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OfflineAdamist
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Male / Female Nature
    #725268 - 07/05/02 07:39 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Has anyone else noticed that our male/female natures are being switched around more and more? (i.e. males being born with female characteristics and vice versa...)
This seems to me a clear indication that our consciousness is becoming more unified and spiritually evolved.
I myself seem to have a very strong feminine nature, that balances out my male nature. My girlfriend is the same in that she has a strong male nature to balance herself out...
I think alot of women are being born with stronger male characteristics; just look at the women's rights movement and the fact that males actually agree that they are equal to us.
These are exciting times because the male/female soul united is much stronger than either one seperately.


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:heartpump: { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } } :heartpump:


Edited by Adamist (07/05/02 09:54 PM)


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Anonymous

Re: Male / Female Nature [Re: Adamist]
    #725294 - 07/05/02 07:58 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Yes I've read that many more women are being born with penises and more men are being born with vaginas.

But seriously, no. Many behavioural traits are learned but there are definite gender differences which are inate. Ask any parent who has raised both boys and girls.


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Anonymous

Re: Male / Female Nature [Re: Adamist]
    #725298 - 07/05/02 08:00 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Integrated beings emerge


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Anonymous

Re: Male / Female Nature [Re: Adamist]
    #725509 - 07/05/02 09:49 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

I dunno, I think it could be more 'Nurture' than 'Nature'
i am a 1st born, and I am a girl. I also take charge in a lot of situations, and expect to be given the 'final approval' on a lot of things. When I was a kid I was the 'protector' of my two little brotherss from Bullies in the neighborhood - I was allowed to be 'masculine' in that respect.
Now, at 28, I find myself very 'mothering' and femine to my cat, and small anmals/others children - this the dicotomy is not unusual. At least not to me.
I have not discovered a plethora of 'feminized' males runing amock throught NY - but I dont get out much.
I think it has a lot to do with how One is raised.But it interesting to think about.
-OoD


Edited by Anonymous (07/05/02 09:53 PM)


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Registered: 07/13/99
Posts: 4,805
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Re: Male / Female Nature [Re: Anonymous]
    #725552 - 07/05/02 10:23 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Nurture from Day One.

Pink and Blue blankets
Softball and Hardball
Dolls and G.I. Joes
Skirts and Slacks
Panties and Underwear
Makeup and _______
Pretty and Handsome
Flowery Perfume and Spicy Cologne

If you disagree with the Nurture... please show me which codons match up with the aforementioned dichotomies.
Maybe I'm giving my opponents a bad selection to choose from. Okay, you can use ANY social dichotomy to match to a specific gene sequence and I'm sorry but I'm going to need proper scientific references (as this is definitely a science-related topic).


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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OfflineShroomalicious
You may say I'ma dreamer...

Registered: 06/20/02
Posts: 319
Loc: The Shire
Last seen: 14 years, 3 months
Re: Male / Female Nature [Re: Anonymous]
    #725704 - 07/06/02 01:33 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

I don't know...I think women have always been "tough" and are only just being allowed to show it and men have always been "sweet" and are also only being allowed to show it.

One thing I have read about is that people do not realise, generally (IMO), the very, very subtle differences between men and female. Surely, penises and vaginas are a dead give away in most cases but the face and body structure is remarkable similar, it takes very little to "switch" sexes.

Once while I was tripping I came in touch with a being whom identified itself as "All" (I have contacted this being several times since). Amongst many things I learned from it was that the next level of exsistance has no sex, their are no males and felmales and that is one thing that makes this reality unique from others. Food for thought...

Of course all this is only my opinion and not necassarily fact at all.


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Shroomalicious - :smile: I love you and in doing so I love myself, because we ARE all one :smile: - "An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth leaves the whole world blind and toothless". - Mahatma Ghandi


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Invisibleshroomerylurker
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Registered: 06/23/02
Posts: 408
Re: Male / Female Nature [Re: Adamist]
    #725802 - 07/06/02 03:12 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

I think this is more a clear indicator of a time period where gender roles are not so readily defined. When anything is that ambiguous, there will be a phase of testing the waters, finding out what works for present day society. I think what you're talking about is a manifestation of this, not a spiritual merger. Women and men are already intricately tied together as all things are, sometimes it just takes things changing to see that.


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OfflineAmoeba665
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Registered: 05/24/00
Posts: 275
Loc: a hidden microutopia at t...
Last seen: 4 years, 8 months
Re: Male / Female Nature [Re: Shroomalicious]
    #725804 - 07/06/02 03:22 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Once while I was tripping I came in touch with a being whom identified itself as "All" (I have contacted this being several times since). Amongst many things I learned from it was that the next level of exsistance has no sex, their are no males and felmales and that is one thing that makes this reality unique from others. Food for thought...


what? oh, say it ain't so..!


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Registered: 07/13/99
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Re: Male / Female Nature [Re: Amoeba665]
    #726171 - 07/06/02 10:32 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Shro: the next level of exsistance has no sex

Amoeba665:what? oh, say it ain't so..!

I think Shro meant that there will be no gender differences.


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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Anonymous

Re: Male / Female Nature [Re: Sclorch]
    #726247 - 07/06/02 11:35 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Sclorch, there are inherent biological differences between the brains of males and females. These differences do affect behavior. The foundations, limits and potentials are set by nature - nurture only works within these parameters. I see this most markedly in the way my son is developing versus the way my daughter is developing (behaviorally speaking). It is a fact that there are some individual girls who seem much more masculine than some individual boys and there are cases of very feminine boys who are more feminine than individual girls. However, the exceptions do not make the rule.

Scientist have long known that the corpus collosum in women's brains tends to be proportionally thicker than that in men's brains. This is believed to facilitate the transfer of information between the two hemispheres of the brain in women and may account for the phenomena known as "women's intuition." Men's brains show more physical differentiation and specialization whereas women's brains are more generalized. In situations where brain trauma and damage is suffered, and/or portions of the brain are removed women have a tendency to recover better than men because other areas of the brain more easily take over functions of those portions that are removed or injured. There was even a case where one woman had a whole hemisphere removed and eventually recovered full function on the affected side of her body. I know of no such situation ever occurring in a male patient. Again, these are tendencies and there are individual variations.

Sex hormones both present in the womb and present in the body after birth do physically effect the development of certain brain structures. This has been shown conclusively in animal experiments but because of ethical concerns has not been demonstrated in humans (that I know of). One such experiment involved the administration of testosterone to female songbirds (I think they were canaries). The females of the species do not normally develop the ability to sing, only the males. However when the females were raised with the added testosterone, they developed the ability to sing and upon dissection, their brain structure were observed to be different than normal females and had developed like males' brains.


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OfflineAdamist
ℚṲℰϟ✞ЇѺℵ ℛ∃Åʟḯ†У
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Re: Male / Female Nature [Re: ]
    #726264 - 07/06/02 11:45 AM (14 years, 8 months ago)

So nature is providing males with a higher amount of estrogen and females with higher testosterone. I know this is not always the case, but it seems to be more and more common to find males with feminine characteristics and vice versa. What could be the purpose of these chemical changes? We are at a point in evolution now in which we must integrate both hemispheres of the brain equally to survive. The schism that has lasted for thousands of years is breaking down... but what is this leading to?


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:heartpump: { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } } :heartpump:


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Anonymous

Re: Male / Female Nature [Re: Adamist]
    #726346 - 07/06/02 12:56 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

So nature is providing males with a higher amount of estrogen and females with higher testosterone.
I know of know studies which back up this assertion. Could you please provide links or indicate in what journals they have been published and when.

I know this is not always the case, but it seems to be more and more common to find males with feminine characteristics and vice versa.
Maybe you view things in a smaller circle than I do, but it doesn't seem this way to me. Are Arnold Schwarzenegger, Eminem, Pamela Anderson and Brittany Spears indicative of this trend? There are political groups which are pushing to force certain values and laws on all of us which some have referred to as "The Wussification of America," is this what you are referring to? If so, this is not a worldwide phenomena and there is no indication that it is changing the nature of humanity (from my perspective).


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Re: Male / Female Nature [Re: ]
    #727434 - 07/06/02 10:45 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Evolving- I'd like to do a little dialectic with you on this one. I just want to get to the root of our difference, is that cool with you? I'll assume the affirmative for now. Let's pick from what I mentioned earlier...

Pink and Blue blankets
-I don't see how hormones affect color preferences.

Softball and Hardball
-Maybe testosterone could be a factor here: Softball is less aggressive blah blah blah...

Dolls and G.I. Joes
-THIS is not hormone-induced either. Girls choose dolls because they're in pink packages... blah blah blah....

Skirts and Slacks
-I don't see how hormones affect this either.

Panties and Underwear
-Terminology ala nurture.

Makeup and _______
-If this isn't nurture, then I feel bad for women...

Pretty and Handsome
-More nurture terminology.

Flowery Perfume and Spicy Cologne
-perfume/cologne is definitely terminology. However, I'll allow the meager possibility that somehow scent preferences could somehow be affected by hormones and neurological structure.

There's many more, obviously, so if none of these are good enough, evolving, bring up something else. Really.


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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Anonymous

Re: Male / Female Nature [Re: Sclorch]
    #728973 - 07/07/02 12:28 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Sorry Sclorch, I should have mentioned that all of your examples are cultural (nurture) involving externalities and do not address the underlying differences between the sexes - the male/female natures.

If we take the example of dolls, it's not that little girls play with barbie and boys play with G.I Joe, it's more in the nature of the play. Little girls play will involve social interaction and nurturing behavior, boys will tend to more action.

Mathematics and spacial skills - males tend to be more proficient. Language and social skills - females tend to be more proficient. There's quite a lot of test data to support these.


The following is taken from Understanding The Difference Between Men And Women by Michael G. Conner, Psy.D, Clinical & Medical Psychologist

Problems
Men and women approach problems with similar goals but with different considerations. While men and women can solve problems equally well, their approach and their process are often quit different. For most women, sharing and discussing a problem presents an opportunity to explore, deepen or strengthen the relationship with the person they are talking with. Woman are usually more concerned about how problems are solved than merely solving the problem itself. For women, solving a problem can profoundly impact whether they feel closer and less alone or whether they feel distant and less connected. The process of solving a problem can strengthen or weaken a relationship. Most men are less concerned and do not feel the same as women when solving a problem.

Men approach problems in a very different manner than women. For most men, solving a problem presents an opportunity to demonstrate their competence, their strength of resolve, and their commitment to a relationship. How the problem is solved is not nearly as important as solving it effectively and in the best possible manner. Men have a tendency to dominate and to assume authority in a problem solving process. They set aside their feelings provided the dominance hierarchy was agreed upon in advance and respected. They are often distracted and do not attend well to the quality of the relationship while solving problems.

Some of the more important differences can be illustrated by observing groups of young teenage boys and groups of young teenage girls when they attempt to find their way out of a maze. A group of boys generally establish a hierarchy or chain of command with a leader who emerges on his own or through demonstrations of ability and power. Boys explore the maze using scouts while remaining in distant proximity to each other. Groups of girls tend to explore the maze together as a group without establishing a clear or dominant leader. Relationships tends to be co-equal. Girls tend to elicit discussion and employ "collective intelligence" to the task of discovering a way out. Girls tend to work their way through the maze as a group. Boys tend to search and explore using structured links and a chain of command.

Thinking
While men and women can reach similar conclusions and make similar decisions, the process they use can be quit different and in some cases can lead to entirely different outcomes. In general, men and women consider and process information differently.

Women tend to be intuitive global thinkers. They consider multiple sources of information within a process that can be described as simultaneous, global in perspective and will view elements in the task in terms of their interconnectedness. Women come to understand and consider problems all at once. They take a broad or "collective" perspective, and they view elements in a task as interconnected and interdependent. Women are prone to become overwhelmed with complexities that "exist", or may exist, and may have difficulty separating their personal experience from problems.

Men tend to focus on one problem at a time or a limited number of problems at a time. They have an enhanced ability to separate themselves from problems and minimize the complexity that may exist. Men come to understand and consider problems one piece at a time. They take a linear or sequential perspective, and view elements in a task as less interconnected and more independent. Men are prone to minimize and fail to appreciate subtleties that can be crucial to successful solutions. A male may work through a problem repeatedly, talking about the same thing over and over, rather than trying to address the the problem all at once.

While there are differences in the ways that men and women think, it must be emphasized that they can and do solve problems in a similar manner. There are no absolutes, only tendencies.

Memory
Women have an enhanced ability to recall memories that have strong emotional components. They can also recall events or experiences that have similar emotions in common. Women are very adept at recalling information, events or experiences in which there is a common emotional theme. Men tend to recall events using strategies that rely on reconstructing the experience in terms of elements, tasks or activities that took place. Profound experiences that are associated with competition or physical activities are more easily recalled. There appears to be a structural and chemical basis for observed memory differences. For instance, the hypocampus, the area in the brain primarily responsible for memory, reacts differently to testosterone in men and it reacts differently to changing levels of estrogen and progesterone in women. Women tend to remember or be reminded of different "emotional memories" and content to some extent as part of their menstrual cycle.

Sensitivity
There is evidence to suggest that a great deal of the sensitivity that exists within men and women has a physiological basis. It has been observed that is many cases, women have an enhanced physical alarm response to danger or threat. Their autonomic and sympathetic systems have a lower threshold of arousal and greater reactivity than men. In both men and women, higher levels of testosterone directly affect the aggressive response and behavior centers of the brain. Increasing estrogen and progesterone in men has a "feminizing" effect. Sexually aggressive males become less focused on sexual aggressive behavior and content when they are given female hormones. On the other hand, changing estrogen and progesterone levels in women during menstrual cycles can produce a "flood" of memories as well as strong emotions. Increasing or high levels of testosterone can produce an emotional insensitivity, empathic block and increased indifference to the distress others.

At the heart of sensitivity is our capacity to form, appreciate and maintain relationships that are rewarding. Even here there are important differences. For men, what demonstrates a solid relationship is quit different from that of most women. Men feel closer and validated through shared activities. Such activities include sports, competition, outdoor activities or sexual activities that are decidedly active and physical. While both men and women can appreciate and engage in these activities they often have preferential differences. Women, on the other hand, feel closer and validated through communication, dialogue and intimate sharing of experience, emotional content and personal perspectives. Many men tend to find such sharing and involvement uncomfortable, if not, overwhelming.


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Registered: 07/13/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Re: Male / Female Nature [Re: ]
    #730033 - 07/07/02 08:58 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

Hmm....
Interesting stuff. I'll check that book out.


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Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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Anonymous

Re: Male / Female Nature [Re: Adamist]
    #730039 - 07/07/02 09:03 PM (14 years, 8 months ago)

All I know.. is what I experience.

A few years ago I was cold, calculating, impermeable wall incapable of human emotion, totally left brained. Everything was based on logic and rationality.

Over the past few years, my emotional and creative (feminine) side has unfolded beautifully. I am learning emotion on a higher level than ever before and I love it. I can feel the two sides of the brain balancing as the right side polarizes with the left. Soon I feel it will be a harmonious balance of an integrated brain. That is what I am working towards.


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