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My take on enlightenment right now
    #7622514 -

Enlightenment is the continual process of growth towards the light. A sunflower, by its own nature, grows toward sunlight. Humans must do this, instead, willfully.


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Re: My take on enlightenment right now [Re: WScott]
    #7622532 -

you cannot grow willfully. But you can direct your growth.


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Man is timid and apologetic; he is no longer upright; he dares not say "I think," "I am," but quotes some saint or sage. He is ashamed before the blade of grass or the blowing rose.Man postpones or remembers; he does not live in the present, but with reverted eye laments the past, or, heedless of the riches that surround him, stands on tiptoe to foresee the future. He cannot be happy and strong until he too lives with nature in the present, above time
TRANSCEND


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Re: My take on enlightenment right now [Re: WScott]
    #7624412 -

Quote:
you cannot grow willfully.



Of course you can. Remember, analogies are never exactly the same. We are not plants.

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Re: My take on enlightenment right now [Re: WScott]
    #7624541 -

Quote:
Enlightenment is the continual process of growth towards the light. A sunflower, by its own nature, grows toward sunlight. Humans must do this, instead, willfully.


I disagree. The human will is what prevents humans from acting naturally. Desire is the mind killer.


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Just another spore in the wind.

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Re: My take on enlightenment right now [Re: Seuss]
    #7624562 -

The way I see it desire is a by product of fear, so our dysfunctions all go back to irrational fear as the root.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: My take on enlightenment right now [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #7624594 -

> so our dysfunctions all go back to irrational fear as the root.

Yes, but fear is based upon desire. The desire to live, the desire to not fail, the desire to avoid feeling pain, etc.


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Just another spore in the wind.

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Re: My take on enlightenment right now [Re: WScott]
    #7624644 -

WScottsdale said:
Enlightenment is the continual process of growth towards the light. A sunflower, by its own nature, grows toward sunlight. Humans must do this, instead, willfully.


That's a nice analogy, BUT...it's a bit vague. What is "the light" towards which plants and humans are growing towards?

And it does seem as though this analogy implies that we are fundamentally different than the light. If we have to willfully grow towards it, then we can't originally be "the light", can we?


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"What is in us that turns a deaf ear to the cries of human suffering?"

"Belief is a beautiful armor
But makes for the heaviest sword"
- John Mayer

Making the noise "penicillin" is no substitute for actually taking penicillin.

"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember or overthrow it." -Abraham Lincoln

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Re: My take on enlightenment right now [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #7624649 -

Desire and fear are very closely linked together. I don't think it matters so much which is based on which, but rather, it matters more if we're simply able to fully experience fear or desire as it arises in us.


--------------------
"What is in us that turns a deaf ear to the cries of human suffering?"

"Belief is a beautiful armor
But makes for the heaviest sword"
- John Mayer

Making the noise "penicillin" is no substitute for actually taking penicillin.

"This country, with its institutions, belongs to the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow weary of the existing government, they can exercise their constitutional right of amending it, or their revolutionary right to dismember or overthrow it." -Abraham Lincoln

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Re: My take on enlightenment right now [Re: WScott]
    #7624736 -

Enlightenment is clarity. It is about removing the excess to be happy with the bare essential.


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As the life of a candle,
my wick will burn out.
But, the fire of my mind
shall beam into infinite.

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Re: My take on enlightenment right now [Re: dblaney]
    #7626594 -

dblaney said:
WScottsdale said:
Enlightenment is the continual process of growth towards the light. A sunflower, by its own nature, grows toward sunlight. Humans must do this, instead, willfully.


That's a nice analogy, BUT...it's a bit vague. What is "the light" towards which plants and humans are growing towards?

And it does seem as though this analogy implies that we are fundamentally different than the light. If we have to willfully grow towards it, then we can't originally be "the light", can we?


A more specific perspective is would be much more susceptible to different interpretations.

Light.. I believe that everyone inherently knows what spiritual light would be to themselves (if they believe in spirituality to begin with I suppose). To me it is conducting my life in a way that is harmonious with.. my life. To choose healthier foods for my body, say broccoli and French onion dip (mmmm :P) over a bowl of Fruitloops, or to cut smoking pot back to once a week rather that everyday. I am sure it isn't hard to agree that these things are 'right conduct'. And they are also done willfully. It is my choice to make the change. My choice to attempt to grow.

Those examples are obviously both physical, but it extends into other domains as well (meditations, social interaction, etc.). I feel hesitant to say that enlightenment is only the betterment of ones self.. (awareness/clarity is also part of this, in that, you have to be aware of yourself in order to see that changes/growth might be necessary), but I also feel that it is something that is severely lacking into todays world (at least in materialistic societies) so it may not be that far fetched an idea.

Improving ones self. Seems like such a simple idea. Enlightenment, the same way?


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Re: My take on enlightenment right now [Re: Seuss]
    #7626631 -

Seuss said:
Quote:
Enlightenment is the continual process of growth towards the light. A sunflower, by its own nature, grows toward sunlight. Humans must do this, instead, willfully.


I disagree. The human will is what prevents humans from acting naturally. Desire is the mind killer.


Will is the force that steers the rudder of the boat, in my opinion. Far too many people just go with the flow and accept what is (maybe the reason everything is so fucked up these days).

Don't take it the wrong way, but I wonder, how does one act naturally? You may say, to just be who are. But who I am, myself, wants to do things, don't I? :P


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Re: My take on enlightenment right now [Re: WScott]
    #7626632 -

I hope enlightenment isn't improving oneself. I'm tired of trying to improve myself and falling into darkness and not getting anywhere. I just wish I could know that everyone grows, no matter how slowly but there are many bad examples, hopefully just a reflection of my shadow.

Hell is other people. Enlightenment to me right now is sharing yourself with your other selves. I pray for a little clarity, and I don't understand why it has to come in such small doses but that's alright. Damn, I sound like a Linkin Park song. :lol::rockon:

Quote:
Far too many people just go with the flow and accept what is


Yeah, sometimes I also wish people would do what I want them to do :wink::heart:


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Re: My take on enlightenment right now [Re: EternalCowabunga]
    #7626673 -

I know from reading your posts that you're looking for something EB. I think you're trying to improve yourself for some other reason than to improve yourself, you know? I've realize something.. you can't earn oneness. It is there, always. The beauty of it though is that we're always going to grow. Oneness isn't static, it is dynamic. I wrote something else the other day when I wrote what my intial post was.

"It seems as though life is, at its simplest level, a collective term for all of the growth which is occurring at every speed and size, every moment. From the perspective of the human being, it should appear as a great piece of art; a blossoming of imaginatively unreachable proportions. Should. When one gets too wrapped up in their own part, the ego's past regrets or the worries of the future, they may lose their synchronicity. A better word may be harmony." - me :smile:


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Re: My take on enlightenment right now [Re: WScott]
    #7626677 -

WScottsdale said:
Enlightenment is the continual process of growth towards the light. A sunflower, by its own nature, grows toward sunlight. Humans must do this, instead, willfully.


Humans are the same as a sunflower or anything else. Enlightenment is a concept humans use to justify their self-importance.

All things grow towards pleasure or what is good for them. Humans often make unskillful and ignorant attempts at this but it's still their goal as is that of all living things.


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

Edited by Icelander (11/12/07 04:44 PM)

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Re: My take on enlightenment right now [Re: WScott]
    #7626707 -

Wow, you wrote that? That was really good :smile:

Thank you for stating that oneness isn't static. Sometimes, from my point of view, it seems sometimes that people are doing things so easily and effortlessly that there struggles are pretty much non-existent. Good to know this isn't the case.


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