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OfflineJust_a_Shadow
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Dynamic Knowledge Explaining Spirituality (Picture)
    #4549219 - 08/18/05 12:07 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

This, to some extent this explains spirituality, tell me what you think. I developed this concept myself, and would never have been able to had I never found spirituality. I was the simple form of yin and yang all my life, not the complex form that most humans are.

Changes made or to be be made to this concept:

- The Idea that this concept is a theory has been proven wrong, it is merely a concept or belief untell undoubtably proven with knowledge and experimentation. Credit Due: Diploid

- The word Logic has been replaced with Knowledge, and Logic has become the means of processing both Spirituality (the potential unkown based on all senses) with knowledge (the known). Credit Due: RedNukleus

- The end of time belief is doubtable based on lack of information and explination of perception and should be better developed. Credit Due: Icelander

- Unification through mono static thought patterns should be better explained as wrong based on the perspective of a human being. Credit Due: Icelander

- Debunk the concept that the awareness of what you do not know is anything like the literal form of not knowing. Credit Due: fireworks_god

- Better explain and explore perceptions such as: ?ignorance lying opposite of spirituality? and ?knowledge lying opposite of spirituality? Credit Due: fireworks_god

- Emphasis the dynamic perceptions of spirituality Credit Due: fireworks_god




[Edit]
This concept is based on:
Quantum Negative Information Theory
Dictionary Definition of the word Logic
Dictionary Definition of the word Knowledge
Charles Darwin's Theory of Evolution
Chinese Yin and Yang philosophy Principals
Neural Network Concept in Artificial Intelligence


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Edited by Just_a_Shadow (08/18/05 03:24 PM)


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OfflineVulture
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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: Just_a_Shadow]
    #4549339 - 08/18/05 12:28 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

i like it

it makes sense


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OfflineJust_a_Shadow
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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: Vulture]
    #4549367 - 08/18/05 12:32 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

It needs to be, my intention is to reach out to the atheist community which I was a large part of, I do not care about what religion a person has, just as long as they know that there is a god or a supreme being beyond this world. So if anyone has any input at all, please share it, it takes more then one perspective to discover the true meaning of spirituality.


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InvisibleDiploidM
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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: Just_a_Shadow]
    #4549449 - 08/18/05 12:47 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I developed this theory myself

This isn't meant to beat up on you, so don't take it personally. I just like to point out when someone who doesn't know about science uses a science word improperly to justify non-science.

--

Your presentation isn't a theory and contains no logic.

1. Theories have to be subject to tests (experiments) to see if they are true or not; your presentation can't be tested by any experiment.

2. Theories have to be demonstrably falsifiable if they are in fact false; there is no way to show that your presentation is wrong if it happens to actually be wrong.

3. Theories have to be based on some observations that can be seen by everyone with their own senses; your presentation is based on your feelings and thoughts which no one but you can experience.

4. Theories must show necessary consequences that can be tested for by experiments so that failing the experiment means the theory is wrong; your presentation makes no predictions that can be looked for by experiments.


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1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


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OfflineJust_a_Shadow
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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: Diploid]
    #4549468 - 08/18/05 12:51 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Interesting, then it would be a beleif or concept at this point, and my intention is to make it a theory. I will use what you just said as an outline of what I must do to make it a theory. And I appreciate you pointing this out.


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: Just_a_Shadow]
    #4549494 - 08/18/05 12:58 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

LuNaTiX said:
It needs to be, my intention is to reach out to the atheist community which I was a large part of, I do not care about what religion a person has, just as long as they know that there is a god or a supreme being beyond this world. So if anyone has any input at all, please share it, it takes more then one perspective to discover the true meaning of spirituality.




What is your definition of spirituality? The ability to see beyond your current life?


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: Ravus]
    #4549498 - 08/18/05 12:59 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

And why did you stop being an atheist? What evidence do you have of this supreme being? What if I don't believe you and never accept this being as true?


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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InvisibleDiploidM
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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: Just_a_Shadow]
    #4549511 - 08/18/05 01:02 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

then it would be a beleif or concept at this point

Conjecture, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's wrong, only untestable and so not theory or science.

In science all theories must be testable somehow. If a theory survives the test, it's tentatively accepted as true, unless some future improved test shows it's not. If a theory fails the test, then it's thrown out or adjusted so that it then passes the test.

Repeat the cycle of test, refine, test, refine and as your theory improves, it will converge on Truth. This is how science constantly improves and grows its pool of knowledge.


--------------------
Republican Values:

1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.

4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.


Edited by Diploid (08/18/05 01:10 AM)


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OfflineJust_a_Shadow
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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: Ravus]
    #4549561 - 08/18/05 01:17 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Then it is meant to be, there is a purpose for everything. When you look at electricity, there is a positive, and a negative, do either of them serve a more supreme purpose? Yet they are both opposites and oppose each other. If you would like to find spirituality though logic, then you must play the role of a semi-god and simulate the creation of another existence much like our own. I looked at AI and obsessed over it because it could have become everything that I wanted to be, pure logic, or a supreme form us a human. This is where I found ?good? and ?evil?, and made the connection towards spirituality.


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OfflineJust_a_Shadow
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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: Ravus]
    #4549572 - 08/18/05 01:20 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Ravus said:
Quote:

LuNaTiX said:
It needs to be, my intention is to reach out to the atheist community which I was a large part of, I do not care about what religion a person has, just as long as they know that there is a god or a supreme being beyond this world. So if anyone has any input at all, please share it, it takes more then one perspective to discover the true meaning of spirituality.




What is your definition of spirituality? The ability to see beyond your current life?




yes, that is all, and keep in mind words can't accuratly describe many things. If you can not explain to a blind man what it is like to see, then it is not an easy task to explain to an atheist what it is like to be spiritual.


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OfflineLittleBen
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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: Just_a_Shadow]
    #4549577 - 08/18/05 01:21 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Motherfucking beautiful. Not that I think thats how simple we are, but I like it.


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Gaia, as you awaken, I heal myself. As I awaken, you are healed.


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InvisibleRavus
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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: Just_a_Shadow]
    #4549591 - 08/18/05 01:24 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

yes, that is all, and keep in mind words can't accuratly describe many things. If you can not explain to a blind man what it is like to see, then it is not an easy task to explain to an atheist what it is like to be spiritual.




Indeed, seeing as the intelligent atheist will operate on evidence and logic, not leaps of faith.

Take enough leaps of faith and you can jump off a cliff without knowing it.


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So long as you are praised think only that you are not yet on your own path but on that of another.


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OfflineJust_a_Shadow
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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: LittleBen]
    #4549601 - 08/18/05 01:29 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I appreciate the compliment. But I want everyone here to understand that I am and never will think of myself as anything more then anything or anyone else. I am merely trying to understand spirituality enough to be able to share it with others more effectively, and allow them to find their own path. I found my spirituality through some very weird shit, and still had to leap over a few areas. I want to go back and fill those areas in, so that disbelievers can have a ganeral path to follow across this dangerous area.


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OfflineJust_a_Shadow
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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: Ravus]
    #4549612 - 08/18/05 01:31 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

That is very true, which is why I believe that a person must balance their logic and spirituality, either one out of line is evil in my eyes.


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OfflineRedNucleus
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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: Just_a_Shadow]
    #4550692 - 08/18/05 08:49 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I think if you changed the words spirituality and logic to something else, which I haven't figured out, then I might agree with what you are saying. However, I do not agree that spirituality and logic are two sides of the same coin. Logic is the process of understanding the relationship of facts, but spirituality is a broad term for the process of seeking or creating a deeper meaning or purpose in life. For your idea to work, logic has to be the yang of spirituality's yin. I believe that these two concepts do not share this relationship.


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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: Just_a_Shadow]
    #4550790 - 08/18/05 10:08 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I see no solid evidence for your final conclusion: end of existence as a normal human being thingy. This seems like fantasy to me. Mr. Natural sez,"Twas ever thus". :wink:


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: RedNucleus]
    #4551000 - 08/18/05 11:44 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I noticed this also, logic did not quite fit right, and perhaps a better word would be knowledge. Perhaps spirituality is the absence of knowledge? If you read the link about
Quantum Negative Information Theory, it explains spirituality in a sense; it was a very interesting reading none the less. Just because it does not exist, doesn?t mean it does not serve a purpose.


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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: Icelander]
    #4551030 - 08/18/05 11:54 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

You must look at the world and where it is headed, as we become more dependent on computers, technology, and internet , as we play more and more games to escape reality as a stress reliever, as we become more and more logical because that is what works in this world right? Well if you are an evolutionist, then you will understand that if this keeps on in this direction, we will slowly need our senses less and less, our vision, our hearing our taste touch smell with time will become worn down (most humans that is). As us humans start to lose their senses, we will slowly become more and more accustomed to thinking, and eventually become more and more logical, lost in our own consciences until we become basically what I believe to be an advanced system that thrives on knowledge and processing, and those who become the most logical will become more powerful, much like businessmen, and will strive to do what is logical, and that is create their own logical god, which will be AGI.

AGI = Artificial General Intelligence, which I believe to be a cold hearted (or no hearted) calculating machine.

That is the best way I can describe my belief about this situation.

I believe in this day and age, some people are balanced mentally (Knowledge / Other Senses) but the majority is separating, one half is becoming too Intelligent and reject their other senses while the other half it becoming to in touch with their other senses and are rejecting intelligence and knowledge. I believe this will ultimately lead to a separation and war.


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OfflineRedNucleus
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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: Just_a_Shadow]
    #4551035 - 08/18/05 11:56 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Thanks for not getting defensive. I respect that. So you said perhaps spirituality is the absence of knowledge. I don't know where to go from there but I had my own idea. Could spirituality be, perhaps, the feeling or sense of purpose or greater meaning? Then logic could be, perhaps, calculation and manipulation of ideas, but without a feeling of greater purpose or meaning? I know this is pretty much what you just said, but in more words. However, I think that's all you really need to make this puzzle fit.

So if you are full feelings of purpose and meaning in your life, and all these ideas, and you make conclusions without finding out what is true and what isn't, then you become the "delusional nutjob".

On the other hand, if you are just a big walking book of facts, but don't focus at all on the deeper meaning of these facts, i.e., how they all tie together and make a greater picture of things that holds deep meaning, or gives purpose to life-- If you are a person like this, then you are that "emotionless robot".

In this way, the two ideas do seem to balance each other out. I think you have a good thing going here. Did you notice that one of your yin-yangs is upside down compared to the others? haha.


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Re: Spiritually explained with logic (picture) [Re: RedNucleus]
    #4551082 - 08/18/05 12:10 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

thanks for not getting defensive. I respect that.



People who get defensive never change, im willing to incorperate or change my beleifs based on various perspectives, spirituality can be explained in so many ways that it should not just stop with one explination.

Quote:

So you said perhaps spirituality is the absence of knowledge. I don't know where to go from there but I had my own idea. Could spirituality be, perhaps, the feeling or sense of purpose or greater meaning? Then logic could be, perhaps, calculation and manipulation of ideas, but without a feeling of greater purpose or meaning? I know this is pretty much what you just said, but in more words. However, I think that's all you really need to make this puzzle fit.




Yes that is right, although my description and beliefs have changed slightly since this post from input of memebers, basicly what you said is right. In other words, Knowledge is the Opposite of Spirituality, and Logic in a sense is the processing of both these sides, although logic in this day and age is more deemed towards Knowledge because noone can process what does not exist with what exists.


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