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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: Seuss]
    #8510877 -

Seuss said:
Quote:
It's obvious that you are letting your hatred of Bush cloud your view. It's ok to not like the guy...but this - going through the trouble of posting - just to spew your own brand of egotism and attempt to make Bush seem "stupid" is rather silly.


I changed the quote above, just a bit, to show the... um, bias... of your statement.  We are all fairly guilty of posting the many humorous stumblings of various politicians... I don't think anybody is picking on Obama more, or less, than any other elected schmuck.

It is interesting to see the vigor with which people defend their pet politicians.  Zappa has experienced this first hand, having been on the receiving end, after bashing Ron Paul.


the problem with this is that BUSH REALLY IS STUPID.

it's consistent with him. you don't have to hate him to know he sounds like a moron.


--------------------
praise "Bob"
did you mean shmooed-R.I.P.

"drought besets the mind, decay besets the man"-me

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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: rev 766]
    #8511052 -

rev 766 said:
Seuss said:
Quote:
It's obvious that you are letting your hatred of Bush cloud your view. It's ok to not like the guy...but this - going through the trouble of posting - just to spew your own brand of egotism and attempt to make Bush seem "stupid" is rather silly.


I changed the quote above, just a bit, to show the... um, bias... of your statement.  We are all fairly guilty of posting the many humorous stumblings of various politicians... I don't think anybody is picking on Obama more, or less, than any other elected schmuck.

It is interesting to see the vigor with which people defend their pet politicians.  Zappa has experienced this first hand, having been on the receiving end, after bashing Ron Paul.


the problem with this is that BUSH REALLY IS STUPID.




This keeps popping up and is so flagrantly false as to make me worry about the intellectual capacity of young people today.  It is true that you can get into Yale as a legacy.  You cannot get out of Yale as a legacy.  You cannot get a Harvard MBA as a legacy and you most definitely cannot be a fighter pilot as a legacy.  He doesn' have a gift for public speaking.  Big fucking deal. Why anyone would put such a premium on an essentially useless skill is so mind numbingly stupid as to beggar belief.  It is essentially glorified salesmanship.  What kind of a shmuck do you have to be to exalt a glorified salesman as some kind of genius.  Nevermind, I'll answer.  A complete shmuck.  Do not ever conflate a glib, facile speaking demeanor as anything more than it is.  Quality hucksterism.  Go ahead suckers, vote for the snake oil salesman.

Barry gives a nice prepared speech.  As an utterly empty suit he has no substance to draw on in an extemporaneous situation.  He needs his Mom to do his homework for him.  Pop quizzes kill him.


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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: trendal]
    #8511114 -

trendal, trendal, trendal... see Seuss's comment.

It is true that Bush mangles the English language from time to time. And yeah... after eight years of media scrutiny, there for sure is going to be a lot more of such manglings on record than there will be of eight months of Obama. Couple that with the fact that the media is completely in the tank for Obama and completely hostile towards Bush and yeah... you will have seen more Bushisms so far than Obamasms. How could it be otherwise?

But you aren't getting my point here.

First of all, Bush's handlers never tried to push Bush's speaking skills as one of his strong points, whereas Obama's acolytes and the press (but I repeat myself) never shut up about what a charismatic, compelling, inspiring orator the Obamessiah is. It's pretty much his only claim to fame. So watching him fumble around like a rummy for as long as he does on that video is like watching Michael Jordan tripping all over his own shoelaces for a full quarter of basketball. 

Secondly - as I pointed out and Seuss elaborated - this kind of trainwreck is qualitatively different from Bush's malapropisms. Obama's fumblings here go on forever.

Here Obama has either completely lost the thread of what he was going to say or (as some have suggested) has realized that the road down which he has embarked is going to make him look like a complete idiot if he actually finishes the thought the way he had intended, so he's brought himself up short and is frantically thinking on the fly how he needs to change course in order to extricate himself.

If this had been McCain, the press would have had this as front page news for days. CNN and MSNBC would be showing the clip every fifteen minutes, along with endless speculation that the old geezer was either suffering from early-stage Alzheimer's disease or maybe had had a mild stroke. But Obama gets a complete pass on it. How many of you had seen this clip on any TV channel even once before I posted it here? Answer - none of you.

Why am I not surprised?




Phred


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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: rev 766]
    #8511489 -

> the problem with this is that BUSH REALLY IS STUPID.

He managed to get elected... twice.  Regardless of the how, he played those cards well enough.  I'm not going to claim that he is the brightest candle in the box, but I think he rates at least average, and in my book, average isn't stupid (nor smart).  As far as presidents go, Bush Jr. is certainly on the low end of the stick.  However, extremely smart presidents (Carter *cough*) haven't faired well either.

I'm not a Bush apologist.  Personally, I don't care for him as a president (though I do respect his father).  I'm just trying to keep it real.


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Just another spore in the wind.

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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: Seuss]
    #8511525 -

Well of course my statement had bias...very few (if any) statements made with a political lean are unbiased. :smirk:

And no, I don't think anyone is picking on any politician more than any other. I also wasn't defending Obama...please read my post again.

I was merely pointing out the irony of what Phred was saying :wink:


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: Phred]
    #8511537 -

trendal, trendal, trendal... see Seuss's comment.

See my post above...

So watching him fumble around like a rummy for as long as he does on that video is like watching Michael Jordan tripping all over his own shoelaces for a full quarter of basketball.

That's a horrible comparison to make...making fun of Jordan like that... :smirk:

Here Obama has either completely lost the thread of what he was going to say or (as some have suggested) has realized that the road down which he has embarked is going to make him look like a complete idiot if he actually finishes the thought the way he had intended, so he's brought himself up short and is frantically thinking on the fly how he needs to change course in order to extricate himself.

So you're saying he's smarter than Bush, then? If Obama can see that what he is going to say is stupid, and Bush just goes ahead and says it...which do you think is the smarter of the two?


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: trendal]
    #8511613 -

Quote:
Phred said:
It's pretty much his only claim to fame.


Except of course his creation a grass-roots campaign structure that defeated what was considered for years to be the intuitive shoe-in nominee.  But, since that cuts against the grain of your one-dimensional portrait of Obama, you'll continue to disregard it as irrelevant.  Why am I not surprised?

Quote:
zappaisgod said:
It is true that you can get into Yale as a legacy.  You cannot get out of Yale as a legacy.  You cannot get a Harvard MBA as a legacy and you most definitely cannot be a fighter pilot as a legacy.


Bull. Shit.  Bullshit.


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I am become death, the destroyer of worlds.

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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: thedefone]
    #8511648 -

thedefone said:
Quote:
Phred said:
It's pretty much his only claim to fame.


Except of course his creation a grass-roots campaign structure that defeated what was considered for years to be the intuitive shoe-in nominee.  But, since that cuts against the grain of your one-dimensional portrait of Obama, you'll continue to disregard it as irrelevant.  Why am I not surprised?


How sweet that you think Barry created some kind of grass roots something in perhaps the most historically corrupt political arena in the nation, the Illinois Democrat Party.  Sweet but dumb.
Quote:
Quote:
zappaisgod said:
It is true that you can get into Yale as a legacy.  You cannot get out of Yale as a legacy.  You cannot get a Harvard MBA as a legacy and you most definitely cannot be a fighter pilot as a legacy.


Bull. Shit.  Bullshit.


Well, that's what we can count on you for, substantial rebuttals.  Can you even pilot a car yet?


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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: thedefone]
    #8511763 -

It's a substantial rebuttal for such an ignorant claim.  You reap what you sow. Your likening of a nationwide campaign to one city's political history is contemptible.  Go ahead and assert that just because a person is from a certain place that they automatically fit into your stereotypes and preconceptions.  After all, every German is a Nazi, the French are all assholes, and the Chinese all look alike.  Ignorant.  The fact is that he did win the nomination, and no matter how hard you try and twist facts with your insinuations of corruption, and dismissal of the accomplishment, you will not succeed.  Not with me. 

At least when I am in an argument I am capable of arguing the points in question, and not changing them in order to bolster my own weak position.  It's not going to fly with me.  Keep trying.


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I am become death, the destroyer of worlds.

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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: thedefone]
    #8511868 -

you know, i feel comfortable saying "bush is stupid" even though i know he must have some guile to get re-elected after his first four-year run of fucking up america and the middle east. oh, wait, it doesn't take that much intelligence to play off the public's fear and get reelected as a "war president". and i'm pretty sure he had folks running his campaign telling him what to basically say to keep the public in that mindset.

even so, i bet his speech writers cry at night.

and what the hell do you mean a legacy can't graduate? are you really that blind to the power that money and a name have in this country.

fighter pilot???????? did you forget about all that shit that came out about bush never actually fighting, or do you believe that was a lie?

while i admit that bush is partially intelligent to be one of the most evil men on the planet, if he's even human, and appeal to johnny bible thump and suzie church bake sale, nothing anyone came back with proved it.

and phred, what do you mean his fumblings go on forever? that clip is like 20 sec long and that doesn't happen that often. bush is consistent in his fumblings, and they would go on forever if we had to continue listening to him after this year. this thread seems to be a poor attempt to get people against obama. show us some evidence that he's truly worse than mccain and i'll think about your side. i really can't see that happening though.


--------------------
praise "Bob"
did you mean shmooed-R.I.P.

"drought besets the mind, decay besets the man"-me

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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: zappaisgod]
    #8512701 -

You're incorrect in saying that Yale is any harder to graduate from than your average state school. The quality of education at Yale stems from the faculty and available resources, not strenuous academic standards.

The hard part about an Ivy School education isn't graduating; it's getting into the school and then paying your loans after graduation.

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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: rev 766]
    #8512817 -

Quote:
rev 766 said:and what the hell do you mean a legacy can't graduate? are you really that blind to the power that money and a name have in this country.



YEAH ANYWAY!



Just look at Ted Kennedy.


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i finally got around to making a sig
revel in its glory and quake in fear at its might
grar.

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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: Mushmonkey]
    #8515886 -

Wow, just fucking wow.  And I bet you guys all think that with the proper training and vitamins you could be the Yankee Centerfielder.

Hey rev, he was a fighter pilot.  He flew the jets.  There is no denying that and there is no denying that it is entirely a meritocracy and most people couldn't do it no matter what training they got.  I'm sorry to burst your bubble but the man is demonstrably above average in intelligence.  He isn't me but he's way ahead of you.


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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: zappaisgod]
    #8515915 -

zappaisgod said:
Wow, just fucking wow.  And I bet you guys all think that with the proper training and vitamins you could be the Yankee Centerfielder.

Hey rev, he was a fighter pilot.  He flew the jets.  There is no denying that and there is no denying that it is entirely a meritocracy and most people couldn't do it no matter what training they got.  I'm sorry to burst your bubble but the man is demonstrably above average in intelligence.  He isn't me but he's way ahead of you.


wow, he went to flight school. that doesn't mean he ever saw combat, because he didn't.

if you can demonstrate to me some way that the country is better than when he took office, i'll believe he's not a complete fuck-tard.

he ignored clinton's outgoing plan to focus on al-qaida and kill osama, focusing instead on missile defense. so...that means if he wouldn't have fucked around and took advice from clinton, 9-11 probably would have never happened.

if that doesn't make him an idiot, i don't know what could. ignoring a chance to prevent a horrible, horrible tragedy, fucking brilliant. light years ahead of me or anyone.


--------------------
praise "Bob"
did you mean shmooed-R.I.P.

"drought besets the mind, decay besets the man"-me

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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: rev 766]
    #8516113 -

rev 766 said:
zappaisgod said:
Wow, just fucking wow.  And I bet you guys all think that with the proper training and vitamins you could be the Yankee Centerfielder.

Hey rev, he was a fighter pilot.  He flew the jets.  There is no denying that and there is no denying that it is entirely a meritocracy and most people couldn't do it no matter what training they got.  I'm sorry to burst your bubble but the man is demonstrably above average in intelligence.  He isn't me but he's way ahead of you.


wow, he went to flight school. that doesn't mean he ever saw combat, because he didn't.


I'm sorry, but he flew the jets.  MOST fighter pilots NEVER see combat.  That doesn't mean that the accomplishment of flying the jets is in anyway diminished.  It is a skill very few can even learn and the alleged idiot did it. 
Quote:
 

if you can demonstrate to me some way that the country is better than when he took office, i'll believe he's not a complete fuck-tard.


We are not in a recession.  That was fucking easy.
Quote:


he ignored clinton's outgoing plan to focus on al-qaida and kill osama, focusing instead on missile defense. so...that means if he wouldn't have fucked around and took advice from clinton, 9-11 probably would have never happened.


What?  Clinton had 8 years to kill Osama.  He had no plan.
Quote:
if that doesn't make him an idiot, i don't know what could. ignoring a chance to prevent a horrible, horrible tragedy, fucking brilliant. light years ahead of me or anyone.


The guy was in office for 6 months.  Are you fucking kidding me?  BDS at it's finest.


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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: zappaisgod]
    #8516167 -

did you seriously just use our economy right now as a positive example?

and al-qaida was becoming more of a threat as clinton was leaving. he informed bush to keep an eye on the situation, and it was completely ignored.

i don't care if he was only in office 6 months, if someone tells you not to touch an exposed wire and you get electrocuted you can't use the defense of "well i was only here a few minutes". it was arrogance, plain and simple. mr. fucking hotshot steals the election (why do we still have an electoral college?) and gets some sound advice from one of the greatest, and horniest (which makes him even more great if you ask me), presidents we have ever had, and just says "naw, i gots it, we're gonna worry about this other stuff instead".

whether or not clinton had a plan in the works to take osama out may be debatable, but the fact that bush was ignorant to ignore the advice of the departing president to do things his own way was, to say the least, a HUGE error of judgement is undeniable.

and wow, he flies planes. i've met guys who can take apart a car engine and put it back together but can barely tie their shoe.

i don't think the guys completely dumb, he has duped america well, technically once. it doesn't make him any less a douchebag or evil.


--------------------
praise "Bob"
did you mean shmooed-R.I.P.

"drought besets the mind, decay besets the man"-me

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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: rev 766]
    #8516214 -

Quote:
We are not in a recession.  That was fucking easy.


Are you high?


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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: Virus_with_Shoes]
    #8516249 -

Why?  We aren't in a recession.  But we were when Bush took office.  Like they say in high school, you can look it up.  I personally have done quite well over the Bush years.  You were probably 12 when he was elected.  What the fuck do you know?  Worst ever in my lifetime?  The Carter years.  All Dems in charge and all fucked up totally.  Do you know what will set the black race as an equal participant in politics back more than anything else in this country?  If Barry wins (I do not think that likely) and has a sympathetic Congress.  They will fuck this country into an economic socialist hell that he, and by extension all blacks, will get saddled with forever.


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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: zappaisgod]
    #8516316 -

clinton balanced the budget.


--------------------
praise "Bob"
did you mean shmooed-R.I.P.

"drought besets the mind, decay besets the man"-me

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Re: Comedy Gold: Rhetorical Genius explains.... well, something, I guess [Re: rev 766]
    #8516343 -

we are obviously in a recession
the inflation from the war is causing massive price spikes
breaking records
if u fail to see the recession then u live under a roque


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