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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: Redstorm]
    #4947143 -

Redstorm said:
If you were using your own mind, perhaps you should coin your own term instead of just taking an established one and giving it whatever attributes you feel like.


That's what anarchists do though.....use their own mind.

I will find a stupid source though, if it means that much to you.


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"Whatever you do, you need to keep moving.  Because when you stop moving you die (physically and emotionally).

Good luck and blessings of happiness and fortune." ~ RandalFlagg RIP


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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: rogue_pixie]
    #4947144 -

rogue_pixie said:
Paradigm said:
RandalFlagg said:
Listen, I don't mean to get on your ass.

But, EVERY group (whether it be religious or ideological) has people on the fringe who are willing to engage in violence in order to further their beliefs. Muslims do it, Rightists do it, Leftists do it, and the anarchists are no different.


And since many schools of thought in anarchism advocate a violent overthrow of the state, it is an ideology more likely than many others to inspire such violence.


Intellectual bollocks.

Any so called anarchist who advocates violence isn't one.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_True_Scotsman


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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: Silversoul]
    #4947147 -

Paradigm said:
I think you have to separate communism from Marx's plan to get there. Communism was supposed to be final goal, while the transition is known as socialism. I'm actually much more sympathetic to communism than I am to socialism.


Sorry for the two page late reply -- would you care to elucidate what the final outcome would look like (so there's no confusion)? Another thread might be more appropriate.


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?When Alexander the Great visted the philosopher Diogenes and asked whether he could do anything for him, Diogenes is said to have replied: 'Yes, stand a little less between me and the sun.' It is what every citizen is entitled to ask of his government.?
-Henry Hazlitt in 'Economics in One Lesson'

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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: rogue_pixie]
    #4947150 -

Anarchists don't just make up whatever they feel like and then stick a name on it. That's what people who don't know what they're talking about do.

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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4947152 -

RandalFlagg said:
rogue_pixie said:
True anarchists use their own minds.

And don't let others think for them.  :smirk:


If that is true then there would be many varied opinions on what "anarchism" is, what it's focus should be, and what should be done to achieve it.  With something so subjective how can you claim absolutes like "true anarchists do this and that"?


There's only one absolute in anarchism, that's freedom for everyone, which means no one imposes on anyone elses freedom. That is the one and only absolute as I've said many times before!


--------------------
"Whatever you do, you need to keep moving.  Because when you stop moving you die (physically and emotionally).

Good luck and blessings of happiness and fortune." ~ RandalFlagg RIP


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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: Redstorm]
    #4947156 -

Redstorm said:
Anarchists don't just make up whatever they feel like and then stick a name on it. That's what people who don't know what they're talking about do.



AAAARRGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


--------------------
"Whatever you do, you need to keep moving.  Because when you stop moving you die (physically and emotionally).

Good luck and blessings of happiness and fortune." ~ RandalFlagg RIP


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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: rogue_pixie]
    #4947160 -

Are you free to punch me in the nose?


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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: rogue_pixie]
    #4947166 -

rogue_pixie said:
There's only one absolute in anarchism, that's freedom for everyone, which means no one imposes on anyone elses freedom. That is the one and only absolute as I've said many times before!


The anarchist who blew away President McKinley obviously disagreed with you. So did the anarchists who set off that bomb on September 16, 1920. With a school of thought that is so subjective and that has such a checkered past, how can you claim it has any absolutes?

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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: rogue_pixie]
    #4947167 -

anarachists do believe whatever they want to.....that's why it's called anarchism, freedom to be yourself!


--------------------
"Whatever you do, you need to keep moving.  Because when you stop moving you die (physically and emotionally).

Good luck and blessings of happiness and fortune." ~ RandalFlagg RIP


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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4947169 -

RandalFlagg said:
rogue_pixie said:
There's only one absolute in anarchism, that's freedom for everyone, which means no one imposes on anyone elses freedom. That is the one and only absolute as I've said many times before!


The anarchist who blew away President McKinley obviously disagreed with you. So did the anarchists who set off that bomb on September 16, 1920. With a school of thought that is so subjective and that has such a checkered past, how can you claim it has any absolutes?


It has ONE absolute, without that one absolute, anarchism couldn't work. Is it really that difficult!!!


--------------------
"Whatever you do, you need to keep moving.  Because when you stop moving you die (physically and emotionally).

Good luck and blessings of happiness and fortune." ~ RandalFlagg RIP


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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: rogue_pixie]
    #4947173 -

this has been entertaining.

rogue pixie you need to pop in here (Pal) every few months and talk about your anarchist views...or is it pacifist views...


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America's debt problem is a "sign of leadership failure"

We have "reckless fiscal policies"

America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership.

Americans deserve better

Barack Obama

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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: lonestar2004]
    #4947184 -

yeah but they'll never understand

because they don't want to :frown:


--------------------
"Whatever you do, you need to keep moving.  Because when you stop moving you die (physically and emotionally).

Good luck and blessings of happiness and fortune." ~ RandalFlagg RIP


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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: Silversoul]
    #4947189 -

very true, though one could apply an "immanenet critique" to most thinkers and arrive at a diff conclusion. some espouse violent upheavals, some espouse non-violent ones. it could be argued that the non-violent are the most consistent but you are correct in saying there is a diversity of opinions on certain matters within anarchist thought.


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"I didnt fight a secret war in nicaragua so you could walk these streets of freedom bad-mouthing lady america in your damn mirrored sunglasses."

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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: rogue_pixie]
    #4947191 -

rogue_pixie said:
yeah but they'll never understand

because they don't want to :frown:


I think I'm in love with you.

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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: RandalFlagg]
    #4947212 -

There's nothing like a good 15 minute hummer to foster tolerance and understanding amongst the hoi polloi


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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: Ancalagon]
    #4947213 -

Ancalagon said:
Sorry for the two page late reply -- would you care to elucidate what the final outcome would look like (so there's no confusion)? Another thread might be more appropriate.


Communism is a classless society in which the means of production are owned by everyone in common(not by the state, as is the case with socialism). Work would be done not by being an employee for a company doing one type of work, as is the case under capitalism, but rather one could do several types of work through voluntary association. Marx believed that capitalism alienated the worker from his labor because the capitalists controlled the production. Under communism, he believed, people would be able to reach their "full human potential" by applying their many skills to many different tasks and recieving the full product of their labor.


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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: zappaisgod]
    #4947220 -

zappaisgod said:
There's nothing like a good 15 minute hummer to foster tolerance and understanding amongst the hoi polloi


Do you ever have anything sensible to say? :rolleyes:


--------------------
"Whatever you do, you need to keep moving.  Because when you stop moving you die (physically and emotionally).

Good luck and blessings of happiness and fortune." ~ RandalFlagg RIP


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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: kilgore_trout]
    #4947227 -

yes, there is a relatively absolute facet to anarchism, but others that are less so. "immanent critique" which might be to your liking as you seem to have somewhat applied it, could make them more consistent.


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"I didnt fight a secret war in nicaragua so you could walk these streets of freedom bad-mouthing lady america in your damn mirrored sunglasses."

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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: rogue_pixie]
    #4947230 -

rogue_pixie said:
It has ONE absolute, without that one absolute, anarchism couldn't work. Is it really that difficult!!!


It isn't that difficult, but you are. The one absolute in anarchism, which defines every anarchist ideology, is the absence of the state. Now, it's true that some anarchists such as Proudhoun or Tolstoy(I bet you don't even recognize these names) were against using violence to achieve this end. But others, such as Bakunin(often called one of the "fathers of anarchism") or Kropotkin(sometimes called the "anarchist prince") did believe revolutionary violence was justified in order to achieve freedom from the state.


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Re: Memorial Planned For Victims Of Communism [Re: kilgore_trout]
    #4947231 -

was this the wrong thread?


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"I didnt fight a secret war in nicaragua so you could walk these streets of freedom bad-mouthing lady america in your damn mirrored sunglasses."

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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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