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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #8019104 -

1. How do they believe the world was created?

2. What do they think happens when you die?

3. What do they believe about social issues like abortion and homosexuality?

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: Redstorm]
    #8019511 -

Redstorm said:
1. How do they believe the world was created?


great questions!
well, they arent defiant of cosmology... they do believe in the big bang... I guess. It really isnt on their radar though.
But what is interesting is that they believe this is the 4th or 5th time the universe has exploded/imploded/exploded.
I have no idea what their reasoning for it being a certain number of times is though.

Quote:
2. What do they think happens when you die?


you (as a thetan (soul)) most often find a new body... usually in the form of a developing fetus.
But they believe that people low enough on the tone scale (tm) will inhabit objects, or lower lifeforms like trees... and then some just wander around delusional, confused souls.

Quote:
3. What do they believe about social issues like abortion and homosexuality?


I honestly dont know their official stance on abortion... I think they view a fetus that isnt inhabited by a thetan to be no diferent than a peice of meat... but beyond that I dont honestly know.
As for homosexuality, it isnt like other religions where you basically are shunned and spit on... they are to some degree accepting... but their stance on homosexuality still miffs most gays.
Their stance is that through past lives somewhere along the way they became attached to a certain gender, and in this life, they were born opposite that favored gender and grow up with past life experiences, cognitions and memories which lead them to be attracted to the same sex.
so.. in fewer words, they believe that homosexuals are merely confused about the role they are supposed to play.
I could be wrong, but I dont believe that they have a specific course to "cure someone" of homosexuality.

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #8019551 -

Thanks. I'm not too educated on Scientology, so it's good to find out more about their core beliefs. I got one more for you.

Is Scientology like other religions in that they believe that you will not reap the benefits of an afterlife if you aren't a believer of their principles or do they believe that a generally "good" person will be rewarded for their virtues when they die?

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: Redstorm]
    #8019574 -

yawning, I sent you a pm like around this morning. you need to answer it :awesome:

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: Redstorm]
    #8020223 -

Redstorm said:
Thanks. I'm not too educated on Scientology, so it's good to find out more about their core beliefs. I got one more for you.

Is Scientology like other religions in that they believe that you will not reap the benefits of an afterlife if you aren't a believer of their principles or do they believe that a generally "good" person will be rewarded for their virtues when they die?


no, there isnt really any "chosen people" type beliefs, but they do believe that the knowledge they teach better equips a person for future lives.

L Ron and scientolgoy books all insist that "man is basically good and strives to be such". They dont believe that truly evil people exist. Even the serial killers and such, though wracked by guilt, dont do it from an intent to destroy the world... but merely a way to satiate a malicious desire.
so, there are no good and bad people in the eyes of scientology. thusly, no one is rewarded over others by virtue or supreme being in the afterlife... they also maintain that there really is no afterlife, just existence without a body.

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: appleorange]
    #8020231 -

appleorange said:
yawning, I sent you a pm like around this morning. you need to answer it :awesome:


I will answer your questions either way, but since this thread is that topic, could I get your permission to post only the questions you asked?

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #8020252 -

ok....


:awesome:

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: appleorange]
    #8020362 -

How accurate is L. Ron Hubbard: Messiah or Madman?

I try to be as open-minded as possible, giving people room for their beliefs. I can understand some of the ideas behind Scientology; while on one hand their methods can appear like indoctrination or brainwashing, I am amenable to the idea that they may have helped some people in the context of spiritual healing.

Unfortunately, most of what I have read about Scientology forces me to the conclusion that it is run like a corporate cult. :shrug: If I'm wrong, I'm waiting to be proven wrong.


--------------------
Enlil said:
You really are the worst kind of person.


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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
    #8020405 -

I will look at it.
I am pretty sure I have, but I cannot comment on it until I watch it again.
so, I will get to it when I can.

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #8020492 -

What do scientologists think about other religions? Particularly the big ones, Christianity and Islam.

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: Neon]
    #8020802 -

I know when you get to OT 8 you're supposed to get superpowers. is this another one of those things that they accept as fictional?

also, OT 7 is self auditing right? i'm really curious as to how your mom looks at going from OT 7 to OT 8. How will she know when she's ready? is it really exciting? Is she looking forward to superpowers or are there other benifits?

also do scientologists work together to gain business advantages in their private lives?


--------------------
You can check the last post in my journal for contact info.

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
    #8021673 -

Tchan909 said:
How accurate is L. Ron Hubbard: Messiah or Madman?

I try to be as open-minded as possible, giving people room for their beliefs. I can understand some of the ideas behind Scientology; while on one hand their methods can appear like indoctrination or brainwashing, I am amenable to the idea that they may have helped some people in the context of spiritual healing.

Unfortunately, most of what I have read about Scientology forces me to the conclusion that it is run like a corporate cult. :shrug: If I'm wrong, I'm waiting to be proven wrong.


ah, sorry, I thought it was a video... but the name did ring a bell.

but I havent read that book, so I have no way of knowing if it is factual or not.
but also, it seems like it focuses mainly on L Ron Hubbard. People often think that L Ron is the churches messiah, but he isnt. He is just highly revered.

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #8021802 -

Auto-Summary
This forum post addresses four key questions about Scientology:

1. Did L. Ron Hubbard create the religion to make money? Various sources claim Hubbard made this statement around 1945-1950, but there is conflicting testimony, including affidavits from David A. Kyle and Jay Kay Klein, which have been disputed in German courts. Germany has a history of perceived persecution against Scientology due to its integration with the pharmaceutical industry.

2. Do Scientologists believe in the alien Xenu? No, they do not. Scientologists believe in the concept of a thetan, an immortal spiritual being, which is billions of years old, not born from an alien Xenu.

3. Why do Scientologists charge money for knowledge? Scientology charges fees for various levels of knowledge and training, such as OT8 at $10,000. However, the cost does not vary significantly, and the perceived value of the training is often more important than the price.

4. A brief overview of Scientology's belief system: Scientology is based on 8 dynamics of life, each representing a different aspect of existence and evolution. The ARC triangle (Affinity, Reality, Communication) is a crucial concept, emphasizing the importance of strong relationships. The highest goal is becoming an Operating Thetan (OT

here are appleoranges questions...

Quote:
1. Did Hubbard really make this religion to make money?


I really wouldnt know. I never knew the guy.
but I guess what you are referring to is the alleged quote from him.

Quote:
Several people have been quoted as saying that they heard Hubbard talk
of starting a religion to make money and avoid taxes some time around
1945 to 19.50. Among them are Jay Kay Klein, reporter Neison Himmel
who shared a room with Hubbard in 1945, then editor of the "Thrilling"
group of magazines Sam Merwin, writer Sam Moskowitz, science fiction
writer Theodore Sturgeon, and writer Lloyd Arthur Eshbach. On the
other hand, the church of Scientology has obtained affidavits from a
David A. Kyle and Jay Kay Klein who claim they were at the same talk
that Hubbard gave when Moskowitz claims Hubbard made the statement and
that Hubbard never made the "start his own religion" statement. The
Kyle and Klein affidavits have clashed with an affidavit from
Moskowitz in a German court of law and the case was dismissed when the
Moskowitz affidavit was produced.


but germany and scientology have a huge history with each other. It primarily stems from how integrated not only their persona and thinking, but their economy as well is based on pharmaceuticals (see Merck). In fact german officials openly declared that scientology was a threat to their democracy and that security forces are "keeping an eye on them".

at one point the church was banned, all churches were closed and many documents as well as e-meters were confiscated. If there is any place in the world where there is true religious persecution going on against scientology, it is in germany.

Quote:
2. Do scientologists really believe in the alien xenu that created them? What do they base this on?


no they dont believe the alien xenu created them. Scientologists believe that as a thetan you are billions of years old.

Quote:
3. Why do they charge money to gain more knowledge of the belief system?


It is all the same price mostly. there isnt some gradient of cost. Like I showed before, OT8 is 10k. things vary in prices, and there is no set amount that one person is going to pay to get to OT8.
Scientologists dont really talk about "OMG OT3 was so expensive".. but more like "OMG, OT3 changed my life, it was amazingly worth it".
so they seem content with the exchange.


Quote:
4. Also, just give me a general run down of the belief system, as if some joe schmo came up to you and asked what christianity was.



well, there is just so much, so I will just hit a few key things about it.
if you notice the Scientology cross hass 8 points to it, which symbolize what they call the 8 dynamics of life.
which is interesting in that it seems Timothy Leary might have modeled his 8 circuit model of consciousness after them. Seeing as how R.A.W. was so intrigued by L Ron and his relationship with Aleister Crowley.
(OMG IT GETS SO DEEP!)
but anyway...
Quote:
The first dynamic, self, is the effort to survive as an individual, to be an individual and to fully express one’s individuality.

The second dynamic is the urge toward existence as a future generation. It has two components: sex and the family unit, including the raising of children.

The third dynamic is the urge to survive as a member of a group. A company, a political party, a church or a social organization are all examples of the third dynamic.

The fourth dynamic is the urge for survival of man as a species. All of the races of man together constitute the fourth dynamic.

The fifth dynamic is the urge to survive for all life forms — animal or vegetable and anything directly and intimately motivated by life.

The sixth dynamic is the urge for survival of the physical universe and reflects the drive of the individual to enhance the survival of all matter, energy, space and time –the component parts of the physical universe.

The seventh dynamic is the urge toward existence as a spiritual being.

The eighth dynamic is the urge toward existence as infinity. This is also identified as the Supreme Being. Thus, this dynamic can be called the infinity, or God, dynamic.


those are the 8.

then there is the ARC triangle, which you can also find on their cross. It stands for Affinity, Reality, Communication, and it is a tech that is often used by scientologists. they posit that any relationship with something is based on how much you like them (affinity), how much reality you have in common, and how well you can communicate... and that by increasing any one side, you will ultimately increase the other two.

also, one of the biggest milestones for a scientologist, is becoming Clear. which basically means that you have erased all of your engrams and no longer have a reactive mind.
reactive mind: that part of the mind which works on a totally stimulus-response basis, which is not under a person’s volitional control, and which exerts force and the power of command over his awareness, purposes, thoughts, body and actions.
but the highest state attainable is OT, which stands for operating Thetan.
Operating Thetan: a state of being above Clear, in which the Clear has become refamiliarized with his native capabilities.

there really is so much more, it just helps if you guys ask me certain specific questions.

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: Neon]
    #8021816 -

Neon said:
What do scientologists think about other religions? Particularly the big ones, Christianity and Islam.


they are 100% accepting. in fact, one can maintain their own religion and practice scientology. if you lok at the 8th dynamic I posted in the last post, it says "Supreme Being". now scientology doesnt mandate what that supreme being is to be called or characterized by, but just that there is a supreme force that in some way governs the universe.

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: truekimbo2]
    #8021887 -

truekimbo2 said:
I know when you get to OT 8 you're supposed to get superpowers. is this another one of those things that they accept as fictional?


I dont think anywhere, anyone has ever claimed to have superpowers as an OT. One main goal in scientology is to have more awareness. not like ribbon awareness, but spatial awareness... now that they will claim to have more of.

Quote:
also, OT 7 is self auditing right? i'm really curious as to how your mom looks at going from OT 7 to OT 8. How will she know when she's ready? is it really exciting? Is she looking forward to superpowers or are there other benifits?


yes, OT7 is the longest level. it sometimes takes people 10 years to complete it...
but my mom isnt "in" scientology anymore. she practices it still, but she isnt doing anymore courses because she is where she wants to be at in life. why fix it if it aint broke?
and my mother is an amazing woman. she is probably the coolest mother in the world. I wouldnt say she has "superpowers" but perhaps she has honed her mothers instinct. some uncanny shit has happened at times where I was in danger, or trouble and from states away she instantly knew.
other than that, no, she cant leap tall buildings and stop bullets.

Quote:
also do scientologists work together to gain business advantages in their private lives?


well, much like the gay community, if there is a gay owned business, gay people will flock to it. there is a lot of intercommunity support like that.
but back room deals and such, I wouldnt know about even if they do exist.

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #8022027 -

i remember reading somewhere, ill look for it again so i can post a link, that L Ron ordered, i think it was 5 grams of crystal LSD from sandoz back in the 50s.

there was a quote by him saying "if you want to become rich, start your own religion."

so who in their RIGHT MIND is going to subscribe to that science fiction BS......?

the guy did enough acid to realize how to work people.


--------------------
"The soul has greater need of the ideal than of the real. It is by the real that we exist, it is by the ideal that we live."

If you want to get a hold of me, my email address is in my profile. Just click on my screen name. I got banned from using private messages cause I didn't follow the rules... :frown:

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #8022054 -

you mentioned before that Scientologists expand their spacial awareness. what kinds of practise do they do to achieve this?

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: deranger]
    #8022761 -

SyntheticMInd said:
you mentioned before that Scientologists expand their spacial awareness. what kinds of practise do they do to achieve this?


you know there are so many little "techs", and I cant for the life of me remember the proper names of them... but one i recall is when someone is sleepy they take you for a walk and ask you simple questions about your surroundings... or they send you to go do this yourself.
like they will ask you "do you see that book?" and you can respond "fish taco's" and they will say "good" and then ask "what color is that book?" and you can say "14" and they will say good.

it is merely what they call getting back in touch with your surroundings.
I use that one when I am driving and I get tired. just start really identifying the road signs and colors of other cars and such.
but that is a good question, so let me think back and try to remember some of the names of the techniques and I can probably find them online and refresh my memory.

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #8023454 -

YawningAnus said:
but one i recall is when someone is sleepy they take you for a walk and ask you simple questions about your surroundings... or they send you to go do this yourself.
like they will ask you "do you see that book?" and you can respond "fish taco's" and they will say "good" and then ask "what color is that book?" and you can say "14" and they will say good.


:weirdeyes:

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Re: what do you want to know about Scientology beliefs? [Re: SneezingPenis]
    #8023465 -

Why does Scientology make such a fuss about psychiatry? Just because they are competing businesses - one trying to pass itself off as a science and the other trying to pass itself off as a religion?

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