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Shop: North Spore Injection Grain Bag, North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: Viveka]
    #8119805 -

OKLAHOMA CITY BOMBING WAS A CONSPIRACY
COLUMBINE SHOOTINGS WERE A CONSPIRACY
VA TECH SHOOTINGS WERE A CONSPIRACY
I HAVE NO PENIS
I HAVE NO FRIENDS
I AM A FUCKING IDIOT AND SHOULD KILL MYSELF FOR BELEIVING 9/11 WAS A CONSPIRACY

but seriously all of you conspiracy theorists out there should fucking die. you are all worthless people, with obviously not a single speck of intelligence

p.s. HERPES AND GENITAL WARTS ARE CONSPIRACIES


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                                                                  thats right cubes in december bitches

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: CubensisCutter]
    #8119924 -

Quote:
show me what your evidence is and I will thoroughly debunk it


You haven't really "debunked" anything. Just as your adversary in this debate is doing, you're just throwing out speculations based on "your own" collection of "evidence." Neither of you fully understand the physics that went on, because every single building ever made is different in some minute way that could cause its destruction to take place differently than another - from a small imperfection somewhere in the structure to an accidentally faulty foundation. Besides, its hard to examine just what is going on when it comes to a storm of explosions and smoke all wrapped up in a steaming sociological bun covered in radical, clasing religious views. You just can't assume you know what went on, even if you think your logic sees through all the smoke.

I love how some people just think they know it all. It must be comforting.

Conspiracy is a fact of government, as history has shown us time and time again. To go into a situation with automatic distrust of such an entity is not unwise.


--------------------

Hemp could Save the World.

"There is no flag that is large enough, to hide the shame of a man in cuffs." -Serj Tankian


:mushroomgrow:Know Thyself.:mushroomgrow:

"If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on."
-Terence Mckenna

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: LeftyBurnz]
    #8120124 -

leftysurprise said:
Cowgold said:
leftysurprise said:
even that picture does not convince me as to why the building fell in the manner it did. the damage was to one corner, and the hole was roughly 2-3 offices deep, lets just suppose for a minute that the damage shown in the picture WAS enough for the whole building to collapse, it does not explain how the building fell uniformly straight down at the same time, and into itself creating a neat pile of small pieces inside the perimeter of the building. it should have collapsed towards the damaged corner, and the whole building would not have collapsed from the damage shown. there should have been large chunks and huge connecting twisted sections of steel frame.

take a good look at the two videos i posted of the building 7 collapse and tell me you honestly think the damage shown in that picture is responsible for what you see, it is impossible considering the structural strength and design of the frame.




You're using a fucking video to determine how a building should have fallen.  Nothing you say is valid.  Then you talk about the structural strength and design of the frame. :rolleyes:  I would like to see the structural drawings that you're referencing.


no im using a fucking video, basic to mediocre knowledge of structural strength in high rise buildings and common sense. i have two friends which are engineers, one a structural and the other a civil. i conversate with them about their jobs on a pretty frequent basis, the structural engineer works for a company that builds hospitals, and i have seen pictures of every phase of contruction. sure a hospital is not 40 something stories as building 7 was, however i understand fairly well how structural frames are put together and reinforced.

i also had to do a project in HS for technology class involving building an 8'x6'x4' scale model of a modern high rise building, the project was to show stress loads and how the structural frame handled it. it was not made with steel or concrete, instead wood and metal connections, however the strength was supposed to be pretty close to scale  and we tested several stresses, including demonstrating the effect of having one bottom side blown out. we knocked out 1/3 of the buildings structural support to cause a collapse. it did not crumble from the floor up straight down. nor did it fall into a neat inward pile.

not to say this ultimately proves anything, but i am saying that if that fucking building was built to code and correctly, it should not have fallen the way it did given the damage it sustained.


i wasnt aware i needed a 10 year degree to make an opinion? ill get right on that cow. :rolleyes:

building 7, a well built steel structure crumbles because of mild damage to one corner, yet the oklahoma city building(not steel structure) has nearly 1/3 of the building blown off and stands just fine? hard to imagine.




I still would like to see the structural drawings.  I read blueprints when I'm not on here. :strokebeard: That building was fucked up and then it fell.

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: Cowgold]
    #8120196 -

wouldn't it be relatively easy to make a realistic computer simulation with a super computer and run it 100 times?

i wonder if either side has rented one out and done that yet...


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You can check the last post in my journal for contact info.

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: truekimbo2]
    #8120264 -

That sounds like a very good idea, as long as the programmed physics were perfect or close to. It's a good question as to why someone hasn't paid to have this done yet. At least, I haven't heard about it. Hmm.


--------------------

Hemp could Save the World.

"There is no flag that is large enough, to hide the shame of a man in cuffs." -Serj Tankian


:mushroomgrow:Know Thyself.:mushroomgrow:

"If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on."
-Terence Mckenna

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: truekimbo2]
    #8120284 -

There is always a probability that the government allowed 9/11 to occur because of its perceived benefits. There is some logic there, as it gave them an excuse to go back to Iraq which hardcore neocons had wanted since we pulled out the first time, plus gave Bush the ability to pass the patriot act. Of course, personally I don't think the government is as evil as some of you; in all probability I think they're just ambitious to a fault.

But where I draw the line is with these "grand scheme" conspiracy theories. No, we are not going to have chips implemented into our brains. No, the U.S. government is not going to drop chemical weapons on its own cities. No, the Sons of Liberty are not secretly controlling every aspect of our lives.

I don't have any illusions about how fucking self serving and Machiavellian our government is, and I don't think you'll get an argument there from most people. This is why the argument of "you just don't want to believe it" holds no water. History shows us that America has had plenty of so called "conspiracies," but it's never led to any new world order.

Take, for instance, the event that brought us into the Spanish American War in 1898. Many historians believe that American nationalists sank the USS Maine in order to get the U.S. government into war with spain. Many American military officers knew the bombing was not carried out by Spain, but the war was in our best interests so we went along with it anyways. This was greatly helped out by the newly spawned "yellow journalism" movement, which pretty much outright lied to the public in order to gain support for the war. However, it's not like the Freemasons and the Illuminati teamed up to start a war in order to re institute slavery or anything of the sort.

So basically just chill out on your theories. Some of the logic is valid and yes, the American government is completely full of shit. But that's not a conspiracy it's just how it's always worked.


--------------------
check out my music!
drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: manyc]
    #8120287 -

manyc said:
That sounds like a very good idea, as long as the programmed physics were perfect or close to. It's a good question as to why someone hasn't paid to have this done yet. At least, I haven't heard about it. Hmm.


Probably cause nobody's gonna waste money making a program for a case that's already closed.


--------------------
check out my music!
drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: g00ru]
    #8120376 -

I think it's ludicrous to sit and watch a building fall so gracefully, so perfectly, and believe that it was caused by a bit of structural damage. It fell more cleanly than pretty much any demolition I've seen in my life. And I've seen a lot of videos of demolitions, trust me.

Most eyewitnesses were flabbergasted by the fact that it fell in the manner that it did, from the amount of damage it sustained.

I would not say this case is closed by a long shot. There has been no conclusive data, and the fact that it is "closed" just makes me more suspicious of the entire situation. How the fuck can a case so big be closed so soon? It's completely void of logic.


--------------------

Hemp could Save the World.

"There is no flag that is large enough, to hide the shame of a man in cuffs." -Serj Tankian


:mushroomgrow:Know Thyself.:mushroomgrow:

"If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on."
-Terence Mckenna

Edited by manyc (03/08/08 04:33 PM)

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: manyc]
    #8120473 -

manyc said:
I think it's ludicrous to sit and watch a building fall so gracefully, so perfectly, and believe that it was caused by a bit of structural damage.

Most eyewitnesses were flabbergasted by the fact that it fell in the manner that it did, from the amount of damage it sustained.

I would not say this case is closed by a long shot. There has been no conclusive data, and the fact that it is "closed" just makes me more suspicious of the entire situation. How the fuck can a case so big be closed so soon? It's completely void of logic.


How else would it fall? Sideways? There is conclusive data and it's been documented as to how WTC7 and the other two world trade centers fell.

http://www.civil.northwestern.edu/people/bazant/PDFs/Papers/466.pdf

http://chronicle.com/free/v52/i42/42a01001.htm

People that understand this stuff much better than you or I have analyzed it and come to the conclusion that foul play was not involved. These aren't government conspirators, they're scientists from major universities. Only on places like the shroomery is this even a debate. For the intellectual community these conspiracies are laughed at because, like it or not, it's all been debunked.


--------------------
check out my music!
drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: Viveka]
    #8120499 -

as much as i would love to go back and forth with you about nothing(because thats all youre offering, is useless argument), i dont have the time today or tomorrow to retort to the last response you gave me. maybe if i have time monday ill go through and give you more to just scream shenanigans at. :shrug:


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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: g00ru]
    #8120508 -

guruu said:
manyc said:
That sounds like a very good idea, as long as the programmed physics were perfect or close to. It's a good question as to why someone hasn't paid to have this done yet. At least, I haven't heard about it. Hmm.


Probably cause nobody's gonna waste money making a program for a case that's already closed.


lets not forget that less than $1 million  was spent on the 9/11 investigation.  sounds reasonable compared to the $60+ million spent on impeaching clinton for getting his dick sucked. :nonono:


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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: manyc]
    #8120516 -

manyc said:
I think it's ludicrous to sit and watch a building fall so gracefully, so perfectly, and believe that it was caused by a bit of structural damage. It fell more cleanly than pretty much any demolition I've seen in my life. And I've seen a lot of videos of demolitions, trust me.

Most eyewitnesses were flabbergasted by the fact that it fell in the manner that it did, from the amount of damage it sustained.

I would not say this case is closed by a long shot. There has been no conclusive data, and the fact that it is "closed" just makes me more suspicious of the entire situation. How the fuck can a case so big be closed so soon? It's completely void of logic.


as long as the thousands and thousands of people, including engineers and other highly educated people argue the facts of the official story, it is not closed.


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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: LeftyBurnz]
    #8120638 -

I don't trust everything I read, personally. I take these things with a grain of salt. For all I know these specialists got paid off big time.


--------------------

Hemp could Save the World.

"There is no flag that is large enough, to hide the shame of a man in cuffs." -Serj Tankian


:mushroomgrow:Know Thyself.:mushroomgrow:

"If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on."
-Terence Mckenna

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: LeftyBurnz]
    #8120678 -

If 9/11 were truly committed by terrorists, and there was no internal involvement- there would be everything to gain and nothing to lose by sharing all of the information with the public and allowing extensive media scrutinization close-up. Why the secrecy?

As for people claiming the failure analysis theories have reached an indisputable conclusion; go through an engineering degree before you pretend you can verify what the reports are claiming. Note that the reference provided http://www.civil.northwestern.edu/people/bazant/PDFs/Papers/466.pdf conveniently uses a simple one dimensional collapse model, which avoids explaining the unusual linearity of the collapses. (I am not saying here that the chosen analysis method was chosen due to conspiracy, however it leaves a very incomplete picture)

There is no proven conspiracy surrounding 9/11, nor is there any proven legitimacy to the stories the government offers.


--------------------
Know your self.
Know your substance.
Know your source.

The most distorted perspective possible is the perspective that yours is not distorted.

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: ExplosiveMango]
    #8120700 -

Decades from now, there will be history channel shows on this shit posing both sides of the argument in that neutral way they do, and the different societies still trying to prove the truth.


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/ / / / / / / LISTEN TO MY MUSIC: E X E D / / / / / / /
The universe gives no fucks. And takes no fucks.
May His Circuits Ever Function

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: ExplosiveMango]
    #8120709 -

Can anyone present a failure analysis document for building 7? I have spent little time personally researching 9/11 from a technical standpoint, and do not know off hand if this material is available. (I am not naive enough to think I can devise an accurate explanation without more evidence than the government allowed to become available to the public, but I would be interested to see if there is any explanation that can be offered even by those who were hired to 'properly explain' the collapse)

In my opinion, the building 7 collapse is the most brow raising event surrounding 9/11. (Please note multiple reports by engineering and demolition professionals that the collapse of building 7 appears identical to the results of implosive demolition.)


--------------------
Know your self.
Know your substance.
Know your source.

The most distorted perspective possible is the perspective that yours is not distorted.

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: ExplosiveMango]
    #8120808 -

Wow, people still believe this crap? Fucking retards

Explosivemango, NIST has a report on the cause of WTC 7's collapse.











--------------------
I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: d33p]
    #8120876 -

Believe what? A legitimate failure?

The people who believe the government aren't retards d33p, they are just happier with easy answers than complete ones.


--------------------
Know your self.
Know your substance.
Know your source.

The most distorted perspective possible is the perspective that yours is not distorted.

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: ExplosiveMango]
    #8120943 -

ExplosiveMango said:
Believe what? A legitimate failure?

The people who believe the government aren't retards d33p, they are just happier with easy answers than complete ones.


QFR (quoted for retardation)


--------------------
I'm a nihilist. Lets be friends.

bang bang

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Re: the only one way to settle the 9/11 Consipiracy debate is to re-build the towers and crash 2 pla [Re: d33p]
    #8120951 -

d33p said:
ExplosiveMango said:
Believe what? A legitimate failure?

The people who believe the government aren't retards d33p, they are just happier with easy answers than complete ones.


QFR (quoted for retardation)


:smirk:


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After one comes, through contact with it's administrators, no longer to cherish greatly the law as a remedy in abuses, then the bottle becomes a sovereign means of direct action.  If you cannot throw it at least you can always drink out of it.  - Ernest Hemingway

If it is life that you feel you are missing I can tell you where to find it.  In the law courts, in business, in government.  There is nothing occurring in the streets. Nothing but a dumbshow composed of the helpless and the impotent.    -Cormac MacCarthy

He who learns must suffer. And even in our sleep pain that cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart, and in our own despair, against our will, comes wisdom to us by the awful grace of God.  - Aeschylus

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