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Offlined33p
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: Toddo]
    #3062804 - 08/28/04 05:20 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

PDU said:
Ego - loss eh....

How do you know? While, there's been some good suggestions already, i would describe it as;

The moment when all sensory input and consequently physical output on your behalf stops. Its when your brain shuts your body down completely and fools the mind, the mind shuts down its defense's and you loose all sense of every-body that restricts you, no gravity, no rules, no laws, no physics, no humanly constraints, no *memory or knowledge* to influence your thoughts, Just you processing every aspect of life/humanity/future.

Your brain receiving input through taste, sight, hearing, smell, and sensory receptors is processing these minute electrical signals and reacting appropriately, everysingle second of everysingle day. With egoloss, these outside stimulus are cut off, and you are left with nothing but the functioning ability of pure imagination. You might see your entire life flash by on metaphysical cards, you might float, or die, you might enter a realm with teachers, or you might just be a pure beam of light traveling at the speed of light through your neural network processing every imaginable aspect of your psyche - However, how this processing manifests itself to you, can be freightening or feel like overload. Since there will be no *rules* or *decency* applying - it's just you and whatever can come up in your mind.

Reading Ketamine - metaprogramming from the eye of the storm, Last nite offered me alot of insight into this. A *dream* is simply random blocks of memory resurging and combining at a completely random cycle, to create some sort of structured imaginary reality. I feel that the same could be said for a trip, especially an egoloss one. Its all you, what you experience through egoloss, its all there, its all in your head .. and you may or may not have the ability to sway your experience in the direction you want using the content youve accumulated to use at your disposal.

Anyways, you'll certainly know when it hits you.

The first few times i *looked out for it* and *waited* for my "ego to be crushed*, and i can tell you, The analytical approach just wont work.




--------------------
I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang


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Invisiblemyndreach
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: d33p]
    #3064134 - 08/29/04 12:59 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

Just thought I'd add, that last night I had an egoloss experience. I had about 3 or 3.5 grams dried, and made tea.

It was a great trip.

The part where I had the ecstatic moment was after about 1.5 hours after drinking my tea. I laid down on my back with my eyes shut, and put my headphones on and listened to The Passion cd by Peter Gabriel. It's his score to The Last Temptation of Christ.

Anyways, it was amazing. I listened to about 6 tracks, and it was amazing. I got up, got a drink of water.

When I came back, I laid back and told myself to let go and give in. I laid down again, and as I shut my eye and hit play, I told myself to lose myself. As track seven started, I pictured these small creatures moving everything in the house away. At first it was a bit scary, but I gave into the experience and gave up. In my mind's eye, when everything was taken away, they turned to me and began dissasembling me as well starting at my feet. There was also this huge devider that came down and was splitting my body into two halves. The music was perfect for this.

All that was left was my head it felt, and I was arching my head back into the carpet in ecstatic breathes. Then the 1:50 second part of "A Different Drum" hit (track 7), where Peter Gabriel begins singing (not words, just humming in a way) and the music swells. It pushed me over the edge, and I began having uncontrollable fits of crying, laughing, heavy hard breathing, and really just "lost myself" for a couple minutes, blown into stardust. The only thing that was left was my emotions. It was amazing.

After this part of the music passed, I came back to reality for a moment and opened my eyes. My wife had come into the room, so I stopped the music and spent the rest of the night talking to her. It was great :smile:


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OfflineHugh_Jass
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: ninjapixie]
    #3064759 - 08/29/04 10:45 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

ninjapixie said:
So true. I think the ego exists only in language. Egoloss is moving into non-verbal reality and shutting down that little running commentary inside your head that tries to put everything into words. When you stop trying to analyse everything with language, your sense of self disappears, you become the experience instead of the experience happens to you, and your sense of time disappears as you move into the eternal now.




This is slightly off-topic but I've always wondered what mechanics people who are born deaf use to think. They've never heard anyone speak before so they musnt hear that comentary we are all used to? But if they can read and write and communicate through sign language, do they think without verbalised words/commentary or devlop their own? I imagine they would still be able to imagine sounds? Is this way of thinking more fluid?

If im tripping on my own I always get VERY frustrated by internal conversations, they get too intense and I fry my head being on the verge of a revelation, I KNOW something but cant put it into a string of words.


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OfflineMarkostheGnostic
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: Toddo]
    #3065028 - 08/29/04 12:29 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

Ego-loss is a misnomer. Ego is a psychological term which refers to one's individual point-of-view or perspective. We ordinarily identify ouselves by the ego-perspective, but in expanded states of consciousness, we discover that we are Really awareness - first and foremost, and only secondarily a discrete, separate ego. This is the fundamental truth that Buddhism speaks to. When the ego recedes into the background, and pure awareness looms larger-than-life, we may realize that Reality - us included - is fundamentally Consciousness.

I mention Buddhism because Buddhist psychology is very much older and much more precise than Western psychological schools, regardless of which one we speak of. These psychological insights apply to the Christian, Jew, Muslim or any other world religion because Consciousness is the modern word for Spirit, and religions are primarily about spiritual Reality. However, while Buddhism uses psychological terminology, most other world religions use mythological terminolgy to convey truths. Mythological language is much more 'personified,' which means that states of Consciousness [Spirit] are described as beings, as persons. So, for example, when Saint Paul talks about ego-loss, about being 'in the Spirit,' he says: "I live, yet not I; Christ liveth within me."

So-called ego-loss means a 'higher' level of perception with 'spiritual eyes' ( or 'I').
"If thine eye be single, thy body shall be full of light." Many of the sayings of the New Testament only make sense on a mystical level (as opposed to literal, allegorical or symbolic levels). Jewish scriptural interpretation understands this, the average literal reader has absolutely no idea.

Because modern people think psychologically (psychology has been the main philosophy of moderns for well over 100 years) they do not realize that older cultures thought (and still attempt to) think mythologically. This is one of the reasons many young people disregard the Bible as a source of Wisdom - they do not understand or know how to translate mythological language into modern usable language.

Lastly, ego-loss is a positive thing taken if one is talking about mystical religious experience. It can be horrifyingly pathological when ego-loss occurs in psychosis, and one's ego is replaced by uncontrolled contents of the unconscious. Of course, it is this second possibility that has always been used to frighten off the user of psychedelics.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


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InvisibleGnuBobo
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: Toddo]
    #3066590 - 08/29/04 08:00 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

    I'm wondering if anyone here has experienced clinical depression to the point of getting seriously sucidal (e.g. having the gun in your mouth). 
    I was struck with clinical depression due to an extended illness.  I'm much better now, but I really don't feel  the same as before dealing with acute depression.  I sort of want to call it "detached" but this isn't really the correct word.  I suppose there is something of a "borrowed time" feeling about my life right now.
    I've used acid, 'shrooms, ecstasy back in college.  I was standing alone in the Amsterdam red light district tripping out waiting for my roommate to finish with a prostitute.  I mean, I've been frightened while tripping.  Confused, scared, etc.
      But since being so depressed, and using the fruits of my own labors, it's sort of been like my experiences have been quite different.  I feel like I have control, understanding of the lens I'm viewing the world through. 
      I'm interested in getting to "ego-loss," but I was wondering if others have had a similar experience with depression and entheogens?  Right on.  Thanks all. :grin:

GB


--------------------
Jerry Garcia. JERRY GARCIA! JERRY GARCIA!!!!


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Offlinedonkey_lipz
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Registered: 07/27/04
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: GnuBobo]
    #3066924 - 08/29/04 09:22 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

I still cant decide whether or not im going to try mushrooms. All this talk about ego loss is scary. Im a humble, laid back guy and think everyone is equal already. Does that mean I have less chance of having a bad trip? Would an egotistical person have a bad one when they lose their ego?

I dont want to lose my ego at first. how much should I take to make colors more vivid and music sound better? A gram or so?


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InvisibleMOTH
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: donkey_lipz]
    #3067178 - 08/29/04 10:31 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

I would take 1.5-2.0 for a first time.  You can always dose higher if it isn't enough for later trips.  Start low to find your comfort level.  :smile:


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InvisibleFecalDildo
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #3067231 - 08/29/04 10:45 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

ego loss is the ability to remove yourself from the world of "i". When one looses their ego they feel a part of the eternal NOW and the eternal universe.. there is no differentiation between the person sitting next to you or the plants in your back yard, or the refrigerator in your kitchen.. everything becomes one.. If you try to loose your ego it wont happen. As the great alan watts said. "trying to loose your ego is the biggest ego trip going". Meditation is a great way of loosing your ego and it will come naturally once you "get it".


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InvisibleMOTH
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: FecalDildo]
    #3067280 - 08/29/04 10:53 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Emmett said:
When one looses their ego they feel a part of the eternal NOW and the eternal universe.. there is no differentiation between the person sitting next to you or the plants in your back yard, or the refrigerator in your kitchen.. everything becomes one..




Oh yeah...my favorite way of describing egoloss is that "you" become "Nothing and everything, nothing and everything."


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Invisiblemyndreach
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #3067328 - 08/29/04 11:03 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

good post mark

Quote:

donkey_lipz said:
Does that mean I have less chance of having a bad trip? Would an egotistical person have a bad one when they lose their ego?




Once you realize that there are no "good" or "bad" trips, and that there is only the experience, you will begin to truly understand and enjoy psychadelics in the way that they are meant to be.


Edited by myndreach (08/29/04 11:04 PM)


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Offlinefalseaddiction
There's agoldmine up onthe mountainside

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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: Toddo]
    #3067349 - 08/29/04 11:07 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

First time i tripped I ate 2.5 grams of cubesis and reached it for about 10 mins. Freaked me out....
I layed on my wifes lap sqeezing her hands, telling her I didn't exist. She would say things like "You will be normal soon, it will be ok." or "It will pass in time." I would repsond saying "I don't even exist anymore. I could never be normal again. Normal doesn't exist. There is no time to come back to." I was gone. Scary, but looking back it was a learning experience. I don't know what it would be like to live without experiencing that. I just wasn't ready for it as I had never even tripped before.


--------------------


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OfflineAhHaHaHa
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: GnuBobo]
    #3067390 - 08/29/04 11:19 PM (19 years, 5 months ago)

A few years ago i had a beautiful life with lots of wonderful people who loved me. I cant remember exactly when it stopped but it did. And none of the people in that life confirm its happenings. I promised I would wait for them. I cant tell what is real anymore. A loss of reality and waiting for false hope, now that is ego loss. And Im suicidal all the time. Its inevidabilty depresses the hell out of me. I have to get of this out sooner or later.


Edited by AhHaHaHa (08/29/04 11:22 PM)


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Offlinej_db69
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: GnuBobo]
    #3068455 - 08/30/04 09:32 AM (19 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

GnuBobo said:
    I'm wondering if anyone here has experienced clinical depression to the point of getting seriously sucidal (e.g. having the gun in your mouth). 
    I was struck with clinical depression due to an extended illness.  I'm much better now, but I really don't feel  the same as before dealing with acute depression.  I sort of want to call it "detached" but this isn't really the correct word.  I suppose there is something of a "borrowed time" feeling about my life right now.
    I've used acid, 'shrooms, ecstasy back in college.  I was standing alone in the Amsterdam red light district tripping out waiting for my roommate to finish with a prostitute.  I mean, I've been frightened while tripping.  Confused, scared, etc.
      But since being so depressed, and using the fruits of my own labors, it's sort of been like my experiences have been quite different.  I feel like I have control, understanding of the lens I'm viewing the world through. 
      I'm interested in getting to "ego-loss," but I was wondering if others have had a similar experience with depression and entheogens?  Right on.  Thanks all. :grin:

GB




Yes GnuBobo, you can get really depressed.  I have never been depressed really I guess, but the last time I took them, (only 3 grams) suicide did cross my mind, I would never do that btw, but for some reason I did think about it.  I wasn't depressed or having a bad trip, it was just one of the many things that was racing through my mind.  Just know that suicide is a selfish way out, you may be ok with hurting yourself, but you have to think about everyone else in your life, like your family and friends.  Make sure you have someone that you really trust with you, that is a positive person and don't listen to depressing music, as some music may not sound depressing now, but when you are on mushrooms, it could be a different story.  Just know that it will pass and how good the afterglow will feel....


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Offlinefalseaddiction
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: Toddo]
    #3068930 - 08/30/04 11:47 AM (19 years, 4 months ago)

AhHaHaHa,

did this start right after a trip? Have you tripped many times?


InvisibleGnuBobo,

What sickness did you have? I have had mono for about 2-3 months and I am getting over it now, but I feel oddly depressed, for no reason really.


--------------------


Edited by falseaddiction (08/30/04 11:49 AM)


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: Toddo]
    #3068993 - 08/30/04 12:03 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Great thread...

For more information on ego loss, read The Psychadellic Experience, by Tim Leary http://www.erowid.org/library/books_online/psychedelic_experience/psychedelic_experience.shtml

Enjoy!


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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OfflineAhHaHaHa
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: falseaddiction]
    #3069991 - 08/30/04 04:19 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Many times I have tripped before and many times after. Still the same memory. I ve taken all different types of medicine none work. I have elaborate detailed memories of events conversations and time lines that occured during that summer.


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Offlinefalseaddiction
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: Toddo]
    #3070891 - 08/30/04 08:17 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

AhHaHaHa,

What summer? Was it a summer you tripped a lot? Do you feel that this change in perception or feeling was due to your pychedelic experiences? I am interested in this, as like I had said, I have been feeling weird latly.

donkey_lipz,

There is no way to really know if your ready. Just start small. Like I said, I only did 2-3 grams my first time and I experienced this. All that was left was emotion, in its purest form. It's crazy. You'll make it through. Be with friends, but don't do it just to have fun. It's fun, but get use to it first.


--------------------


Edited by falseaddiction (08/30/04 08:29 PM)


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InvisibleGnuBobo
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: Toddo]
    #3071254 - 08/30/04 09:24 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

I had a physical illness which severely limited my ability to function It's a little fucked up, an extended story. I'm much better now, though. However, since dealing with mental illness, recovering, you just feel a bit different. I mean, understanding how quickly I can slip back into disfunction if I'm off meds is bizarre. My symptoms and behavior are so obviously connected to a chemical imbalance in my brain....I see things much more about taking care of your head and how easily a chemical can alter the balance.
I suppose it comes to that I have seen the profound help and effect of SSRIs on my brain, so I want to explore entheogens as they extend one's range of senses and sensibilities. I suppose I view taking psychedelics as a tool, like getting a hearing aid for your brain, I suppose. And the extent of vision one might have must be explored, pushed....hence my interest in ego loss.
Take it easy all.

GB


--------------------
Jerry Garcia. JERRY GARCIA! JERRY GARCIA!!!!


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OfflinekronnyQ
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: GnuBobo]
    #3071693 - 08/30/04 11:17 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

GnuBobo said:
    I'm wondering if anyone here has experienced clinical depression to the point of getting seriously sucidal (e.g. having the gun in your mouth). 
    I was struck with clinical depression due to an extended illness.  I'm much better now, but I really don't feel  the same as before dealing with acute depression.  I sort of want to call it "detached" but this isn't really the correct word.  I suppose there is something of a "borrowed time" feeling about my life right now.
    I've used acid, 'shrooms, ecstasy back in college.  I was standing alone in the Amsterdam red light district tripping out waiting for my roommate to finish with a prostitute.  I mean, I've been frightened while tripping.  Confused, scared, etc.
      But since being so depressed, and using the fruits of my own labors, it's sort of been like my experiences have been quite different.  I feel like I have control, understanding of the lens I'm viewing the world through. 
      I'm interested in getting to "ego-loss," but I was wondering if others have had a similar experience with depression and entheogens?  Right on.  Thanks all. :grin:

GB




I been there man. Only advice I have for ya is don't buy a gun!

J/k I can offer a lot more than that. I just found out about 4 years ago that I have clinical depression, and it's weird I never thought of it before because I remember being suicidal as young as 12 years old and very depressed ever since the age of 7 or 8.

Around 18 or so I started using acid and that made my condition a lot worse. It wasn't until I was about 22 that I found out I had major depression and anxiety issues, possibly elevated by my use of acid and shrooms. I tried therapy and various medications. To this day the only thing thats working for me is the Zoloft, and #1 most importantly NOT USING ANY PSYCHOACTIVE DRUGS! The last time I did shrooms on meds I locked myself in a closet for four hours with my gun.  :rolleyes:

Now all I do is drink and smoke tweedz, and aside from some mild depression from the drinking I feel great.

I've never heard of this ego-loss stuff but it sounds a lot like things that I have experienced.

I'm tellin you this right now if you have any kind of depression/ anxiety/ brain chemical imbalance issues do not touch shrooms, acid, or X!  :thumbup:

Besides, if you grow shrooms and you don't do them that's 100% profit for you! :jammingout:


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OfflineAhHaHaHa
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Re: What is Ego Loss [Re: falseaddiction]
    #3071869 - 08/30/04 11:57 PM (19 years, 4 months ago)

It was the summer of 2001, when I graduated high school. I have tripped many times after but never have I dreamnt like that. I tripped several times before. Dreamnt, fuck I still think its real. My perception changed only slightly. I was suicidal before the summer because i felt like i was going no where. All the symptoms of depression. However i can remember the happiness they gave me and the love i had found. I felt like i had found my place and reason to live, for them. Dont get me wrong, I am not one of those people who takes something someone says, or a gesture the wrong way. I remember specific events and love from that summer in great detail. And these were like a memory remembered not like a fantasy created. The memories came back in flashes, not like fantasies which build upon each other. I set dates in the future for them to return again, because I promised them, but I fear they never will return again. This is my reality. This causes a great deal of anxiety. This is a horrible reality. I use mushrooms as my escape. i view things differently when I trip. I am at peace and confident in the memories restoration.
For years I have thought those same things, I am not real. I have tried to erase the blade. I am a coward and cannot, or maybe i believe they will return again. So you realize my dilema. The dream is centripital, it keeps me alive and causes me to think like that. I am under a great deal of stress. I feel the end is near. I will never go see another doctor, but have thought about checking myself into an institute where I can "legally" loose control. I hate the place I am in and the only thing that can change that is the memory must become true and I am ready for it to happen; for if it does not. Mushrooms calm my mind and are my release.


Edited by AhHaHaHa (08/31/04 12:01 AM)


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