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Making a deal with the Devil
    #14644588 -

I was listening to the song "The Devil Went Down to Georgia" the other day and started pondering this idea and theme of making a deal with the devil. The deal is almost always for one's soul. As if one's soul is safe unless they make a bet with the devil and lose, or trade the soul for a temporary luxury. The Devil usually lays out the rules and expectations, and like any good Vegas shark, tilts the odds in his favor.

Yet at the same time, the idea of getting into heaven is usually preceded by having lived a certain way. Completing the challenges in accordance with the rules God himself has laid out before us. Likewise the odds of living up to the standards is practically impossible. So, what's going on here? Does anyone else see more similarities than differences in the way we make deals for souls regardless of which side the deal is made with?


--------------------
Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: Kickle] * 1
    #14644603 -

This is sort of unrelated but your thread reminded me of it: My friend made a short film and in it a character meets God (in some alley in Rio de Janeiro). 

The character asks, "How does it feel to have created the world?"  God responds, I didn't create it.  I bought it ready-made."

"From who?"

"From the devil."



...God and Satan are two sides of the duality we're all stuck in.  Make no deals!


--------------------
“Strengthened by contemplation and study,
I will not fear my passions like a coward.
My body I will give to pleasures,
to diversions that I’ve dreamed of,
to the most daring erotic desires,
to the lustful impulses of my blood, without
any fear at all, for whenever I will—
and I will have the will, strengthened
as I’ll be with contemplation and study—
at the crucial moments I’ll recover
my spirit as was before: ascetic.”

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: Lion]
    #14644623 -

:sherlock:


--------------------
Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: Kickle]
    #14644674 -

A similarity is that they seem to believe that both have more power over their life than they do.

Edited by giza (06/20/11 07:06 PM)

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: giza]
    #14644707 -

yeah totally

do you agree or disagree with that belief?


--------------------
Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: Kickle]
    #14644731 -

I'm not too sure, I will have to think on it but as of now..

I don't believe the creator would really have any use for any one of us, but I do believe other beings may have use for us. As in he wouldn't really 'need' anything that we could do for him.
(If by God you mean the creator..)

But the question I get out of it is how would the devil be able to grant any wish that was asked? Without him being a 'god', unless he is a god but a lesser one than the creator(obviously)..

Edited by giza (06/20/11 07:45 PM)

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: giza]
    #14644778 -

whos this creator you speak of


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^v^

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: foliocb]
    #14644862 -

The mind that created all that is.

@Kickle

There are a few things that need to be answered before being able to answer that, like..

Who is the devil?
How powerful is the devil?
What is it's relationship with God? Or is the devil God?
What would I have to do to repay?

I would guess the common psychology of the question would be more like if another 'power' could grant you what you want whether the 'power' be 'good' or 'bad' would you take it?

But it would also be based on what you percieve the devil as.

So yeah alot of things run through my mind when trying to answer this question and since most cannot truly be answered for none of us truly know I would be at a 'stal'. (unless some of you are hiding something)

Edited by giza (06/20/11 07:54 PM)

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: giza]
    #14644976 -


Who is the devil?

I've always felt that the devil in me is the devil in you. And that's the definition I run with. No specifics set in stone.

What is it's relationship with God? Or is the devil God?

The Devil has always been God's counterpart as far as I know. In the book of Job the devil is portrayed as a sort of council to God, giving advice and posing questions. Advocate for the aspects that don't want to be seen. "devil's advocate"


--------------------
Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: Kickle]
    #14645067 -

Kickle said:
Does anyone else see more similarities than differences in the way we make deals for souls regardless of which side the deal is made with?


For me it all comes down to the law of attraction stuff. What you put out is what you get back. IMO, making a deal with the devil is just a way of saying, "Do bad and bad will comes back."

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: c0sm0nautt] * 1
    #14645133 -

My deal with the devil paid off big time and the returns have all been good. :shrug:

Devil is not the bad guy imo.:satansmoking:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: c0sm0nautt]
    #14645139 -

Or it could also mean nothing free is ever given there is always a price to pay whether it be now or later.
As in if you want something you will have to earn it one way or another, now or later.

Edited by giza (06/20/11 08:47 PM)

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: giza]
    #14645155 -

Yes, the God and the Devil could actually be 2 immortals that got bored one day and decided to mess with us.

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: Kickle]
    #14645265 -

Kickle said:
I was listening to the song "The Devil Went Down to Georgia" the other day and started pondering this idea and theme of making a deal with the devil. The deal is almost always for one's soul. As if one's soul is safe unless they make a bet with the devil and lose, or trade the soul for a temporary luxury. The Devil usually lays out the rules and expectations, and like any good Vegas shark, tilts the odds in his favor.

Yet at the same time, the idea of getting into heaven is usually preceded by having lived a certain way. Completing the challenges in accordance with the rules God himself has laid out before us. Likewise the odds of living up to the standards is practically impossible. So, what's going on here? Does anyone else see more similarities than differences in the way we make deals for souls regardless of which side the deal is made with?


If you based God's requirements for getting into heaven off of the ten commandments then I don't see the 'challenge' as 'practically impossible' its actually super easy






If you follow the NT Jesus said all that really matters is to love thy neighbor as you would love yourself

10 rules that really bare down to one rule is not hard at all...

where do people get this challenge from?? I hear this from many people don't see it.


--------------------
The Universe is not only queerer than we suppose, but queerer than we can suppose.
      J. B. S. Haldane

The quest of the absolute leads into the four-dimensional world.
Sir Arthur Stanley Eddington

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: Forever White Belt]
    #14645345 -

Quote:
where do people get this challenge from?? I hear this from many people don't see it.


Then it truly is a hard test to pass.

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: giza]
    #14645375 -

In my opinion actions aren't the only thing that you need to discipline (like the commandments), it is your mind also, a man can praise god with his lips but hate him in his thoughts.

Edited by giza (06/20/11 09:28 PM)

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: giza]
    #14645439 -

If you based God's requirements for getting into heaven off of the ten commandments then I don't see the 'challenge' as 'practically impossible' its actually super easy

Well I wouldn't know for sure what all is required. I don't really follow the Biblical teachings on any sort of heavenly reward. I have followed certain aspects as an experiment tho. But as far as I know, the 10 commandments is quite literally one of the smallest sections in the entire Bible in terms of what needs to be done in order to enter heaven.

still, even the 10 commandments I'd find extremely challenging. Have you never stolen? No torrents? Have you never neglected to keep the Sabath day holy? Have you never given your parents shit? You've never wanted something that another has? I mean, really?


--------------------
Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: Kickle]
    #14645510 -

Kickle said:
If you based God's requirements for getting into heaven off of the ten commandments then I don't see the 'challenge' as 'practically impossible' its actually super easy

Well I wouldn't know for sure what all is required. I don't really follow the Biblical teachings on any sort of heavenly reward. I have followed certain aspects as an experiment tho. But as far as I know, the 10 commandments is quite literally one of the smallest sections in the entire Bible in terms of what needs to be done in order to enter heaven.

still, even the 10 commandments I'd find extremely challenging. Have you never stolen? No torrents? Have you never neglected to keep the Sabath day holy? Have you never given your parents shit? I mean, really?


Yes, extremely difficult.

The part about stealing is extremely hard to percieve. Because the definition of stealing can be so different.

For example. (Came up with this quick because I have thought on that for a long time being brought up in christianity.)

Aren't we always 'stealing' because it all would belong to God, based on the bible. Nothing is technically ours because we didn't create it.
God created the land, the seeds, the trees.. the animals..
When we use 'his' land, are we not stealing?
When we pick the fruit off of his trees, are we not stealing?

- But from the another point of view. We do actually give it back by expending energy and the other forms of giving back.


Why I believe veganism is popular - based on not stealing.
Doesn't the meat of an animal belong to the animal?
So when we eat meat aren't we 'stealing'?
When we use it's skin isn't that stealing?

Edited by giza (06/20/11 09:48 PM)

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: Kickle] * 1
    #14645532 -

Kickle said:
Does anyone else see more similarities than differences in the way we make deals for souls regardless of which side the deal is made with?


Yes.

No terms. No reward. No deal for the immortal soul. Everything but. This kind of God you can vouch for and you can forget about the devil part :grin:

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Re: Making a deal with the Devil [Re: giza]
    #14645561 -

A Mormon guy I know, out of strange desperation, told me that he prayed to the Devil and said he could have what he wanted of his spirit if he could finally be genuinely happy in this life. Shortly thereafter, at midnight, his phone rang and the numbers were 666-666-6666.

It was the only time he had ever seen that number or received a call in such a weird manner. I thought he was full of shit until he showed me the number in his "missed calls" list. I was tripping at the time, so it made my skin crawl a bit, even if it's only a coincidence.


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