa Kratom
Please support our sponsors.

Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics >> Advanced Mycology

Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: Original Seeds Store Buy CBD, Cannabis Seeds, Compare CBD   Amazon Papaver Somniferum, Scales

Jump to first unread post. Pages: 1 | 2 | Next >  [ show all ]
Invisibleambros
Stranger
Registered: 09/09/03
Posts: 79
what is psilocXX function in the mushroom?
    #2108696 - 11/15/03 10:23 AM (13 years, 10 months ago)

i dont know where to post, but it stood mushroom science..

is it byproducts, protection or warfare against other fungi and bacteria, or is it against animals


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinedebianlinux
Myconerd - DBK
Male User Gallery

Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 12/09/02
Posts: 8,272
Loc: Over There
Last seen: 5 months, 10 days
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: ambros]
    #2108722 - 11/15/03 10:52 AM (13 years, 10 months ago)

some might argue that it was to attract and interest humans so that we would insure their continued survival. others might theorise that the mushrooms are a form of aliens and ingesting them causes a higher conscience like a human to jack into their "network" like a modem.
noone has come up with a decent, logical, scientific purpose.
I choose to simply take it for what it is. It is somehwat like questioning why oranges "choose" to taste good while lemons "choose" to taste sour.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflineDeeBo
Twister

Registered: 10/26/03
Posts: 103
Loc: Upstate
Last seen: 13 years, 7 months
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: debianlinux]
    #2108754 - 11/15/03 11:29 AM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Good answer :smile:


--------------------

Lost before found and now the world is upside down....Looked for the Earth and only found the MOON...Keep telling myself the trip will be over soon


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Invisiblemicro
bunbun has a gungun
Male User Gallery

Registered: 05/09/03
Posts: 7,532
Loc: Brick City
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: DeeBo]
    #2108965 - 11/15/03 02:08 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Maybe some animal liked to trip, so they'd eat the spores and then shit them out and then they'd grow in the shit? That's going out on a limb, though....

Honestly, it could have been for a lot of reasons....

Debian -- kind of interesting, I read somewhere that a subclass of 5HT2a receptors are responsible for the reward response associated with a new insight (a so-called "eureka" moment.) Just thought it was neat since mushrooms activate that receptor.

--
Micro


--------------------
Any research paper or book for free
(Avatar is Maxxy, a character by Mizzyam, RIP)


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibleAlienPrimate
Brachiator
Registered: 06/19/03
Posts: 110
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: micro]
    #2109043 - 11/15/03 02:44 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Could its mind altering effects be percieved as unpleasant by most animals that consume it (non-ruminants)? If so, a few bad trips might discourage animals from eating them and destroying their spores in their acidic stomachs. In this scenerio the drug would be "warfare" aginst animals that would consume it.

If so, mothernature may not have anticipated that a species of goofy, bipedal primates would actually LIKE the mind altering effects!

Just a thought.


--------------------
I said "no" to drugs but drugs just aint takin no for an answer!


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinemattch1
Monseur

Registered: 05/17/03
Posts: 126
Loc: WV
Last seen: 13 years, 21 days
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: AlienPrimate]
    #2109059 - 11/15/03 02:49 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

well, if one could picture being a slug, and trying to munch on a mushroom all day, it would become progressively more impossible every hour that passed..... logically...
~M


--------------------
Everything I ask is for informational purposes only. There is no truth to what i say. I am lying.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Invisiblemicro
bunbun has a gungun
Male User Gallery

Registered: 05/09/03
Posts: 7,532
Loc: Brick City
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: mattch1]
    #2109084 - 11/15/03 02:58 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Yeah -- I think I read somewhere that fish and higher animals have 5-HT receptors. I don't know about a slug, though.

--
Micro


--------------------
Any research paper or book for free
(Avatar is Maxxy, a character by Mizzyam, RIP)


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Invisibleshroomophile
ShroomitusFidelis
Male User Gallery

Registered: 08/20/02
Posts: 762
Loc: USA
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: ambros]
    #2109449 - 11/15/03 05:53 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

I think it acts as an antibiotic.I have a hard time keeping critters out of my beds so i don't think its to deter animals.


--------------------
Once the mighty oak,was a nut who held his ground.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisiblePapaverS
Madmin Emeritus?

Registered: 06/01/02
Posts: 26,880
Loc: Radio Free Tibet!
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: shroomophile]
    #2110830 - 11/16/03 05:11 AM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Interesting questions, and good answers!

Here's another take...

Evolution seems to be all about reproductive advantage, so it might have an adverse effect on predators and disease. This is what is theorized in caffeine and cannabinoids.

However, not all evolutionary changes have to have a clear benefit. Sometimes, genetic mutations may persist, and continue to mutate and evolve, within an organism, if they are simply not adverse to the reproductive strategy of the organism.

It may simply that the series of genetic mutations, that occurred in the species, over millions of years, to product the biopathways responsible for the production of these molecules, are part of a certain logical progression of mutation, but have no clear advantage.

However, that's a very boring answer... :wink:


--------------------


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflinefourHoDmt
overclock yourbrain

Registered: 04/26/03
Posts: 148
Last seen: 13 years, 4 months
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: Papaver]
    #2110946 - 11/16/03 07:38 AM (13 years, 10 months ago)

i think that they were put here purposefully by whatever entity engineered the universe :P


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinerave_propaganda
this guy
Registered: 07/23/03
Posts: 45
Loc: eastcoast
Last seen: 12 years, 5 months
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: fourHoDmt]
    #2120965 - 11/18/03 09:57 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Papaver, that's a good theory. ive never heard that before but it seems completely possible.


--------------------
reality is a crutch for those who can't handle drugs


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflineRandolph_Carter
НơĻ?ĢΉō

Registered: 06/14/00
Posts: 29,281
Loc: Shroomery B-list.
Last seen: 7 years, 4 months
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: Papaver]
    #2120998 - 11/18/03 10:19 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

I read a biology text on this once. :smile:  The function of secondary metabolites in plant (and probably fungi) is as a defensive measure.  The effect of said metabolites varies, but is generally a body-or mind- altering capacity.  Sometimes, these things get intresting to humans, hence drugs.  But i've never seen anything that had a diet of marijuana, bioactive mushrooms, poppies, etc.  So they're generally a defensive measure.  Doesn't really work on us cavemen tho.
Stay Frosty
R.C.


--------------------
"..all those molecules thrashing their kinky little tails, hot for destiny and the street."  Gibson


Nuke baby seals for Jesus!

(This has been a +1 production.)


Edited by Randolph Carter (11/18/03 11:14 PM)


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Invisibledeanofmean
mycophagous

Registered: 12/07/02
Posts: 2,017
Loc: PNW
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: Randolph_Carter]
    #2121104 - 11/18/03 11:05 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Randolph Carter said:
I read a bioloby text on this once. :smile:  The function of secondary metabolites in plant (and probably fungi) is as a defensive measure.  The effect of said metabolites varies, but is generally a body-or mind- altering capacity.  Sometimes, these things get intresting to humans, hence drugs.  But i've never seen anything that had a diet of marijuana, bioactive mushrooms, poppies, etc.  So they're generally a defensive measure.  Doesn't really work on us cavemen tho.
Stay Frosty
R.C. 




bioloby ? :confused: 


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflineRandolph_Carter
НơĻ?ĢΉō

Registered: 06/14/00
Posts: 29,281
Loc: Shroomery B-list.
Last seen: 7 years, 4 months
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: deanofmean]
    #2121124 - 11/18/03 11:13 PM (13 years, 10 months ago)

biology...so i can't type. leave me and my crippled fingers alone, you nasty hobbitish thing you!
Stay Frosty.
(i hope it DOES bite your toeses)
R.C.


--------------------
"..all those molecules thrashing their kinky little tails, hot for destiny and the street."  Gibson


Nuke baby seals for Jesus!

(This has been a +1 production.)


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Invisiblemicro
bunbun has a gungun
Male User Gallery

Registered: 05/09/03
Posts: 7,532
Loc: Brick City
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: Randolph_Carter]
    #2121468 - 11/19/03 01:44 AM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Honestly, I think that's probably the most likely scenario, but it's really hard to generalize things like that.

Tryptamine, however, like you said, often produces secondary metabolites with a protective function against insects or livestock -- this has been studied (see below) in many different types of DMT containing plants.  This doesn't nessecarily mean that psilocybin is, though -- it would certainly make sense, but it is a different molecule and plants and fungi obviously aren't related.  The fact that it is produced mostly in the fruitbodies, though, seems to hint that it's probably some sort of defense mechanism (unless maybe for spore dispersal,) along with the fact that it's only prevalent in the fungi.  Since nobody has found out its exact purpose, though, it's impossible to rule out either spontaneous mutation or another possible role in the lifecycle, such as detoxification or even spore dispersal via animals or insects.  I think the idea of symbiosis makes sense, however, especially in the dung dwellers, because if the spores are ingested it will have a head-start colonizing the substrate.  Besides, the cows probably still ingest the spores while grazing, and in all reality eating the shrooms would most likely have a negative impact on the survival of the animal.  It should also certainly be benificial for the fungi not to be eaten until sporulation is complete.  I still like the idea of cows tripping, however....  :grin:

Not all secondary metabolites are antibiotics, though, even in this very pathway in plants.  Here's some interesting info I had on my computer -- I think it's from Erowid, but I don't feel like looking for a link:

<><><><>

Secondary products were originally believed to play no role in plant physiology or ecological interactions, believing to be simply the result of the metabolic pressure of accumulation of primary products. The theory that these secondary products gave plants a selective advantage through protective devices and therefore developed as an evolutionary adaptation was suggested, the main failing being that it did not address compounds with seemingly little use or plants without much or any secondary metabolism. A third suggestion which tends to fall between these two is that the buildup of primary products did lead to new secondary products, which while they may not offer an advantage now, did at some point in the plants evolutionary history; plants which do not produce secondary products may simply have developed alternative modes of protection. This study supported the third theory indicating that few microorganisms produce alkaloids with pharmacological activity in animals, but do produce compounds with antibiotic and mycotoxic effects. Plants were similarly noted to create alkaloids with effects on organisms of a similar scale to themselves, animals and other plants, but had fewer compounds directed against microorganisms. Both examples pointed to fitness or evolutionary-based control of secondary metabolic production.

An extreme example of this chemical protection mechanism is in the glucosinolates, which are found in the vacuoles of some plants, and which include an indole form of glucosinolate. When plant tissue containing vacuoles with these compounds are damaged, the glucosinolates escape and are hydrolyzed into isothiocyanates, which have a toxic effect on most cells via alkylation reactions.

The toxic effect ("phalaris staggers") of Gramineae, as in the Phalaris genus noticed in ruminants such as sheep has been associated with their production of the indole alkaloids gramine, DMT, 5-MeO-DMT and bufotenine. Further studies on gramine in another Gramineae, barley lead to the finding that it could be found in especially high concentrations in the youngest leaves, where it had a negative effect on aphid population growth rates. Aphids of the species Rhopulosiphum padi L. and Schizaphis graminum were found to decrease their feeding behavior in the presence of higher concentrations of gramine in barley and were even found to have higher mortality rates when fed an artificial diet containing similar concentrations of gramine. Aphids known to feed off a variety of species were noted to choose low-alkaloid producing plants, while aphids with high species specificity were noted to ingest plants with higher levels of alkaloids, presumably as a modification which allows them to use the alkaloids in their own defense. This use of the plants secondary products goes one step beyond the typical evolution in parasitic organisms, that of formation of detoxification systems specific to the host organism.

To test the influence that tryptamine had on insect feeding and oviposition patterns, one study genetically transformed Nicotiana tabacum, a plant which does not normally contain the tryptophan decarboxylase enzyme, to produce tryptamine. Increased levels of tryptamine in these engineered plants were correlated with decreased whitefly pupae emergence and affected adult selection of leaves for feeding and oviposition in an inverse relationship.

Although Floss stated that it was difficult to generalize about the role that plant development plays in alkaloid biosynthesis, alkaloids found to have defensive characteristics are often found in the younger tissues of most plants as in these last two examples. Some alkaloids have been shown to be elicitable as well as developmentally regulated, such as in Camptotheca acuminata. In this species, tryptophan decarboxylase is regulated by two separate genes, one which appears to be expressed most often in young tissues, the second of which appears to only be expressed in tissues undergoing pathogen stress by fungal elicitors or methyl jasmonate (MeJa) stimulation.

The last role of indolous compounds considered here differs quite dramatically from that of the previous examples. It has been noted that some secondary products have a role in attraction of pollinators, and at least one example of this appears in the indole compounds, indole itself. In some of the Araceae during flowering, calorigen induces an increase in indole production at the same time as an increase in sensible heat in the male area of the flower. The combination of this increase in heat with the volatile nature of indole creates a smell which attracts insects and increases pollination rates.

<><><><>

Again, I think psilocybin being used as a defense mechanism is highly probable, but since noone has figured out its exact role (at least that I know of) the hypothesis is yet to be proven.

--
Micro   


--------------------
Any research paper or book for free
(Avatar is Maxxy, a character by Mizzyam, RIP)


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Invisibledeanofmean
mycophagous

Registered: 12/07/02
Posts: 2,017
Loc: PNW
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: Randolph_Carter]
    #2121577 - 11/19/03 02:30 AM (13 years, 10 months ago)

oh, you meant biology . :blush:
sorry, but "bioloby" sounds like a sierra club thingy . :lol: 


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflineJackal
Well Versed In Etiquette
 User Gallery

Registered: 10/16/02
Posts: 4,572
Last seen: 1 day, 13 hours
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: ambros]
    #2122096 - 11/19/03 09:57 AM (13 years, 10 months ago)

Does everything have to have a purpose? Maybe it's there because if it weren't, it would be somewhere else and you'd now be visting www.applery.com


--------------------


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlinedanelectro
Disenfranchised

Registered: 07/01/02
Posts: 211
Loc: Left of Oblivion
Last seen: 12 years, 1 month
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: Randolph_Carter]
    #2139134 - 11/27/03 01:19 AM (13 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

But i've never seen anything that had a diet of marijuana, bioactive mushrooms, poppies,




"Goats love it."
"Fowls eat it." Peter Tosh Legalize It


--------------------
We should really love each other, in peace and harmony. Instead we're fussing and fighting, like we ain't supposed to be.-Bob Marley
The people, the still sleeping mass which it was necessary to mobilize and its vanguard, the guerrillas.
-Che


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
OfflineRandolph_Carter
НơĻ?ĢΉō

Registered: 06/14/00
Posts: 29,281
Loc: Shroomery B-list.
Last seen: 7 years, 4 months
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: micro]
    #2139186 - 11/27/03 01:40 AM (13 years, 9 months ago)

Now, theres a possible use that should be testable by amature cultivators...Rig up a testing scenario that introduces known amounts of a fungal parasite to a psylocybin producing species and a non-producing species...because if i am correct, than a fully intact and functioning mycelial network does contain psyloXX compounds, but not to the same amount as the fruiting body...
Observe response of mycelial body of both types to introduction of pathogen.
So what are some fungal parasites?
Stay Frosty.
R.C.


--------------------
"..all those molecules thrashing their kinky little tails, hot for destiny and the street."  Gibson


Nuke baby seals for Jesus!

(This has been a +1 production.)


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Offlineask
apprentice
Registered: 11/11/03
Posts: 199
Loc: a special place
Last seen: 12 years, 3 months
Re: what is psilocXX function in the mushroom? [Re: Randolph_Carter]
    #2139328 - 11/27/03 02:41 AM (13 years, 9 months ago)

we all have a way to protect ourselves. shrooms use a type of poison. humans are complicated and choose to like whats not good for them. shooms realize most things wont fuck with them once they have a taste. its there natural "war tactic". like allways we have found a way to use something to our advantage/exploit.

this leads to more opinons,ideas and questions, but it could be a base thought to start with.


just a thought....


--------------------
without the bitter,the sweet is not as sweet.

wanting is good,actually it might be better than having-


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
Jump to top. Pages: 1 | 2 | Next >  [ show all ]

Shop: Original Seeds Store Buy CBD, Cannabis Seeds, Compare CBD   Amazon Papaver Somniferum, Scales

Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics >> Advanced Mycology

Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Proof that Mushrooms are Sensitive!
( 1 2 3 4 5 all )
shroomydan 17,742 95 11/13/10 01:41 AM
by linkamathingy
* Nutrients for Mushrooms MycoCat 3,689 8 11/12/03 06:23 AM
by fungulus
* Mushroom genome rwpride 2,777 19 05/30/05 06:42 PM
by pluteus
* *DELETED* Hefex78 1,840 13 12/05/03 04:04 PM
by mycofile
* Rock Mushrooms shroomydan 1,107 6 04/27/06 04:43 PM
by mycogirl
* Growing high content 4-HO-DPT/4-HO-DMT mushrooms.
( 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 all )
theshiftingwalls 27,479 147 09/29/05 06:05 PM
by ripper225
* links to mushroom science articles laughingdog 611 1 07/07/08 12:51 PM
by RogerRabbit
* Extraction methods for mushrooms? Godspeed 2,228 17 05/08/05 08:27 PM
by lovepalace

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: RogerRabbit, bodhisatta
2,071 topic views. 0 members, 3 guests and 3 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Toggle Favorite | Print Topic | Stats ]
Search this thread:
Vaposhop
Please support our sponsors.

Copyright 1997-2017 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.024 seconds spending 0.004 seconds on 18 queries.