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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: PuffM4gicDr4gon] * 1
    #29118015 -

PuffM4gicDr4gon said:
Do people recommend pasteurizing or sterilizing cactus soil as well? Is there a difference between indoor and outdoor cactus soil?

Also, is Miracle Grow potting mix the same as Jiffy mix? I believe so, but I don't see it called 'jiffy' anywhere on the package. It's Peat/Verm/Nutrients which is what I believe Jiffy is.

TF, I've seen you mention your dislike for verm several times. Why is it that you don't like it?


You don’t want nutrients in your casing. That’s where contamination can take hold, where the “food” is.

Some use peat, peat/verm, or peat/verm/lime.  Some add sand, some will use cactus soil, etc. Most probably use something with lime for pH balance, but I have seen people not use it successfully too.

I use jiffy “Organic seed starting jiffy mix” and it is only peat, verm and lime(probably could use it out of the bag but I do the sous vide vacuum bag pasteurization) For both pans and cubes.


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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Phaedra] * 1
    #29118038 -

Ahhh, Jiffy is a brand. I thought for some reason it was a product of miracle grow. Ive been searching 'Jiffy Mix' on Amazon for weeks and the only thing that came up was miracle grow.

The Jiffy seedling starter mix pointed me in the right direction. Tyvm.

Picture for reference in case anyone else is foolish like me



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I've got skills, they don't know where to use me
I'm like the best dressed guy at the nude beach
Nice to meet you!

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: PuffM4gicDr4gon]
    #29118077 -

I'm not sure why other people like verm. It's never used in button mushroom cultivation because it's not a benefit.

And in casing things I find it especially suspicious, because it's mostly magnesium. I don't know how bioavailable it is to mycelium.  But magnesium in high quantities interferes with primordia formation in a number of species of gourmets, and quite possibly actives to.

I tried straight verm casing a few times with mystery sa, and while I'm sure some of it was a skill issue it was the worst casing I've tried with them.  I never really see the mycelium colonize it, which means they're not really pulling moisture from it.  And quite possibly the magnesium itself just isn't a great place for primordia to form.

And 100% peat, at least for pans, runs better for me than some mix with verm in it.  So, I don't know. I've researched casings a lot. And I've experimented with vermiculite in my casings. I just don't like it.

Also, you don't need to pasteurize the jiffy mix. It should be pre-pasteurized.


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And if I only could
I'd make a deal with God
And I'd get him to swap our places
I'd be running up that road
Be running up that hill
With no problems

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: tree frog]
    #29118106 -

I used verm for simplicity. I read you can simply get it and put it on and you’re done.

I didn’t like it either. It’s a mess for one.

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: PancyanterA] * 2
    #29118131 -

Everyone is going to have an opinion on casing, I think. People do it all different
ways and most of those ways work for them.

I use the classic peat/verm mix but I add calcium carbonate, lime and I sterilize.

The main benefit for me, besides zero contamination is that I can store it for much longer
than pasteurized. It lets me make a larger batch that I can use over several runs.


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Cultivating Panaeolus cyanescens


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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Asura]
    #29118138 -

Are you applying the casing in sterile conditions too?

Or is the idea that sterilized casings contaminate overblown?

Because I just told somebody not to sterilize them lol

And yeah, I agree that verm could be a skill issue for me. Different cultivators are going to have different preferences. I do think different species have different preferences too though and what works for cubes or even cyans, might not work as well for some of these newer pans.


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And if I only could
I'd make a deal with God
And I'd get him to swap our places
I'd be running up that road
Be running up that hill
With no problems

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Asura] * 1
    #29118139 -

Seedling mix is literally just peat and perlite.


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🅃🄴🄰🄼 🄸🄷🄾🄿


New to cultivation or the shroomery?  Observe the hitchhiker's guide

The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Shroomery



Smellyhobbit said:
"Wiping a needle with isopropyl after flame sterilization is like shitting after you wipe your ass."

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Mr Piggy]
    #29118156 -

My all in one PF tek containers of Copelandia are showing some growth, albeit slowly. I might've screwed up the proportions of flour to coir somehow.

That being said, there were a few that I threw in some extra chickpea flour (for science), those came out muddier, but are colonizing the best.

Could just be more flour, but perhaps something about the texture or nutrient profile of chickpea flour works well for these.

It does make the texture of Coir more shitlike, so could be that.


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I call them Huskies cause they Mush!


Huskies' Grimoire
The Official Wild Cubensis Thread
Easy Instant Pot Agar
Let's Talk Cowtek

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: tree frog] * 4
    #29118170 -

tree frog said:
Are you applying the casing in sterile conditions too?

Or is the idea that sterilized casings contaminate overblown?

Because I just told somebody not to sterilize them lol

And yeah, I agree that verm could be a skill issue for me. Different cultivators are going to have different preferences. I do think different species have different preferences too though and what works for cubes or even cyans, might not work as well for some of these newer pans.


I think your way is 100% correct. As is any way that people are doing it and getting fruits :smile:

Verm is one of those things that I do...because I've just always done it that way :shrug: I've never really
been interested in changing things up that are working, you know?

Also, I am not casing in sterile conditions by any means. The calc carb and lime additions, in the quantities
I use, seem to prevent contamination. I can get multiple flushes without issue. I started sterilizing because
casing was where I was having the most issues - getting all the way to fruiting and having the casing contam
2 days later. It can upset a person :lol: And I love being able to store casing longer. It's awesome. It can
really ease up the workflow.


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Cultivating Panaeolus cyanescens


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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Asura] * 2
    #29118184 -

I’ve been able to store pasteurized casing for 6months plus without issue, of course mine gets stored in a fairly cool spot in my basement which probably helps some. Ain’t a dig at sterilization by any means either but wanted to mention as pasteurization doesn’t mean it can’t be stored long term. I’ll make a ton at a time and it stays fresh.

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: kirkeng] * 3
    #29118187 -

See, we're all doing different stuff that works :lol: I live in Texas. No basements and it's
always humid here. I don't see a way that could work for me here. So many variables for
everyone's particular situation.


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Cultivating Panaeolus cyanescens


Edited by Asura (02/08/25 12:22 PM)

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Asura] * 1
    #29118191 -

Asura said:
See, we're all doing different stuff that works :lol:


There in lies the beauty of it all!

I want to to switch to a new source of lime though, the garden granules are annoying me lately… I need to find something less annoying to work with locally, low on the list of priorities so I bet by the time I need more I’ll have forgotten…

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: kirkeng] * 3
    #29118194 -

I used to get all technical and buy food grade calcium hydroxide but now I just
use Mrs Wages pickling lime right from the grocery store. 1 bag will last me
forever.


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Cultivating Panaeolus cyanescens


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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Asura] * 1
    #29118206 -

That’s good to know, I’m hesitant to switch to pickling line cause I don’t want to redefine ratios out of laziness… I should though honestly have to use so much garden lime 1part:2part peat bags still last a hot minute but still only needing a few tbls would be nice, and it’s a powder already… I’m becoming a slave to muscle memory at this point… I have some wages lying around already I’m doing it…

Edit: I’m reminded now I need a new brand of peat too… last bag I got was like 60% sticks… fuck that shit. Stuck using this big ass bag for a minute too.

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: kirkeng] * 2
    #29118211 -

I get it for sure. I don't really switch things up unless there's an obvious benefit.
Even if it means I am doing more work.

I need new peat, too. The Miracle Gro stuff has God only knows what in it and is probably
why I do the things the way I do,

I was thinking large bags of the raw, unprocessed peat and I could just run it through
my Ninja blender.


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Cultivating Panaeolus cyanescens


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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Asura] * 2
    #29118215 -

Yeah I get the big ol 55lb bags of it, I forget the name of the brand I had before but that stuff was sooo nice barely anything to sift in there. Not to mention I keep it in the garage shits an ice cube right now… maybe you can tell I need to make casing today and am trying to find every excuse for why I can’t…

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Asura] * 2
    #29118223 -

I have a 4 cubic foot bag of medium vermiculite to cut the Promix when I start seedling so it’s always available. I am liking using coir. Everything gets recycled to the garden.
Front and back of the same cake from the unknown syringe. Light source,6500k led, is directly above the cake.

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: kirkeng] * 1
    #29118243 -

kirkeng said:
Asura said:
See, we're all doing different stuff that works :lol:


There in lies the beauty of it all!

I want to to switch to a new source of lime though, the garden granules are annoying me lately… I need to find something less annoying to work with locally, low on the list of priorities so I bet by the time I need more I’ll have forgotten…


I'm sure there is an optimum way to do things.  As long as we are getting fruits, we can take our time optimizing.  I'm glad people are having success with different techniques.  I can waste a whole lot of time overthinking and researching stuff.  Sometimes have to just pick a way that has worked for someone else and dive in.  Of course at the same time, research often pays off and helps prevent time wasting mistakes.  There is definitely a balance.

I bet pasteurization would be the superior and easier process in most people's real world environment once they got it figured out for their situation.  I chose sterilization simply because I got a headache reading about pasteurization and how you had to do it hot enough but not too hot and long enough but not too long.  Trying to get the core temperature to such and such without overheating other parts......  I didn't want to fiddle fart around and figure it out.

Sterilization I could just dive in.  I know how to vent the PC and get it to 15 psi.  Then it is just a matter of running it long enough and its OK if I run it too long.  No worries there.  Was just less variables.  For sure it sacrifices the protective bacteria and molds that might be in the unsterilized substrate.

The all american 941 will sterilize a lot of substrate or casing and it can sit in those mycobags a long time until I'm ready to use it.

Once I get ahead of the game, I'll definitely try some pasteurized runs and may end up having to do that anyway to get semps going because they take so long.  My sterilized stuff might contaminate before the semps can colonize.

Thanks to everyone who shares knowledge on here. 

Pickling lime on amazon is super easy to work with in small quantities.

Oh....what would be really cool is to get some cultures going of super fast colonizing "good" mold or bacteria.....sterilize everything and then dose it with the protective stuff prior to using it for mycology.  Like have some fire fang culture or something.  Something that would eat trich, but not mushrooms.


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I may not have stayed at a Holiday Inn Express, but I have taken 20 grams of fresh subtropicalis :smile:

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: Hardhead] * 2
    #29118255 -

Hell yeah man do what works for you, bear in mind this is my opinion based off my experience not claiming fact. But pasteurization for me has a wide wide window. Casing especially you can’t really go to long, I frequently forget I have shit going and it’ll get pasteurized for sometimes 8-12 hours… same with manure, it’ll go for a long ass time sometimes and not be an issue overall. Temps may matter though, I trend on the low end 140-150 for longer.

Not saying the “strict” guidelines for pasteurization aren’t correct, far from it, I would argue we can get away with wider margins than some think. Of course try at your own risk, I know what I can get away with currently. The day it stops working for me I’ll change it, I mean shit depending on manure quality I already do…

In regards to longer lived species sterilized media may actually be preferred, at least I tend to have much better success with sterilized media for certain long lived species. Of course allowing media to be colonized aseptically and spawned at colonization. Pasteurization has it uses and it has its downfalls we live to grow another day and that’s all that matters to me.

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Re: Official Copelandia/Panaeolus Thread [Re: kirkeng] * 5
    #29118262 -

Me reading this thread as a newbie trying to make a plan:



--------------------
I've got skills, they don't know where to use me
I'm like the best dressed guy at the nude beach
Nice to meet you!

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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Mushroom Cultivation
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