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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #21281817 -

Cognitive_Shift said:
The delusions of reference are clear cut symptoms of schizophrenia related mental illness.  The whole "time wave" is a delusion of reference that even he eventually figured out was full of shit.


I'm not sure that you understand Mckenna, he was far from mentally ill or delusional, first, he was generating novel thought, he would even tell you very little of it has any basis in truth, its designed to provoke novel and unique thought patterns, it was suposed to lift you out of your cognitive comfort zone and break habbits in thinking.

Mckenna was providing entertainment in his lectures, but if you listen to what he had to say about how he actually viewed the world, he was very logical, scientific, and reality based.

Mckenna himself would tell you that there's no truth in his crazy theorys, and he didn't believe in them in the conventional sense anyway, he would say the things he said to try to establish a new form in philosophical thought and encourage non-habbitual thought structure, he did not actually believe most of his speculations.

People all want to focus on his wild ideas,  which, for one were speculation, second, were entertainment, and third, we meant to be used as metaphorical models for a new strain in philosophical thought.

I think the psychedelic community actually owes mckenna a great debt weather they realize it or not. Mckenna was an outspoken advocate on psychedelic rights,mckenna provided one of the first grow guides bringing mushroom cultivation to the common man,  he founded botanical dimentions a green house which saves medicinal and entheogenic plants as well as the culture that came with them for future generations, and he set the stage for how we veiw psychedelics today, mckenna has done so much for psychedelics and the psychedelic community, even if most psychedelicos are not aware of his contributions.

-E. Borodin

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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #21281920 -

Quote:
I'm not sure that you understand Mckenna, he was far from... delusional


What would you call a man who believed that his mind-blowing mushroom trip was the basis for the transformation of all mankind? (See: 'True Hallucinations')


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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #21283651 -

His personality and symptoms are pretty cut and dry mental illness or boarder line.  Have you ever read how he actually came up with the theory?  His mothers death, his birthday, a future eclipse the date of the atomic bomb all of these were "for him to find out" aka delusion of reference.  Believe it or not there aren't hidden messages in the newspaper for you to find out :lol:

His time wave theory had no credible math to back it up, it's not science because there is no unit for novelty.  It's a crock of shit my friend.

Mckenna had some interesting ideas about culture and he was a highly intelligent person, but what he really was was a story teller and knew how to get people to listen to him.

He changed the "eschoton" date more times then I can count.  He straight up lied about his "theory" and the mayan calender matching up by coincidence.

He is a liar, but a really good story teller and smarter then 99% of people


--------------------
L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

Edited by Cognitive_Shift (02/17/15 09:59 AM)

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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #21286628 -

OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:
I'm not sure that you understand Mckenna, he was far from... delusional


What would you call a man who believed that his mind-blowing mushroom trip was the basis for the transformation of all mankind? (See: 'True Hallucinations')


Mckenna was far from crazy, he was NOT delusional, and he was no fool

Mckenna is the most misunderstood figure in psychedelia, and due to is hyperactive intellect and love for word play, he pulls some sly quadrouple-entendre tricks that make understanding of his lectures only accessable to the cleaver and  those with the right set of ears,.

He did NOT believe any of it. It was SPECULATION, they were far-out ideas that were put in place for entertainment purposes, to break habbitual thought patterns, they were suposed to be more of a form of art that statements of truth, and regardless these ideas had NOTHING to do with what Mckenna personally believed,  this is what the guy did for a living, it was a job.

I still think that just because most people were unable to understand what he was doing, is no excuse to ignore his many valuable contributions to the psychedelic community.

https://archive.org/details/PsychedeliaRawArchivesOfTerenceMckennaTalks

I travel a lot, the link above has free download of every mckenna lecture, while on long trips I have managed to listen to every lecture. 

-E. Borodin

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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #21286655 -

Ofcourse with every speaker you have to take what they say with a grain of salt. TM would say things in order to get people to get off their asses and do things Noone has done before. And to do that, he would have to get a little wild with his ideas. He would always talk about his own ideas with the same level of scrutiny that anyone here COULD give his talks. Which is the only reason I've given his lectures so much time.
Self empowerment, mental/psychedelic experimentation and exploration of the psyche are what he would put on the table. A table, I may say, many people in history don't even sit at, let alone contribute to so thoroughly.


--------------------
The mushroom is love.
The mushroom is life.
Eateth of the fruit body
And you will become one with everything.


Edited by Mind-Rip (02/17/15 07:29 AM)

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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Mind-Rip]
    #21286678 -

..AND it led HIM to have such a major bummer on magic mushrooms that despite all this 'clever talk only clever people could understand', he apparently didn't have the balls to share his bummer on magic mushrooms with his audience, yet carried on promoting 'heroic doses' with them

why?

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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #21286685 -

Coincidentiaoppositorum said:
OrgoneConclusion said:
Quote:
I'm not sure that you understand Mckenna, he was far from... delusional


What would you call a man who believed that his mind-blowing mushroom trip was the basis for the transformation of all mankind? (See: 'True Hallucinations')


Mckenna was far from crazy, he was NOT delusional, and he was no fool

Mckenna is the most misunderstood figure in psychedelia, and due to is hyperactive intellect and love for word play, he pulls some sly quadrouple-entendre tricks that make understanding of his lectures only accessable to the cleaver and  those with the right set of ears,.

He did NOT believe any of it. It was SPECULATION, they were far-out ideas that were put in place for entertainment purposes, to break habbitual thought patterns, they were suposed to be more of a form of art that statements of truth, and regardless these ideas had NOTHING to do with what Mckenna personally believed,  this is what the guy did for a living, it was a job.

I still think that just because most people were unable to understand what he was doing, is no excuse to ignore his many valuable contributions to the psychedelic community.

https://archive.org/details/PsychedeliaRawArchivesOfTerenceMckennaTalks

I travel a lot, the link above has free download of every mckenna lecture, while on long trips I have managed to listen to every lecture. 

-E. Borodin


Thanks for this link BEETEEDUBS


--------------------
The mushroom is love.
The mushroom is life.
Eateth of the fruit body
And you will become one with everything.


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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Mind-Rip]
    #21286712 -

I recently had a problem with dmt because it made me panicky so I couldn't enjoy it so I posted here about it. And because I'm a huge advocate for it I was having problems with this happening obviously. I was told to take a break and come to terms with maybe it's not for me anymore but it may still help others. I think this is the position TM was in. His past with the mushroom was still valid and so was his experience. I can't say why he kept that particular piece of information from the public. Perhaps he didn't want to just drop his followers on their heads because they might feel duped and mislead. Missing the aforementioned validity of past information.

His role was to inspire people. Not necessarily make them do drugs.


--------------------
The mushroom is love.
The mushroom is life.
Eateth of the fruit body
And you will become one with everything.


Edited by Mind-Rip (02/17/15 07:49 AM)

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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Mind-Rip]
    #21287004 -

well that is your view but I just don't buy it. I think what he went through was too deep for him to deal with and share. it involved him seeing life and the universe as totally meaningless.

This is a good article: Terence McKenna’s strange duplicity

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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: zzripz]
    #21292302 -

zzripz said:
..AND it led HIM to have such a major bummer on magic mushrooms that despite all this 'clever talk only clever people could understand', he apparently didn't have the balls to share his bummer on magic mushrooms with his audience, yet carried on promoting 'heroic doses' with them

why?


So because he ended his exploration of psilocybe fungi on a heavy trip, everything he ever learned on other trips stops being relevant?


I'm burned out on this arguement, if you don't get it, you don't get it.

I think I have put up a good arguement, and I feel at one point or another I said everything that needed to be said, you can keep bringing up things to argue about, but the appropriate reply has already been said in my previous posts, so instead of having to write the same thing over and over and over only in a slightly different way, you could just take your arguement point, and reference it to one of my previous replies. Or we could just argree to disagree on this one....

-eleusis borodin

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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #21292315 -

In response to mind-rip:

Its no problem, I downloaded all of the lectures from that link onto my kindle, its become a valuable reseaorce concerning my mckenna collection, plus if you travel a lot those lectures really help kill the time.

-eleusis borodin

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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Mind-Rip]
    #21292322 -

Mind-Rip said:
This is true but he had become the voice that showed others what free thinking and the understanding of the importance of direct experience can do in the world. And to suddenly say "I had a really bad experience, everyone change because if it" wouldn't be fair to the values that he'd laid down for so many years.


So instead of embracing change in his philosophical thought he continued to spout things that were no longer true to him personally simply because of the momentum/traction they had gained years earlier? If Man has  duty to be fair it should be to himself, not abstract and outdated values. Sounds like the rationale of a huckster...

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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #21292326 -

As for the link regarding mckenna in zzripz post, ill read through it, but also keep this in mind:

http://www.gnosticmedia.com/McKenna-Agent

The paper above claims mckenna was a fed, it even provides tons of "evidence"

When it comes to what someone else has to say about mckenna I take it with a grain of salt, when it comes to figuring out mckenna, I listen to the things he personally said, not the things others had to say about him...

-E. Borodin

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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Revok]
    #21292346 -

KafkasDog said:
Mind-Rip said:
This is true but he had become the voice that showed others what free thinking and the understanding of the importance of direct experience can do in the world. And to suddenly say "I had a really bad experience, everyone change because if it" wouldn't be fair to the values that he'd laid down for so many years.


So instead of embracing change in his philosophical thought he continued to spout things that were no longer true to him personally simply because of the momentum/traction they had gained years earlier? If Man has  duty to be fair it should be to himself, not abstract and outdated values. Sounds like the rationale of a huckster...


Its not hard to understand why he promoted entheogen use even after he stopped using psilocybe fungi., He would tell others how mushrooms had taught him so many amazing things he could not have learned any other way, so he encouraged others to do the same.

He had a bad trip and stopped there, but he still learned so much from all of his past trips that he still felt it was important for others to at least know that this path exists.

Again I'm burned out on all this, seriously if you look at all my previous posts, the appropriate response to even this had already been said....

-e. Borodin

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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #21292351 -

Terence Mckenna was a great speaker, However, I feel like he got sucked into his magic world a bit too deep


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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #21292380 -

If your not into mckenna your not into mckenna, and that's 100% fine.

But again, if you consider yourself part of the psychedelic community, you owe Terence mckenna a great debt for all of his many real world contributions, weather you realize it or not.

Maybe instead of focusing on his ideas, you should look at the real world work he did, botanical dimentions is still being run by mckennas ex-wife Kathleen Harrison and other figures in the psychedelic community such as Ralph metzner. Though his contributions go far deeper than just botanical dimentions, ive already gone over all this in another post.

-e. Borodin

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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Coincidentiaoppositorum]
    #21292398 -

I agree McKenna had some realy inspiring thoughts. He was a great man.


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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Albertheisenhouer]
    #21292666 -

alright then, take a look at this where Mckenna is in his element talking about so-called H+.

What are your reviews of this?


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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: zzripz]
    #21292680 -

:cheer:



--------------------

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Re: Terence Mckennas Novelty Theory [Re: Sun King]
    #21293566 -

That quote in red he is talking about the other (aliens) not the FBI silly goose

Some guy named jan I forget his last name started this disinformation campaign.  Under close observation and scrutiny there is no evidence what so ever he was a CI.


--------------------
L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

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