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Shop: Myyco.com Golden Teacher Liquid Culture For Sale   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Does technology enhance or destroy nature?
    #7923633 -

One could say that as we develop our technology we destroy nature, replacing it with our artificial nature, but are our technological advancements really artificial? We never invented anything new, we just learned about what was around us and manipulated it to create a new nature.

This was a question my Philosophy of Science and Nature teacher posed to the class and I was interested to see what the Shroomery thought about it..


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Disclaimer: Everything I say is a lie intended to make my e-reputation more prestigious.

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: jasonpwnd]
    #7923663 -

Technology is nature. Technology is not black or white.


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: jasonpwnd]
    #7923754 -

Technology is the new nature, the evolved nature.

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: jasonpwnd]
    #7923769 -

Icelander is right, technology is nature.

A certain subset of nature, no doubt, but it is as "natural" as a flower in a field.


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: trendal]
    #7929190 -

but technology isn't natural in the sense of the word that, it is not human made. also today i would argue that humans are not natural, we have lost many of our natural instincts. many say that humanity started to become non-natural when we started to develop linguistics.

wouldnt you agree that our cities are scars of the earth?


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Disclaimer: Everything I say is a lie intended to make my e-reputation more prestigious.

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: jasonpwnd]
    #7929197 -

Mold on a sandwich.


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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: jasonpwnd]
    #7929210 -

jasonpwnd said:
but technology isn't natural in the sense of the word that, it is not human made. also today i would argue that humans are not natural, we have lost many of our natural instincts. many say that humanity started to become non-natural when we started to develop linguistics.


linguistics could definitely be considered natural, just as a dog barks although a little more complex. maybe it is our identification that makes us seem unnatural.

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: jasonpwnd]
    #7929219 -

jasonpwnd said:
but technology isn't natural in the sense of the word that, it is not human made. also today i would argue that humans are not natural, we have lost many of our natural instincts. many say that humanity started to become non-natural when we started to develop linguistics.

wouldnt you agree that our cities are scars of the earth?


I most certainly disagree. While I dislike much of what our technology has brought in the same way one might dislike a tornado, both come from nature and are part of it. Man came from nature, our mind is natural, the products of our mind are natural, all the synthetic materials we have came from natural materials. The fact that we can alter nature is part of nature. A bird builds a nest and that alters nature. Nature can kill us. Our human nature can kill us.


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Edited by Icelander (01/25/08 10:36 AM)

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: jasonpwnd]
    #7929240 -

Humans are not "unnatural" in any way because nothing is unnatural in our universe. Humans arose as a natural product of the universe, and technology (or high technology) arose as a natural product of our intelligence.

Does the gorilla who makes a stick into a scratching rod doing something "unnatural"? What about the bird who uses a stick to get ants? The beaver that builds a dam? The termites who build towers?

wouldnt you agree that our cities are scars of the earth?

No, I wouldn't.

Our cities may be killing a lot of other species...but we are not the first (and wont be the last) species to do something like this. Did you know that our atmosphere used to be made of things like methane and ammonia? It was bacteria who first made the atmosphere oxygenated, to their own demise (and many other species). The first great extinction event that occurred on this planet was a result of those bacteria "polluting" the atmosphere with oxygen.

We are the same thing, and doing much of the same.


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: trendal]
    #7929254 -

I agree.  If it CAN happen, then it is natural.  :shrug:  This does not mean that it is preferable, or beneficial, but it cannot be unnatural if it occurs.

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: Veritas]
    #7929374 -

While I agree with the concept that, as humans are 'natural' so is whatever we do, I am not impressed by the common conclusions drawn from it. The concept is used far too often as a sidetrack to any critique of technology or modernity and is often spoken with an irritating degree of fatalism. "Oh well, it's natural isn't it? That means there's nothing to criticize." That is ludicrous, lazy thinking.

I think that a far more useful application of this insight is to break down the human/nature dichotomy, to more fully come to terms with the fact that no matter how much we try an elevate or distance ourselves from the world, we are of it. We are an intrinsic part of the material, living earth and nothing we ever do will change that. It logically flows from this that it makes more sense to develop a harmonious interrelation with the non-human (what is often called "nature") as living peacefully and respectfully is a better strategy if we wish to survive and thrive than the bloody war we've been waging at the boundaries of our concrete gates.

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #7929398 -

Yes, I agree. It is possible to criticize natural things which occur, however. As I said, "natural" does not necessarily mean "preferable" nor "beneficial." If our natural actions as humans create consequences which are detrimental to ourselves and other living things, then it is certainly appropriate to consider whether other, similarly "natural" actions might be a wiser course.

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #7929459 -

"Oh well, it's natural isn't it? That means there's nothing to criticize." That is ludicrous, lazy thinking.

While this may seem true to you that don't make it so. There is a school of thinking that accepts whatever is happening as the most appropriate event for the expression of nature or Tao. In other words it wouldn't be happening if it wasn't exactly what was needed. We sometimes learn from our mistakes. Each of us has a part to play in the great drama. The folk who care and the folk who don't and there is no way to know if we would be better off without one or the other.

I tend to take a middle path on all of this.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: Icelander]
    #7929476 -

Ah, but that means that NN's reaction is also exactly what is needed.  :grin:

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: Veritas]
    #7929500 -

Zactly. We are not in charge.:lol:

It's good enough for each person to follow their path. That says nothing about best or worse.

Edited by Icelander (01/25/08 12:18 PM)

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: Icelander]
    #7929526 -

Alright then. If we accept your line of reasoning, that anything that happens is the Tao's most appropriate expression, then that means that acting intentionally and deliberately to challenge the existent is a part of that. You can take this line of reasoning and conclude that it lets you off the hook as far as acting in the world, but the truly logical conclusion of the insight is to void the insight entirely, because there is nothing inherent to it that tells us how we ought to act. This brings us back to square one and leaves us with precisely the same dilemma we had before -- we still have to choose how to live. This choosing still requires a critical evaluation of the world around us and still requires us to decide how to relate to it and ourselves. So while it may be comforting to believe that the world is as it should be, there is nothing there that's saying this should lead to complicity with untentable conditions. Accepting that conclusion is nothing more than a cowardly cop out of the challenge of existence.

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: Icelander]
    #7929529 -

Damnit, you guys found my conclusion before I could post my rant!

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #7929531 -

Type faster!!  :lol:

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: NiamhNyx]
    #7929534 -

Well you posted it anyway and that's what counts.:lol:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Does technology enhance or destroy nature? [Re: Icelander]
    #7929538 -

:tongue:

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