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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: Enlil]
    #24939945 -

You're a lawyer, and you can't tell the difference between a middle-class person and a working-class one by their style of car, clothing, grooming and speaking?

You probably wear glasses if you're a lawyer, because you have to read so much. Every time a cop sees me in glasses they just wave me through, even if I'm stoned off my tits.


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"They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."

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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: viktor]
    #24939952 -

I don't wear glasses.  I was driving a $3,500 car with four month expired tags, wearing shorts and a t-shirt with stains on it and a few tears.  I hadn't shaved in three days.  How did he know?


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Censoring opposing views since 2014.



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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #24939960 -

The Ecstatic said:
Glaring institutional racism: circumstantial at best!

Roaming ISIS rape gangs in Sweden: this one Swedish woman blows the lid off the EU elite conspiracy!


This is hella off topic and I am on your side in the argument at hand but I am a pedant so I can't let liberal buzzwords slide.

The concept of institutional racism lacks much explanatory value. Discrimination within law enforcement and the justice system only accounts for about 20% of the discrepancy between incarceration of whites and blacks at most. The rest is just good old fashion class oppression. In effect, pushing this idea just distracts people from the real scourge of black communities, which is of course capitalism.


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I love men, too, not merely individuals, but every one. But I love them with the consciousness of my egoism; I love them because love makes me happy, I love because loving is natural to me, it pleases me. I know no 'commandment of love'. I have a fellow-feeling with every feeling being, and their torment torments, their refreshment refreshes me too.

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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: Enlil]
    #24940259 -

Enlil said:
I don't wear glasses.  I was driving a $3,500 car with four month expired tags, wearing shorts and a t-shirt with stains on it and a few tears.  I hadn't shaved in three days.  How did he know?


University accent, probably. Did you never notice, when at university, that people with 4+ years of tertiary education speak very differently to the 75% of non-university educated people?

When I was a barman I could guess someone's social class with accuracy after a few words. All I had to hear was the accent. Police officers can do this equally well.


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"They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."

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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: viktor] * 2
    #24940267 -

Class is the most important factor when it comes to law enforcement bias, I can agree to that, but if you think that race doesn't play a part of it's own, you're either blind or not from around here.  Personally, I think the bulk of racial issues would resolve themselves relatively quickly if we could sort the class issues, but that doesn't negate the existence of racial bias in law enforcement.  Hell, in this town, the local cops had to submit to federal oversight for more than a decade because of it.

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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: Enlil] * 2
    #24940283 -

Enlil said:
It's not about guilt or punishing people for the sins of their ancestors.  It's about looking at the status TODAY and trying to level the playing field.  There is no question that white people today enjoy privileges that black people do not, for instance.  Leveling that playing field is desirable.

Of course, some white people see that as a punishment.  Taking away an advantage they enjoy is seen as being punished for being white.  They're currently being rewarded for being white, but they don't want to admit that. 

But that's human nature.  Successful people take credit for their success, while people who fail blame everyone else for their failure.  On the macro scale, white people delude themselves into thinking white people are superior because white people succeed more often than black people.  They never consider the fact that this is a self-perpetuating privilege.


What makes you think white people succeed more often than black people? You seem to be willfully ignoring the large number of whites living in poverty right now and you're essentially spitting on everyone one of them with this white privilege nonsense. If your sympathy towards the poor is dependent on skin color, then you are the racist, not the people who you are trying to stereotype by their skin color.


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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: ballsalsa]
    #24940294 -

ballsalsa said:
Class is the most important factor when it comes to law enforcement bias, I can agree to that, but if you think that race doesn't play a part of it's own, you're either blind or not from around here.  Personally, I think the bulk of racial issues would resolve themselves relatively quickly if we could sort the class issues, but that doesn't negate the existence of racial bias in law enforcement.  Hell, in this town, the local cops had to submit to federal oversight for more than a decade because of it.


If black people weren't so often lower class, they wouldn't get targeted by Police.

Asians are about as middle-class as white people, and they don't get targeted by Police.


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"They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."

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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: Kizzle] * 1
    #24940432 -

Kizzle said:
You seem to be willfully ignoring the large number of whites living in poverty right now and you're essentially spitting on everyone one of them with this white privilege nonsense. If your sympathy towards the poor is dependent on skin color, then you are the racist, not the people who you are trying to stereotype by their skin color.


When did I say white people can't be poor?  When did I say anything about sympathy? I'm just pointing out the reality of white privilege.  I never said that white people can't have it hard or fail.  I never said I felt sorry for any race.  I'm talking about the current state of affairs and the way in which the playing field is not level.

In a level playing field, people will fail, too.  I'm not looking for a world where everyone has equal outcomes.  I'm looking for a world where everyone has equal opportunities, and that isn't what we have today.


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Censoring opposing views since 2014.



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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: viktor] * 2
    #24940438 -

viktor said:
If black people weren't so often lower class, they wouldn't get targeted by Police.



Now,  you're starting to get it. And if they weren't targeted by police, they wouldn't so often be lower class.  That's white privilege in action. 

There is no denying that black people in America started off lower class by design.  Therefore, they're targeted more.  This started the cycle that continues today.


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Censoring opposing views since 2014.



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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: Enlil]
    #24940488 -

What do you think of Jewish privilege?


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"They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."

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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: Enlil] * 2
    #24940556 -

Enlil said:
Kizzle said:
You seem to be willfully ignoring the large number of whites living in poverty right now and you're essentially spitting on everyone one of them with this white privilege nonsense. If your sympathy towards the poor is dependent on skin color, then you are the racist, not the people who you are trying to stereotype by their skin color.


When did I say white people can't be poor?  When did I say anything about sympathy? I'm just pointing out the reality of white privilege.  I never said that white people can't have it hard or fail.  I never said I felt sorry for any race.  I'm talking about the current state of affairs and the way in which the playing field is not level.

In a level playing field, people will fail, too.  I'm not looking for a world where everyone has equal outcomes.  I'm looking for a world where everyone has equal opportunities, and that isn't what we have today.


The poor are not privileged, not even when they're white. If you acknowledge that then it should be clear that the privilege some people have has nothing to do with being white. The number one cause of poverty is being born into poverty.There's no reason to bring race into the picture and when people do it's usually because they're looking for someone to blame, that's all.


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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: ballsalsa] * 2
    #24940559 -

ballsalsa said:
Class is the most important factor when it comes to law enforcement bias, I can agree to that, but if you think that race doesn't play a part of it's own, you're either blind or not from around here.  Personally, I think the bulk of racial issues would resolve themselves relatively quickly if we could sort the class issues, but that doesn't negate the existence of racial bias in law enforcement.  Hell, in this town, the local cops had to submit to federal oversight for more than a decade because of it.


"had to submit to federal oversight"

As if that even means anything, let me guess that they arrest more minorities for crimes in your area and the Feds come in and determine it MUST be "racial bias in law enforcement" because it couldn't be that minorities ACTUALLY committed more crime.

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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: Kizzle] * 1
    #24940584 -

Kizzle said:
Enlil said:
Kizzle said:
You seem to be willfully ignoring the large number of whites living in poverty right now and you're essentially spitting on everyone one of them with this white privilege nonsense. If your sympathy towards the poor is dependent on skin color, then you are the racist, not the people who you are trying to stereotype by their skin color.


When did I say white people can't be poor?  When did I say anything about sympathy? I'm just pointing out the reality of white privilege.  I never said that white people can't have it hard or fail.  I never said I felt sorry for any race.  I'm talking about the current state of affairs and the way in which the playing field is not level.

In a level playing field, people will fail, too.  I'm not looking for a world where everyone has equal outcomes.  I'm looking for a world where everyone has equal opportunities, and that isn't what we have today.


The poor are not privileged, not even when they're white. If you acknowledge that then it should be clear that the privilege some people have has nothing to do with being white. The number one cause of poverty is being born into poverty.There's no reason to bring race into the picture and when people do it's usually because they're looking for someone to blame, that's all.


:raisemyglass:

No reason to bring race into the picture... unless you're trying to distract from the class issue.


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"They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."

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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: viktor] * 1
    #24940596 -

While it's clear class is a factor, race is also a factor within equal classes.  All the statistics show this.


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I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 1
    #24940716 -

You are middle class, you don't understand your class privilege.


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"They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."

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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: viktor]
    #24940721 -

I can see the statistics about my privilege.


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I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  I also attack my side if I think they're wrong.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.

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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: viktor]
    #24940779 -

viktor said:
What do you think of Jewish privilege?


I don't know much about it.  I certainly haven't looked into it.  Is there such a thing?


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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: Kizzle] * 1
    #24940784 -

Kizzle said:
The poor are not privileged, not even when they're white. If you acknowledge that then it should be clear that the privilege some people have has nothing to do with being white. The number one cause of poverty is being born into poverty.There's no reason to bring race into the picture and when people do it's usually because they're looking for someone to blame, that's all.


I don't acknowledge that.  There are poor people of all races.  Poverty is absolutely a disadvantage.  I never said otherwise.  I said that being white is an advantage, though. 

In other words, a poor white male has more advantages than a poor white female.  A poor white female has more advantages than a poor black male....

I could go on and on, but you get the picture.


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Censoring opposing views since 2014.



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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: Enlil] * 1
    #24941040 -

we get the picture that you are babblng left wing nonsense to be consistent with enlil#1. However it is a fact that non whites are guaranteed advantages under law. No such advantages are given to whites so therefore your statement is false on the face of it and you should know better.


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“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.” (attributed to Alexis de Tocqueville political philosopher Circa 1835)

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Re: The Western Centre-Left Have Now Fully Betrayed the Working Class [Re: qman] * 1
    #24941253 -

qman said:
ballsalsa said:
Class is the most important factor when it comes to law enforcement bias, I can agree to that, but if you think that race doesn't play a part of it's own, you're either blind or not from around here.  Personally, I think the bulk of racial issues would resolve themselves relatively quickly if we could sort the class issues, but that doesn't negate the existence of racial bias in law enforcement.  Hell, in this town, the local cops had to submit to federal oversight for more than a decade because of it.


"had to submit to federal oversight"

As if that even means anything, let me guess that they arrest more minorities for crimes in your area and the Feds come in and determine it MUST be "racial bias in law enforcement" because it couldn't be that minorities ACTUALLY committed more crime.


Nah.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rampart_scandal
Quote:
The Rampart scandal refers to widespread police corruption in the Community Resources Against Street Hoodlums (CRASH) anti-gang unit of the LAPD's Rampart Division in the late 1990s. More than 70 police officers either assigned to or associated with the Rampart CRASH unit were implicated in some form of misconduct, making it one of the most widespread cases of documented police corruption in United States history, responsible for a long list of offenses including unprovoked shootings, unprovoked beatings, planting of false evidence, stealing and dealing narcotics, bank robbery, perjury, and the covering up of evidence of these activities. [1]



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