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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: catnip40] * 1
    #29204387 -

Great information.
Tremendously useful.

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: Nillion] * 1
    #29205075 -

Great thread and information, thank you for doing this :thumbup:


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Ps. Serbica official thread - serbica connoisseur :mushroom2: :smirk:
📨 Journey of a Letter ✉️ the thread about how letters travel, how to address an envelope, and how to expedite delivery 📨📭
☞ Guide to the Shroomery - how to grow shrooms from A to Z guide ☜
If you want to dive in and grow some Pans, this is the place to start! ⥾
🅃 🄴 🄰 🄼    🄲 🄻 🄸 🄽 🄶 🅆 🅁 🄰 🄿

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: Bra]
    #29219482 -

Solipsis said:
I have experience with Psilocybe (caerulescens and cubensis) monokaryons popping off oidia as well, that would also be pretty dope if that could be exploited somehow. But ofc that still requires the initial monokaryon which we would preferably like to get around.


The Occurrence and Function of Oidia in the Hymenomycetes
https://www.jstor.org/stable/2436091
https://deepblue.lib.umich.edu/bitstream/handle/2027.42/141364/ajb208989.pdf

Nuclear selection in oidium formation from dikaryotic mycelia of Flammulina velutipes
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1340354000707613
https://sci-hub.se/https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1340354000707613

Genetics of Collybia velutipes, I. Mating type and barrage phenomenon (1).*
https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/jplantres1887/67/787-788/67_787-788_23/_article
https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/jplantres1887/67/787-788/67_787-788_23/_pdf/-char/en

GENETICS OF COLLYBIA VELUTIPES II. DEDIKARYOTIZATION AND ITS GENETICAL IMPLICATION TSUNEO TAKEMARU
https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/ggs1921/29/1/29_1_1/_article/-char/ja/
https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/ggs1921/29/1/29_1_1/_pdf/-char/en


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∴Genetics Info∴Ps. ovoideocystidiata and Native Americans∴

∴The Official Woodlovers Thread∴Outdoor Mushroom Cultivation∴

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: catnip40] * 1
    #29302198 -

Isolating mechanisms in fungi—prezygotic, postzygotic, and azygotic

Re: Phenotypic expression vs speciation

Speciation in fungi

Mechanisms of Fungal Speciation

The Origin of Species in Fungi

Hybrid sterility and inviability in the parasitic fungal species complex Microbotryum

Mitonuclear interactions may contribute to fitness of fungal hybrids

Mitonuclear Genetic Interactions in the Basidiomycete Heterobasidion parviporum Involve a Non-conserved Mitochondrial Open Reading Frame

Hybridization Facilitates Adaptive Evolution in Two Major Fungal Pathogens

Hybrid speciation


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∴Genetics Info∴Ps. ovoideocystidiata and Native Americans∴

∴The Official Woodlovers Thread∴Outdoor Mushroom Cultivation∴

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: catnip40] * 2
    #29321847 -

Here's a PDF version of Genetics and Breeding of Edible Mushrooms:

Genetics and Breeding of Edible Mushrooms 2nd Edition 1999.pdf


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Protoplast Fusion


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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: Puffin]
    #29327091 -

Thanks for sharing. I already have that book/pdf linked in the OP. Not sure if the link is still active or not though. Also not sure if I posted the first or second edition

I was intending on uploading a lot of the book PDFs I have to the shroomery server. However the upload limit is only 16mb and 32mb for supporter accounts lol


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∴Genetics Info∴Ps. ovoideocystidiata and Native Americans∴

∴The Official Woodlovers Thread∴Outdoor Mushroom Cultivation∴

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: catnip40] * 5
    #29344903 -

I need more information, but for that to happen, there must be freedom of expression and the return of catnip to this site, to which he has contributed more than anyone else in raising the standard.
Unban catnip  !  !  !

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: Daaraj] * 2
    #29344930 -

Agreed

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: PhenoDreamers]
    #29347037 -

:boobs:


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∞
I am incapable of conceiving infinity, and yet I do not accept finity.
- Simone de Beauvoir -

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: snoot]
    #29350714 -

hola estoy buscando un micologo, o alguien que tenga conocimiento sobre identifación de hongos agaricales, para que me ayude con la certificación de identificación por favor se lo agradeceria mucho

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: catnip40]
    #29360610 -

catnip40 said:
trippleblack said:
When diving into parasexual breeding, you can follow under a microscope a live mitotic event of recombination to prove your cross. 




:takingnotes:

Would you mind elaborating on this, or linking the literature you are referencing?

Unless it's already in one of the links you posted.. just not connecting the dots for me right now though


I’m just seeing this question.  I have not seen any literature or academic papers for my exact findings. However the understanding of parasexuality all start with guido pontecorvos work.  Guidos work was more aligned with dedikaryotization then recombination.  Other techniques i found allow you to do this without blending. 

I am sufficient at using parasexual breeding, and was able to do it before i could understand what was going on.

Under conditions of stress, such as low nutrient agar in conjunction with a light stresser, two dikaryons will communicate with each other and send off mating signals.  This hacks into the fungi’s ability to undergo a last ditch effort to  preserve itself before death. 

This seems like a hack that can exploit mitotic recombination without mechanisms like protoplast fusion.

For Di Di crosses, you will have a male and a female side.  The male side will shoot out a gamete that looks like  antheridia, while the perceived female side will produce these egg like structures that appear to me as pheromone receptor gametes. 

The antheridia will grow towards these pheromone like gamete eggs and attach.  Next you’ll notice strange events taking place in which i  visually describe as “mitotic recombination”.  The mycelial structure produced during these mitotic events show itself as fattened loop like repeating mycelial structures.  Structures completely unlike the rest of the mycelium. _I believe mitotic crossing over happen within these fattened structures.  New mycelium that follow these events will balance out into a stable recombinant isolation. 

From these steps, you can look under the scope, pull out wedges from these cross sections, and check on plates for different sectors.  you can sample different cross points for different mitotic recombinant isolations.    This has become my gold standard, you can tap into parts of the chromosome that don’t generally get utilized during classic breeding that rely on meiosis.

Edited by trippleblack (09/30/25 08:26 PM)

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: trippleblack]
    #29365790 -

Great.. maybe we should call dikaryon coercion / breeding bumping dikheads Tek

:bump:

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: bumping dikheads] * 1
    #29366175 -

Got some cool pics that show parasexuality in action.




You can see a parasexual cross above, and then another attempt to cross ttbvi with pan bisporus, I’ll try to fruit those very soon, I hope it takes, at the 12 and 6 o’clock position they start to mingle. 

First pic at the zone of interaction, new recombinant after new recombinant.  agar formula in the second pic is filtered so I can analyze under the microscope if mating is taking place. Those pins are nothing like the parents being used. 

I haven’t found this exact technique in any literature but I suspect this may be in the arsenal of some pro breeders.

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: trippleblack]
    #29368970 -

Thank you for sharing trippleblack I appreciate it and ur contributions are within the leading edge :thumbup:

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: bumping dikheads]
    #29369335 -

:takingnotes:

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: trippleblack]
    #29370062 -

trippleblack said:
Got some cool pics that show parasexuality in action.




You can see a parasexual cross above, and then another attempt to cross ttbvi with pan bisporus, I’ll try to fruit those very soon, I hope it takes, at the 12 and 6 o’clock position they start to mingle. 

First pic at the zone of interaction, new recombinant after new recombinant.  agar formula in the second pic is filtered so I can analyze under the microscope if mating is taking place. Those pins are nothing like the parents being used. 

I haven’t found this exact technique in any literature but I suspect this may be in the arsenal of some pro breeders.


I am wondering if you are aware of the phenomena being coined "remonokaryotization" and I think it may be mentioned in the literature as monokaryotization.

It's more like a passive form of ddk. I have been speaking to a breeder who claims after two weeks in low nute LC dikaryons often revert back to the monokaryotic state

It sounds a lot like your method just without any other stressor except age and low nutrient profile.

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: ghost of october]
    #29370111 -

It takes effort for non-homothallic spores to maintain a dikaryon.

I have a mushroom biology book that talks about recovering monos off of a low nutrient plate. No LC required.

And here's a di-mon backcrossed pan on 0.5% lme.





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And if I only could
I'd make a deal with God
And I'd get him to swap our places
I'd be running up that road
Be running up that hill
With no problems

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: ghost of october]
    #29370298 -

I am familiar with DDK by way of guido pontecorvos work.  remonokaryotization is just the named process guido used to blend the dikaryon to create multiple monokaryons.  I have a waring blender -so it’s a simple process.  This isn’t the process i use. 

With guido, and in general DDK, you blend the culture until the myclia arrange itself as single nuclear cells, then once these cells join back together -usually on a different media, the nucleus will rejoin into a Dikaryon state with the caveat of the nuclei recombining with  new allele combinations.. This is a cool breeding route to take.  the process i outlined has similarities, but is different. 

Anyone can view under the microscope the breeding structures i outlined, it’s a different thing than DDK.  I’m using low nutrients to bypass self/ non self recognition system in fungi, but also using a mild stressor -it’s not simply a low nutrient water agar, if it’s just water agar with low nutrition, the recombinant don’t seem to take hold as easy.  Also the route i take seem to have the ability to throw off aneuploid cultures too. 

I appreciate corrections, I think i  understand the academic material / but there could be plenty of holes in my logic.

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: trippleblack] * 1
    #29370397 -

Catnip really has compiled a lot of this info and biology books already. You just have to sift through them and make some inference. There is potentially more than one overlapping phenomena going on it's not just one thing it appears. I had talked to catnip and he said he had a lot more to share about this stuff but that's likely not going to happen after his exile.

There are several biological process that seem to be exploitable and are all relatively adjacent to one another or just slightly different applications of the same sort of thing.

Appreciate the discussion.

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Re: Sexuality∴Genetics∴Breeding of Basidiomycota Info & Resources [Re: ghost of october] * 1
    #29370412 -

Also I am aware that pontecorvo was using that remonokaryotization term as well. This is not what I was referring to.

I was referring to a technique that a breeder named moondaddy myco (?) has been calling remonokaryotization.

He is basically using low nute LC and just letting it age for 2 weeks and then is able to symmetrically recover the monokaryons from an LC.

Yes as tree frog said it can be done on agar too though. It's the same thing.

There also seem to be some ghetto style teks where you just pair two "remonokaryotized" lcs in vitro or mixing into one spawn jar or something similar and then basically just screen the fruits for any shared traits or anomalous behavior that is not observed of the parents

Not as systematic but the same sort of thing.

Edited by ghost of october (10/11/25 03:16 PM)

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