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InvisibleMOTH
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How do you know when you experience ego-loss?
    #2115529 - 11/17/03 10:00 AM (13 years, 9 months ago)

...and how to achieve it? Is it just something that happens to you? Do you feel like you've lost time when you lose your ego? What does it feel like, exactly?


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Invisiblekaiowas
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: MOTH]
    #2115550 - 11/17/03 10:14 AM (13 years, 9 months ago)

everything is input.  your sight, sound, smell, and taste, all input, that mesh together to create your reality that you seem to be in.  you'll find when you experience ego-loss, that you think you may be dead, visions go and come back, hearing cuts out, the senses cease to sense what they are "supposed" to be sensing.  you don't know who you are, or where you are at, but that's even not your concern.  only the experience at hand is what matters to "you"  but there is no you, you are everything, including time.  you mesh with the your surroundings, words can't describe because there ARE NO WORDS. no talking.  at all. non, jsut remember that you'll come back :smile:.  some have an OBE.  it's different for everyone.


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: kaiowas]
    #2115650 - 11/17/03 11:11 AM (13 years, 9 months ago)

> ...and how to achieve it?

Through paradox. If you try for egoloss, it will elude you. If you don't try for egoloss, how do you find it? More on this later...

> Is it just something that happens to you?

Yes.

> Do you feel like you've lost time when you lose your ego? What does it feel like, exactly?

This is hard. I can't put into words the feelings that occur during egoloss... the experience is beyond categorization, which makes it difficult to describe. It isn't that you don't have awareness during egoloss, but rather that you experience without judgement... good and bad become the same thing, time becomes an illusion, etc...

Because the egoloss world is so alien, compared to our everyday reality, it is difficult to put into words or to even to think about what happened during the experience. You get a sense of what ocurred, but you cannot grasp it with logic.

Egoloss is like getting lost... it just happens. You won't realize it has happened until after it is over. Coming out of egoloss back to reality is like getting shot out of a cannon. The first time this happened to me, I felt a panic come over me as I realized that I was dead, and then shot back to reality with an "oh-fuck, what just happened?" It took several days before I could begin to grasp the vastness of what I had experienced.

Donno that this helps much... kind of like describing what the color red looks like to somebody that is blind. Words fail.


--------------------
Just another spore in the wind.


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InvisibleXochitl
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: MOTH]
    #2116096 - 11/17/03 01:21 PM (13 years, 9 months ago)

You do not experience ego-loss, rather the experience simply is. Your life is revealed to be just one more thread in the cosmic, eternal braid; your life ceases to be the only perpective.

womb.
death.


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As we know, there are known knowns. There are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns. That is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns, the ones we don't know we don't know.

-Donald Rumsfeld 2/2/02 Pentagon


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Offlinedjd586
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: Seuss]
    #2116140 - 11/17/03 01:31 PM (13 years, 9 months ago)

Seuss pretty much hit the nail on the head with his post.

The best way I can describe ego loss is this. Being something else, someone else, someplace else, or some unique form of energy and never having a single thought that there was a you as you know yourself now. Not knowing that there is or ever was a you.

You'll be a dew drop on a leaf of a plant and it'll seem just as nutual as it seems to be walking down the street in everyday life as you are now.


--------------------

Phase 1... collect underpants... phase 2...??? ... Phase 3 - PROFIT!


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OfflinePDU
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: djd586]
    #2116257 - 11/17/03 01:52 PM (13 years, 9 months ago)

Ego - loss eh....

How do you know? While, there's been some good suggestions already, i would describe it as;

The moment when all sensory input and consequently physical output on your behalf stops. Its when your brain shuts your body down completely and fools the mind, the mind shuts down its defense's and you loose all sense of every-body that restricts you, no gravity, no rules, no laws, no physics, no humanly constraints, no *memory or knowledge* to influence your thoughts, Just you processing every aspect of life/humanity/future.

Your brain receiving input through taste, sight, hearing, smell, and sensory receptors is processing these minute electrical signals and reacting appropriately, everysingle second of everysingle day. With egoloss, these outside stimulus are cut off, and you are left with nothing but the functioning ability of pure imagination. You might see your entire life flash by on metaphysical cards, you might float, or die, you might enter a realm with teachers, or you might just be a pure beam of light traveling at the speed of light through your neural network processing every imaginable aspect of your psyche - However, how this processing manifests itself to you, can be freightening or feel like overload. Since there will be no *rules* or *decency* applying - it's just you and whatever can come up in your mind.

Reading Ketamine - metaprogramming from the eye of the storm, Last nite offered me alot of insight into this. A *dream* is simply random blocks of memory resurging and combining at a completely random cycle, to create some sort of structured imaginary reality. I feel that the same could be said for a trip, especially an egoloss one. Its all you, what you experience through egoloss, its all there, its all in your head .. and you may or may not have the ability to sway your experience in the direction you want using the content youve accumulated to use at your disposal.

Anyways, you'll certainly know when it hits you.

The first few times i *looked out for it* and *waited* for my "ego to be crushed*, and i can tell you, The analytical approach just wont work.


--------------------
GO OUTSIDE.


Edited by PDU (11/17/03 01:54 PM)


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: PDU]
    #2116403 - 11/17/03 02:22 PM (13 years, 9 months ago)

> Anyways, you'll certainly know when it hits you.

Actually, you won't know until after it hits you... at least if what I have experienced is egoloss.

> The analytical approach just wont work.

The first time egoloss hit me was when I was sitting in the bathroom trying to figure out the mathmatics behind the visuals I was seeing in the carpet. I got so involved with trying to understand the math behind the movements that I wasn't aware of getting lost. Once I realized that I was lost, I then shot back to reality in a panic.


--------------------
Just another spore in the wind.


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Invisiblekaiowas
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: Seuss]
    #2118164 - 11/17/03 10:15 PM (13 years, 9 months ago)

damn seuss, you must be quite the strong thinker to be doing math while shroomin.  no way I could ever do such a thing with my pea brain :lol: 


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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Offlinedjd586
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: kaiowas]
    #2118667 - 11/18/03 01:14 AM (13 years, 9 months ago)

lol... Try opening a math text book and try figuring that shit out while you're tripping. You'll relaize that all you are is an unblanced equation.


--------------------

Phase 1... collect underpants... phase 2...??? ... Phase 3 - PROFIT!


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Invisiblekaiowas
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: djd586]
    #2119033 - 11/18/03 05:23 AM (13 years, 9 months ago)

hehye, I've taken differential equations, but still while I'm tripping??? no way!!!!!!


--------------------
Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.---senior doobie


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Offlinecastaway
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: MOTH]
    #2119041 - 11/18/03 05:40 AM (13 years, 9 months ago)

Re: "What does it feel like, exactly"

Kinda like the feeling we feel during uninhibited sex?

orgasmic?

selfless?


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: castaway]
    #2119071 - 11/18/03 06:42 AM (13 years, 9 months ago)

> damn seuss, you must be quite the strong thinker to be doing math while shroomin.

Actually, it was acid... and I was thinking that the effect would make one kick ass screen saver, if only I could model it... never did figure out the patterns...  :grin:

> Try opening a math text book and try figuring that shit out while you're tripping.

Actually, give something like curved space or relativity a read before you dose.  It tends to set your mind down an analytical path when the trip kicks in... very interesting experience.


--------------------
Just another spore in the wind.


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OfflineDailyPot
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: castaway]
    #2120205 - 11/18/03 04:49 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

You'll know when you experience it :smile: It is so different there is no mistaking it even if you dont know what it is. Its hard to describe but you will have no doubt once you have it.
Quote:

castaway said:
Re: "What does it feel like, exactly"

Kinda like the feeling we feel during uninhibited sex?

orgasmic?

selfless? 



Ummm, well its more selfless than organsmic lol but even selfless...its just a word, ego-loss is not just a word. Any description would fall short because it has limits and boundaries and meaning.


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: MOTH]
    #2120415 - 11/18/03 06:11 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

The best book I have read about ego loss and how to achieve it is, "The Psychadelic Experience" by Timothy Leary.

It is a very easy to read book.... and it is a good place to start. I recomend everyone read this book. If you like it, DL some of Leary's recorded works and listen to them while shrooming. I like "You can be anyone" and "How to Operate your Brain".

I read "The Psychadelic Experience" years ago and achieved ego loss with 1.5g of dried cubes.

My gf did the same last week and achieved her first ego loss with less than 10g wet.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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Offlinehuxmush
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: Rose]
    #2120773 - 11/18/03 08:14 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

I find this topic very interesting, albeit confusing.

On a 2.5g trip I experienced what I would have considered ego-loss - assuming ego-loss is just a loss of sense of self:

My eyes were open, and ears were hearing music etc. so I was receiving sensory input from the 'outside' world. However at the same time the concept of "I" didn't exist. The experience simply was. I had no ears to hear with, I had no eyes to see with. There was no I. I was in the moment, was part of the moment. The moment just was. This might be what people talk about when they 'become one' with everything although I didn't feel a connectedness, because there wasn't anything to connect to or from. I don't know how long I experienced this state, but it was very pleasant. I came 'back' to my sense of self and just thought 'wow', that experience was nice.

On a later 3.0g journey I either went further, or somewhere else. In this case unfortunately I don't remember the actual experience at the time, so much as the 'coming back'. Here's a summary, but it will be sorely lacking. You also have to keep in mind that its all relative, so at the point I had a concept of work - I didn't know what it was, when I last did it, (conceptually at this point "time" basically consisted of 'before now', 'now', 'later' with no concept of units of measurement...) just that work 'existed' in some form, and whatever it was seemed very far away, I just knew it existed and was somehow related to something. Summary:

- Void / Blank / Don't remember, don't know.... complete lack of anything.
- I am experiencing something
- If I am experiencing something, where the hell was I, how did I get here? (NB: Not who - but where?)
- Visually the place seems familiar - have I been here before, have I always been here? No - there was a 'lack' of experience 'before now'.
- I can see something. This experience, whatever it is, is quite unpleasant.
- I feel I've been in this place I see here now 'before', but I have been other places that are not this one.
- I am existing, there is a 'me'. I do not like this current existence, will it always be like this?
- Some realisation that this existence is a result of 'drugs' whatever they are. Am I always 'on drugs'? Is this what my existence is? Is this permanent? What am I meant to do? I don't like it.
- It is 'today' and I am in the place I 'live on drugs'.
- I ingested some mushrooms at some time 'today' before the 'void'. I think they should wear off 'after now'. I _really_ hope they wear off?
- The concept of 'today' will end at some point, and is related to something called sleep, but not too sure what that is...?
- I don't like this, I want the 'drugs' to turn off, to be over.. hurry up...I want to be the 'normal' me I vaguely remember being which was not like this experience, it was the experience I used to have before the 'void'.
- There's something called work. I used to do it, I may have to do it again, although not sure when, or when I used to do it. Or what it was.
- I have a wife. I _really_ miss her at the moment. Can she reach me here? Can I reach her from here? Am I stuck? What will happen?
- Yes, yes, I'm starting to 'understand'/remember more stuff about my 'life'. I don't like having to understand stuff from where I am currently, it doesn't feel right, and is uncomfortable. Have I 'broken' myself?
- I am tripping, I somehow went to far, and I want it to stop - how do you turn it off?
- Further gaining of basic, immediate concepts (the house, rooms, doors, walls) - some easier, some struggling. Still really don't 'relate' to anything at all however. It all seems alien. I just happen to be here in it.
- Start to wander around the house, and vaguely recognising stuff, and being able to associate it with 'me' at a very loose level.
.
?
.
- Try and use the computer. Think I can find out some information about the state I'm in. Look in newsgroups but everything still seems alien. Letters are appearing back to front, and what people are talking about is too hard to grasp. Give up.
.
?
.
- Continue re-remembering some concepts and recover a bit more memory, particularly shorter term, or very long term.
.
?
.
- Wife comes home and I tell her I missed her *a lot*. Remember / understand more stuff...
.
- Get to the point where I can confirm with wife what month it was (still had no idea what year).
- Continual further re-establishments / increases in understanding of concepts (e.g. will have to go to sleep tonight, what a year is, work on Monday, I sometimes ride a bike, I will have dinner tonight etc. etc.)
- Starting to feel relieved that I start feel like 'me', and I 'get' myself, and I am definitely on the way back.
.
.
- Eventual baseline, and much much relief

As you can probably tell, this was very frightening and very unpleasant (and still hard to recall properly), and leaves me with many more questions than answers...

Even though I experienced those things, I still can't explain it, or even understand it much at all. The limitations of communication are clearly a problem here, as someone who thinks they are describing ego-loss, there are a heck of a lot of "I"'s in the previous paragraphs.....

Has anyone else experienced similar, and do you equate the first and/or second with ego-loss?


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OfflineNoviseer
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: huxmush]
    #2120848 - 11/18/03 08:51 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

I've had two experiences like that one, although they only lasted a short period of time (but it was a moment of infinity, you know?)

My first breakthrough on salvia was much like that.

Waking up after losing consciousness from too much nitrous oxide was like that too, although not at all unpleasant for some reason. It took me about 30 seconds of laying on the ground to figure out that I was a person with an identity, and then another minute to realize I was at a party, and eventually would have to figure out how to get home. then my consciousness came flooding back in and I was immediately back to baseline. I smoked weed shortly thereafter and had the best cannabis experience of my life, although I didn't smoke all that much. I was so cleanly, euphorically, deeply, intensely yet lucidly high... it was great


--------------------
_______________________________________________________________
namaste said:
no flamz in da ODD, if you got nothing to contribute then keep yo lips zipped
_________________________________________________________________


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Offlineenergy_ball_within
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: Noviseer]
    #2121963 - 11/19/03 07:16 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

my 2nd to last experience on lsd went something like this..... and this was complete ego-loss. theres no doubt at all that i experienced ego-loss on this one experience.

> took a 1x1 inch square of some potent lsd (some new person i never met who was new to laying down lsd on blotter. from what ive heard)

> 20 minutes later i was on the floor spread out.

> i was not me, i was not i, i was not. there was nothing in my mind that could relate me to what i was experiencing. there was nothing there to grasp onto, cause all was foriegn and new, but at the same time so real.

there were different realms of which i traveled from and into. i call these demensions. i could remember one of them that was so spectacular in color that it literally seemed like a large, long, short room with nothing but vibrant patterns and color(i could also recognise something of which looked like a fireplace, but i wasnt sure cause no fire place existed within this demension or ever within my mind(i was spread out next to my fireplace though during this experience). there was this other demension which was evil in my eyes, but still so crazy i couldnt make sense of it at all, cause there was no sense to be made. in this one demension i remember getting up(im not sure how i did this) on all fours and seeing my friend who was melting literally before my eyes. he went from megadeath old man look to muscles to what seemed like bone to nothing and then i went back to the floor after puking. its wierd cause no matter how i didnt relate i somehow spouted out, "chris, what are you doing here?".

i was now back on the floor for another couple of hrs. i dont remember too much what happened or what other demensions i entered, but i can surely say those two werent the only ones i was placed into. before hand i was telling my friends to call my mother, cause i was dead and i was missing her alot even though i was dead. they told me later on thats when i was gone and i was just spouting out numbers, then slurred jibberish. everything became geometric patterns that were so intense that even my cat i remember her face turning into like a block with sides that flowed to the ends of the room i was in. this was right before i was gone for good(well not for good). the room was filled with flowers and flower wallpaper, cause this is how my mother liked it, so now i was thrown into this flower power room and all of it engulfed me and the ceiling started to come down to where i was. i can remember that quite vividly, cause thats when the first demension came when i mentioned the short, long, vibrant color demension.

i can remember at times that i was flowing in what seemed to be a water state within my mind or other demension. too many colors, not enough grasp on this perception of reality, and losing my mind is what set me back yrs. only now can i reflect on all this without being scared. i couldnt talk of this back then nor did i think i could ever. i always felt my days were numbered after that experience and so i did what was natural "nothing". ive done nothing since up until a yr ago when i finally realised that this new perception(well nto new, cause its been with me now for 5-6yrs) of this reality is something i will need to understand and flow with instead of losing it and running away. i read alot now and try to educate myself on every aspect of life i can.

this experience was nothing short of ego-loss. call it what you may "ego-loss" or whatever, but there is nothing to prepare you for such an adventure into your own perceptions of "this".

i gotta say though once i came out it was the best trip ever. i came to about 8 hrs later to the cat in the hat cartoon on tv. i now had a huge smile on my face and didnt even know what the cartoon was or how it appeared. then i saw my puke on the floor and decided i needed to clean it up, so i got the vacuum cleaner and started to go up and down with the flow of the carpet which took on a wave like ocean which reached what looked like 2 feet in height and then back down to reveal a new wave. trying to clean the carpet was a trip in itself considering i never turned the vacuum on. haha. i forgot to mention one of my friends gave me 2 valums to try and calm my heart down during this crazy time without my knowledge at all. when i came out i saw one pill covered in saliva sitting on the window sill, so i ate it and i dont know why, but i ate it(i didnt even know what it was at the moment). this(the trip) is something i still try to understand and relate to, but its difficult to understand something of which no one can describe or relate to........... there are others out there who have achieved ego-loss, but there is no relativity to each others experience. just stories to tell around the camp fire.
-------------------------

i wish i could have said this better and actually to the t and in order, but like i said it was hard to understand and therefore alot of it has been lost within my mind back in the old files i cant checkout within my file cabinet in my head.

ego-loss? or better yet i call it " ".


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OfflineBruiser
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: MOTH]
    #2122255 - 11/19/03 11:29 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

All I can say, has already been said, but you'll know it when it happens.(actually after)  I wasn't expecting it when it happened to me, and quite frankly, it thought I was dead. I had absolutly no comprhension at all of shapes, words, or sounds. A that point, I have no doubt in my mind, that I know what it was like to be dead. I don't consider it to be a "bad trip" necessarily, but it frightened me. In fact it still does to this day, when I think about it. I have daymares about it when I think about it. I've tripped since then, and have had  extremly wonderful trips and felt things that cannot be explained, but I will never ever forget that one experience and how it made me feel. :frown: I do not suggest anyone goes looking for it, unless they are ready to deal with what they will find. It's quite humbling, and definately not for everybody. 


--------------------
-I put the chrome to your dome


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OfflineSeussA
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: Bruiser]
    #2122545 - 11/19/03 01:27 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

> I do not suggest anyone goes looking for it, unless they are ready to deal with what they will find. It's quite humbling, and definately not for everybody.

Sometimes the reflection in the mirror is not what we want to see.


--------------------
Just another spore in the wind.


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OfflineBruiser
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Re: How do you know when you experience ego-loss? [Re: Seuss]
    #2122688 - 11/19/03 02:31 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

:thumbup: 


--------------------
-I put the chrome to your dome


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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics >> The Psychedelic Experience

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* pinpoint ego loss?
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