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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: elbisivni]
    #7584109 -

Lennon said that he was reading a review of Revolver, and the critic said that the main riff on "And Your Bird can Sing" was a wonderful ascending Aeolian scale. Lennon thought it was some kind of bird or something.

I recommend everyone here watch the Anthologies.

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: jewunit]
    #7584137 -

jewunit said:
Personally I like the picture of the first one itself better.
I also find it funny how people in the psychedelic community grab on to the Beatles like they're gods. Why not give more attention to the people who were responsible for getting the Beatles into that type of shit?


Y'mean Bob Dylan?

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: jewunit]
    #7584152 -

jewunit said:
The Beatles would have been so fucking insignificant if it weren't for their early shit. Imagine if they were a Pepper's group throughout their whole career. They never would have had even close to the amount of popularity they did.


Being less popular is not the same as being insignificant. They gained the world's attention with their early stuff, which gave them a platform to experiment, but it's not like they had nothing to say. Thank god they started with poppy teeny bopper shit, or we would have missed out on some of the greatest music ever made, due to the judgmental nature of human beings.


--------------------
Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man.  For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire.  Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it.

~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"

:heartpump:

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: jewunit]
    #7584164 -

jewunit said:
I also find it funny how people in the psychedelic community grab on to the Beatles like they're gods. Why not give more attention to the people who were responsible for getting the Beatles into that type of shit?


And who's that?

People like the Beatles because they are very good. What's wrong with that?


--------------------
Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man.  For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire.  Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it.

~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"

:heartpump:

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: Silversoul]
    #7584171 -

My favorite album cover is Rubber Soul, where there's just a hint of psychedelia, both in the songs and on the cover.




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Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man.  For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire.  Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it.

~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"

:heartpump:

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: BrAiN]
    #7584240 -

BrAiN said:
Then again.. there was Santana who played fucking high as shit on DMT at Woodstock...


Really? I never knew he played on DMT....

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: Thin White Duke]
    #7584433 -

Phumfeinz said:
jewunit said:
Personally I like the picture of the first one itself better.
I also find it funny how people in the psychedelic community grab on to the Beatles like they're gods. Why not give more attention to the people who were responsible for getting the Beatles into that type of shit?


Y'mean Bob Dylan?


Yeah, that was the subliminal message there.

Whiskey: The only reason the Beatles are so significant is because of their influence. They changed the way pop music was played. I think many people, especially in the drug/psychedelic culture, think it's because of their influence on that particular culture and form of music. While this influence is large, that's not why Rolling Stone and other such glossy magazines think they are the greatest band ever. If it wasn't for their poppy stuff, that I find fairly unappealing, they never would have been anything. You're right, we would have most likely missed out on some good stuff, but who knows where music would be today.

That's the problem with the way people look at bands that are influential. Just because a band was influential does not mean they were good. People automatically assume that because they changed music they made music better. Personally I think music would be in a far better situation today if the Beatles never existed, or at least didn't ever play shit like I Want To Hold Your Hand.


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!

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: jewunit]
    #7584488 -

Quote:
I think many people, especially in the drug/psychedelic culture, think it's because of their influence on that particular culture and form of music.

That's the problem with the way people look at bands that are influential. Just because a band was influential does not mean they were good.


I don't care how influential they are. I don't care how they changed the direction of music. Their music is awesome, regardless of what other bands did before and after.

Quote:
The only reason the Beatles are so significant is because of their influence.


I think you are mistaken.

Where does influence come from? Marketing is a part of it, but good business cannot keep ANY band on top of the musical world through twelve albums and beyond. It was their skill at the craft of music. That may still be lost on you; I myself had no appreciation for what they accomplished until fairly recently.

They were an extremely talented, hardworking band. As a songwriter, I find their ability to write so many excellent melodies absolutely magical. Nobody has delivered such a volume of top-notch material. If you know of an act that has, please let me know who they are.


--------------------
Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man.  For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire.  Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it.

~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"

:heartpump:

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: WhiskeyClone]
    #7584523 -

The reason they were at the top when they were around was, obviously, because of their music mainly. They did have a ridiculous amount of number one hits. I listen to those hits and I am purely disgusted. (Okay, that's an exaggeration.) To think how they were marketed didn't have an effect on that is ridiculous, but you're right that really isn't the reason they were huge. They would not be nearly as popular still today if they didn't change the face of music. I don't see how that can be denied.

Obviously I can name tons of artists and bands that I think have delivered more top notch material, since I think I've made it pretty clear that I think the Beatles are one of the most overrated groups ever. That said, however, I don't want people to think I don't like them. I do. I could just live without pretty much every number one hit they ever had. The stuff that is the base for their popularity is the exact stuff of theirs that I LOATHE.

If you don't think the reason the Beatles are significant is because of their influence, then start listening to doowop, and tell me what happened to that genre of music once the Beatles came around. Or read the articles that proclaim them the best band ever, and see what they say. Or just listen to the development of rock throughout history. Their impact is undeniable, and when a band has such a huge influence, then they will be infinitely significant. There's no denying it.


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!

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: jewunit]
    #7584525 -

Damnit, I used some variation on "That's undeniable" twice in that post. What bad rhetoric skillz.


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!

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: jewunit]
    #7584557 -

One of my buddies' dad's used to be a sound engineer for the WB. I don't know how but he managed to come across an old school video tape from way back in the day

It's a video of John Lenon (pre-drugs and looking all proper like in that first album cover) in the backseat of a limo with Bob Dylan. Dylan was FUCKED UP out of his mind and rambling half incoherently at Lenon and Lenon's trying to respond to him, but half the time he just has this "WTF are you babbling about?" look on his face.

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: BrAiN]
    #7584752 -




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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: jewunit]
    #7584772 -

jewunit said:
Personally I like the picture of the first one itself better.
I also find it funny how people in the psychedelic community grab on to the Beatles like they're gods. Why not give more attention to the people who were responsible for getting the Beatles into that type of shit?



Let me tell you what happened: I had a dentist who invited me and John and our ex-wives to dinner, and he had this acid he’d got off the guy who ran Playboy in London. And the Playboy guy had gotten it off, you know, the people who had it in America. What’s his name, Tim Leary. And this guy had never had it himself, didn’t know anything about it, but he thought it was an aphrodisiac and he had this girlfriend with huge breasts. He invited us down there with our blonde wives and I think he thought he was gonna have a scene. And he put it in our coffee without telling us—he didn’t take any himself. We didn’t know we had it, and we’d made an arrangement earlier—after we had dinner we were gonna go to this nightclub to see some friends of ours who were playing in a band. And I was saying, "OK, let’s go, we’ve got to go," and this guy kept saying, "No, don’t go, finish your coffee. Then, 20 minutes later or something, I’m saying, "C’mon John, we’d better go now. We’re gonna miss the show." And he says we shouldn’t go ’cause we’ve had LSD. I’d heard about LSD, but it was before all the panic, everybody saying heaven and hell and all this stuff. So, fortunately, I didn’t care. And I could sense there was something weird going on. Then he said, "Well, OK then, we’ll come with you—I’ll drive you there, leave your car here." And I said, "No, no wait a minute. I’m taking my car." We went and he followed.

So we got to this place and we just sat down and I think ordered a drink and then suddenly something happened. I just got this overwhelming feeling, I couldn’t put my finger on why it was happening, but it was just like I was so in love with everything. I just felt so great I wanted to hug everybody and tell ’em how much I loved them. And then suddenly the room started moving a bit and stuff like that, and the next thing I remember it was like World War III was happening. Bombs were dropping, all kinds of things, and I finally gathered my senses together and realized the club had closed. They’d put all the lights on and the waiters were going around putting all the chairs on top of the tables and sweeping the floors. We somehow got out of there and walked to this next club—the Ad Lib Club—it just went on forever. So John and I had it together. We’d heard of it, but we never knew what it was about and it was put in our coffee maliciously. So it really wasn’t us turning each other or the world or anything—we were the victims of silly people.

- George Harrison


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Every Animal Is Someone 🌱 watchdominion.org

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: jewunit]
    #7584788 -

Sure, but what I am trying to say is that the reason they were so influential is the sheer quality of their music. It was so damn good, everybody liked it.

Quote:
They would not be nearly as popular still today if they didn't change the face of music. I don't see how that can be denied.


I am not denying that. Their influence is unquestionable, but I contend that their influence is the result of their music and little else.

As for the number one hits, they are not the ones that are so beloved to me. Obviously you are not a Beatles fan. You probably aren't familiar with Things We Said Today or I'm Only Sleeping or Michelle, and it's the obscure songs (and I reiterate, the sheer number of good ones) that convince me nobody has come close to their songwriting prowess since.

If you can listen to a song like She Said She Said without hearing anything special in it then okay, I would not expect you to understand why the Beatles are regarded in the way they are.

Quote:
I think I've made it pretty clear that I think the Beatles are one of the most overrated groups ever.


Calling a band overrated is just a cheap shot. No artist can live up to the amount of praise and reverence that is heaped on bands like the Beatles. This is the way all products are marketed: with great hyperbole. Watch any commercial; every product is the perfect answer to life's problems, the greatest show on earth, the last whatever you'll ever need. Never is any fault or weakness mentioned or suggested. Add to this the average person's tendency to overstate just about everything, and of course they are overrated. It says nothing about their musical abilty.

Radiohead is overrated. Led Zeppelin is overrated. Pink Floyd is overrated. The one thing they all have in common? They are all fucking fantastic, groundbreaking bands.

I think we should take the word overrated and toss it from the dictionary. It's an easy way of diminishing anything. It's almost become a sport, slapping that overrated label on anything just to cut it down.


--------------------
Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man.  For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire.  Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it.

~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"

:heartpump:

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: WhiskeyClone]
    #7584949 -

You couldn't be more right in that post.

I'm basically saying I, personally, don't think they are that amazing. That said, what I've heard of there's is obviously limited. The Beatles that people on this board know, love, and praise, are not the main Beatles that the general public knows, loves, and praises. Maybe they were in their day, maybe they weren't, it's not my place to say, I'm only 19. It just bothers me that so many people are so willing to call them the greatest band ever based on their influence (and I truly believe that's why people give them that title.)


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!

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: jewunit]
    #7585011 -

jewunit said:
You couldn't be more right in that post.

I'm basically saying I, personally, don't think they are that amazing. That said, what I've heard of there's is obviously limited. The Beatles that people on this board know, love, and praise, are not the main Beatles that the general public knows, loves, and praises. Maybe they were in their day, maybe they weren't, it's not my place to say, I'm only 19. It just bothers me that so many people are so willing to call them the greatest band ever based on their influence (and I truly believe that's why people give them that title.)


:smile:

I would have said the same things a few years ago.  I too had the "general public's" relationship with their music.  To me they were teeny bopper stuff for a while, then psychedelic music for a while, then they had a fit and broke up.  Lots of catchy, cute little songs, with the occasional oddball drug song.

What changed my image of them was listening to their albums, in chronological order.  I began to see how a band's music could bloom so beautifully and organically.  I could almost perceive the events in their lives that precipitated this evolution.  At the time I did this, I began experiencing my own personal transformation, (largely catalyzed by psychedelic use) and the Beatles provided the perfect soundtrack.  Those songs are now so dear to me I cannot identify with my old perception of the Beatles.

I finally saw why people exalt them like they do; and I realized that before that, I didn't have a clue.


--------------------
Welcome evermore to gods and men is the self-helping man.  For him all doors are flung wide: him all tongues greet, all honors crown, all eyes follow with desire.  Our love goes out to him and embraces him, because he did not need it.

~ R.W. Emerson, "Self-Reliance"

:heartpump:

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: WhiskeyClone]
    #7585019 -

WhiskeyClone said:
jewunit said:
You couldn't be more right in that post.

I'm basically saying I, personally, don't think they are that amazing. That said, what I've heard of there's is obviously limited. The Beatles that people on this board know, love, and praise, are not the main Beatles that the general public knows, loves, and praises. Maybe they were in their day, maybe they weren't, it's not my place to say, I'm only 19. It just bothers me that so many people are so willing to call them the greatest band ever based on their influence (and I truly believe that's why people give them that title.)


:smile:

I would have said the same things a few years ago.  I too had the "general public's" relationship with their music.  To me they were teeny bopper stuff for a while, then psychedelic music for a while, then they had a fit and broke up.  Lots of catchy, cute little songs, with the occasional oddball drug song.

What changed my image of them was listening to their albums, in chronological order.  I began to see how a band's music could bloom so beautifully and organically.  I could almost perceive the events in their lives that precipitated this evolution.  At the time I did this, I began experiencing my own personal transformation, (largely catalyzed by psychedelic use) and the Beatles provided the perfect soundtrack.  Those songs are now so dear to me I cannot identify with my old perception of the Beatles.

I finally saw why people exalt them like they do; and I realized that before that, I didn't have a clue.


That's pretty much how it is for me.

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: WhiskeyClone]
    #7586332 -

Well, obviously I can't knock it if I haven't tried it, but I just don't think that makes them good. To me, at least, hearing a bands progression, no matter how beautiful it is and how well it synchs with my life, isn't going to make me appreciate them (well, I suppose if it fit with me on a personal level I would definitely appreciate and like it more.) I can, however, respect why you like them and I'm not trying to trash that in any way, and you know that.


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!

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Re: The Beatles: The true rock inspiration? [Re: Thin White Duke]
    #7586831 -

Phumfeinz said:




"I think I'm gonna turn you into Ron Coleman".

Man.. either I'm not as DOWN with the HIP LINGO of 1960, or Dylan is blazed outta his mind.

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