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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: Phluck]
    #2246866 - 01/16/04 08:07 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

There is a difference, I think, in convincing yourself it is not cold, until you freeze to death... and something like focusing within to harmonize your energy and life force, to help maintain a healthy energy system, as well as mind focus. If you have a cold, for instance, what harm comes from "willing" the cold to die? Give your immune system a little boost.

Of course thoughts have a direct effect on your health. If you think about death, destruction, hatred, and blackness all day everday, chances are you will not be very happy, and your health will reflect that. Do we know what causes cancer? I'd venture to say that chronic negative thinking plays a role.

But there is a line. Don't.. say.. jump off a cliff thinking you can will yourself to fly away, unless you have tried it successfully several times.

But the mind does control the internal body temperature. Depending on your 'state of mind', it can feel colder or hotter then it really is.

To say that ones thoughts do not effect their body, mind and health, is not only incorrect, it's dangerous. People have died..


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: Shroomism]
    #2246872 - 01/16/04 08:10 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

"Do we know what causes cancer? I'd venture to say that chronic negative thinking plays a role."

Chronic negative thinking can increase the random mutations in cells?


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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: Phluck]
    #2246903 - 01/16/04 08:24 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

No, what goes up must come down.
I didn't ask how the cancer spreads, I asked what caused it.

When one sends a thought into the universe (and every thought is sent to the universe) it has a charge, either positive, negative, or neutral.. depending on how our minds categorized it and sent it out. It shoots straight up into the atmosphere, eventually reaching an apex (zero point), where it reverses polarities, and comes right back down, the opposite charge of how it left. Negative comes back positive, and vice versa. Neutral stays neutral.

What comes around goes around

The thought is absorbed by the cells of the body. After exteneded periods of time, cells can become charged with a build up of extremely positive or negative thoughts, either of which can and will cause problems. The key to balance, is thinking and acting with neutrality.

You must understand that with thought comes action. When one is inclined to thinking a certain way, they will often act those thoughts out. Thus, the negative or positive thought is perpetuated until the cycle is broken. Thinking is the root of our being, and all action begins first as thought. Smoking cigarettes, for example, is a negative action that is culminated from a negative thought (addiction). Over time, this negative thinking can really put a hurting on your physical body. I could give about 500 different analogies, but eh.

Alls I'm saying is that the "mutations" might not be as random as we think.


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Invisiblekaiowas
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Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: Shroomism]
    #2247124 - 01/16/04 10:31 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

what about love then???? if love is supposed to be one force that can tear diwn walls of seperation, then how can one be neutral and still love? if love is both positive and negative.

what do you mean being neutral. in what way? I'm just curious as to what your opinion is, that's all.


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Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.


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OfflinePHARMAKOS
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Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: kaiowas]
    #2247191 - 01/16/04 10:58 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

the mind body connection is very real and very apparent. Just look at the placebo effect! a huge number of ailments can be 'treated' with the placebo effect. THe fact is that no matter what happens to our body, it is our mind that will recieve and interpret the signals coming from it. This is why a person can block pain but not withstand bullets. Even if you were so advanced that you wouldnt feel yourself getting shot you would still die. But yeah the mind can definetly play an important part in combatiing diseases and what not, positive thinking has something to be said for it.

swami: martial artists dont live longer than other athletes... true. but not absolutely. That is, some sports are actually quite detrimental to long term health as they can cause serious wear and tear on the body that can result in pain in later life. Martial arts, (and here you have to make a distinction between kickboxing and taichi) are especially effective for maintaing good mental and physical health into old age. I have known some white haired men in there 70s who are in peak physical condition due in no small part to practicing there martial arts. Tai chi especially, like look at those tiny old bearded chinise dancing around like butterflies with huge metal swords. In fact i suspect if one were to take a large sample of tai chi practicioners (or possibly qui gong, kung fu etc as well) and compared them to wieghtlifters, soccerplayers etc you might notice a significant differance in age at death. But that rules out getting hit by a car or something of course.


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: kaiowas]
    #2247265 - 01/16/04 11:48 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Love is a universal creative force that is beyond any human emotion or attachment. It is the positive or negative thoughts that we attach to love that give it those properties, although that is not love in its natural state.

Being neutral simply means thinking and acting from as 'neutral' or 'objective' position as possible. Another way of putting it would be to think "clearly".. neutrality is a state of being, where one is not effected so drastically by outside influence, so as to think of things through polarities... i.e - this is either good or bad. It can be applied in every aspect of every kind of thought.. neutral love is that which is devoid of attachment, devoid of any polarity, but still contains the essence of compassion for life. Too often will humans use love as a tool or weapon, to create binds between entities, where a positive or negative charge through that bind can result in control issues. True love has no bind, it simply emanates pure and unconditional compassion which is the stuff the universe is made of.

Neutral thinking is to be balanced and centered
There is the yin, and there is the yang.. and then there is the yin yang.. which encompasses all aspects of each side. It simply is. To be neutral simply means that you do not attach a positive or negative charge to thoughts and actions, and simply let them "be", because they "are", and that's the way it "is". If that makes any sense. I could approach it from a different angle if need be.

But to answer your question, love can tear down walls of separation, because separation is a result (illusion) of polarized thinking (positive and negative), and real love transcends any polarity, making it transparent.


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Anonymous

Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #2247309 - 01/17/04 12:16 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

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Invisiblemuhurgle
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Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: ]
    #2247317 - 01/17/04 12:19 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

Why does anybody feel the need to differ between the mind and the body in the first place?

Seems to me that if you subscribe to this separation, you must somehow subscribe to the magic of the mind too.


--------------------
"To make this mundane world sublime
Take half a gram of phanerothyme."

Aldous Huxley


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Anonymous

Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: Swami]
    #2247323 - 01/17/04 12:21 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: ]
    #2247325 - 01/17/04 12:21 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

If it's any consolation, I've been sick once in the past 7 years, and by all laws of logic I should have been dead 5 years ago.


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Anonymous

Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: Shroomism]
    #2247334 - 01/17/04 12:24 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: ]
    #2247338 - 01/17/04 12:28 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I can tell we will have some interesting stories to tell by the fire this spring.

Look forward to meeting you on the physical plane :heart:


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Anonymous

Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: Shroomism]
    #2247345 - 01/17/04 12:30 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

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Invisiblemuhurgle
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Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: ]
    #2247354 - 01/17/04 12:33 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

If God wanted you to live, are you feeling good about the life you live? That you are chosen to live, but many others to die for no appearant reason at all, must put an extraordinary pressure on you as to how you live your life?

Can you fathom the reason as to why your life is chosen over, say, any of the lives that were taken in the Iraq conflict (on either side of course)?

You must be infinitely hubmled by this experience.


--------------------
"To make this mundane world sublime
Take half a gram of phanerothyme."

Aldous Huxley


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: ]
    #2247917 - 01/17/04 08:03 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

And I was healed of cancer by prayer.

Ah, the refreshing power of anecdote. Here, let me try:

Our whole family prayed for a favored aunt and she died a painful death from cancer.

I had a friend, who in the middle of a deep depression, prayed to die and yet he still lives.

Do mine cancel yours out or can you show causation?


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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: Shroomism]
    #2248020 - 01/17/04 11:11 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

"I didn't ask how the cancer spreads, I asked what caused it. "

Mutations are what cause cancer.

If you get one cell in your body that has a mutation that causes it to split way faster than normal, then pretty soon you've got a bunch of them... and pretty soon its a tumour.

"The thought is absorbed by the cells of the body. After exteneded periods of time, cells can become charged with a build up of extremely positive or negative thoughts, either of which can and will cause problems. The key to balance, is thinking and acting with neutrality. "

This is pseudoscience.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: ]
    #2248030 - 01/17/04 11:42 AM (17 years, 10 months ago)

"And I was healed of cancer by prayer. I cut off all treatment and decided if God wanted me to live I would. It has been 30 years since I was healed. "

This is the post hoc fallacy. Cancer can come and go. Sometimes someone goes into remission seemingly out of nowhere. Anyone remotely religious prays, and has their loved ones praying for them. The ones who live, will claim it was the prayer that caused them to live. Just as they might claim it was the crystals, or reiki that healed them, if they were using those methods.


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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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InvisibleSkorpivoMusterion
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Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: Phluck]
    #2248077 - 01/17/04 12:16 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

I've watched Discovery articles on the Tibetan Monks, and it was based on what the Tibetan monks can do that most people in the general population of the planet can't do. (Don't would be a more precise word because Tibetan monks are humans just like all of us, so we all have the same potential as them.)
One of these very many things that the monks have trained themselves to do, is the ability to sleep all night long in the SNOW. They do this every once a blue moon, as an exercise. They wake up the next morning like it was a cakewalk. But here's the kicker; they also wrap cold and wet white sheets around their body, and by focusing and concentrating on making their own body radiate heat, they actually warm up the sheets and dry them out, in a matter of hours. Lets see YOU try to do that.

When you are under a deep hypnosis, and you are being told that you are being touched with a white-hot poker, (when in, reality, all I really touched you with, was with my finger) you will develop a burn/blister on that exact same spot....and not even realize it what happened until you snap out of the hypnosis...
People (including my aunt) have hired hypnotists to help them successfully quit smoking cigarettes. My aunt says the hypnotist (who recorded their session on tape) ?told? her that everytime she tries to smoke, she will feel as if shes licking and eating what is at the bottom of an ashtray, and she actually vomited when she did try it later in the future. She hasn?t smoked ever since, despite nicotine?s deadly addictiveness, which is largely physical as well as mental.

If you are constantly sad and unhappy and hate yourself and hate the world...chances are very high that your body will follow right along with that. You'll be more prone to getting sick, catching colds, and spiraling yourself even further down the road of depression.
Mind and body work TOGETHER.


There are PLENTY of examples of how mind and body are inextricably interlinked.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that you can turn your skin bullet-proof.
But I believe that most of what we call 'reality' is shaped by our own minds. Reality is like a semi-flexible steel rod.... it can be bent to your mind's desire, whether that desire is of your own programming or society's programming (which unfortunately, it is most of the time), but you can't always 'break' the steel rod.

And Phluck, I agree with what facts have come through based on scientific observations and so on, that Cancer is caused by mutations, yes yes yes, we can go all the way down to the root CORE of what today's science can observe and study and conclude what causes it...let's say that mutations IS the root core of what causes cancer. BUT, what causes THAT?

Here is a link discussing the The Six Conditions, or Factors, that Constitute the Distinctive Personality of the Cancer Patient that can Predispose One to Develop a Cancer


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Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: SkorpivoMusterion]
    #2248091 - 01/17/04 12:30 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

"When you are under a deep hypnosis, and you are been told that you are being touched with a white-hot poker, (when in, reality, all I really touched you with, was with my finger) you will develop a burn/blister on that exact same spot....and not even realize it what happened until you snap out of the hypnosis... "

I am almost certain that this is 100% myth. Even though your link seems to claim otherwise. Then again, your link also claims that observing two patients counts as a scientific experiment.

"BUT, what causes THAT?"
Tons of things. There is no evidence that the mind can cause mutation. There is no known mechanism of the mind that could do anything known to cause mutation.

https://umdrive.memphis.edu/absorin/www/Ch7PP/tsld016.htm
http://www.breedlovefoundation.org/news_4.html
http://ehpnet1.niehs.nih.gov/docs/1996/Suppl-3/venitt.html


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: The Mind Body Connection [Re: Phluck]
    #2248111 - 01/17/04 12:55 PM (17 years, 10 months ago)

known by science


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