Sinbad said:

The point being that LSD can certainly make you "think" you have gained enlightenment or access to some spiritual realm, but really its just messing around with your senses and brain chemistry in a way that has uncertain results on the individual, usually making the indivudal see, feel and sense things in a different way, form the usual society norm. Which can, in some cases, trigger acute psycosis, as well as contribute to other minor mental distrubances.

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That perfectly describes any experience or situation that one may be exposed to in the path known as life.





Peace.

Sinbad said:

Really? Can eating an orange make you think you've attained enlightnement and accessed some higher heavenly realm? If so, im going down the corner shop right now, to ask Appu if he has any of those "oranges" in stock! 

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Its certainly possible. There lies no meaning in any experience on its own, so the meaning we derive from it could manifest in any infinite manner.


Peace.

Sinbad said:

Really? Can eating an orange make you think you've attained enlightnement and accessed some higher heavenly realm? If so, im going down the corner shop right now, to ask Appu if he has any of those "oranges" in stock! 

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I've seen people trying to attain enlightenment just be smelling an orange . I've heard it gives you luck when playing poker ...

MAIA

Sinbad said:

So what your saying is that its possible to delude ourselves into believing anything, at any time, without limit? Hmm, i tend to agree with you there, but only from the point of view of insanity of course. 

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Yes Sinbad, and the deluded ones think they are not, and are sure to tell others what the truth is.

Icelander said:

Sinbad said:

So what your saying is that its possible to delude ourselves into believing anything, at any time, without limit? Hmm, i tend to agree with you there, but only from the point of view of insanity of course. 

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Yes Sinbad, and the deluded ones think they are not, and are sure to tell others what the truth is.

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And what of the sane people? Do they say nothing? Are they silent? Or do they try and help dsipel the delusions of the insane by any means possible? Maybe some of them even give up and join in, in the game of insanity, becuase its the easier (less compassionate) option? If you knew the real truth of the situation, would you stay silent? Or would you try to unplug more people from the matrix of their delusion? Knowing the Truth is beyond belief. it all comes down to whether you are willing to take the blue pill, or the red pill.

Take this as you will. 

Sinbad said:

So what your saying is that its possible to delude ourselves into believing anything, at any time, without limit? Hmm, i tend to agree with you there, but only from the point of view of insanity of course. 

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Sure, the possibillity is there, as long as the mind operates with programming that allows this possibillity.

Of course, most people have a mind that is programmed in such a manner as to build a consistent method of defining meaning, based on patterns and tendencies of that person, which tends to prevent such a possibillity. It is this that determines the meaning for an experience much moreso than it is the experience itself defining that meaning. A person's meaning will be more limited and based on past experience and preconceived notions than an insane possibillity of any given meaning being applicable.

The point of even addressing this is that different people define for themselves different meanings and thereby different experiences than other people do in the same and similar situations, based on their past experiences and the meanings defined when met with past experiences. The use of entheogens and psychadelics will have different results for different people, depending on the dynamics of the personalities and minds of each person.


Peace.

Icelander said:

If you knew the real truth of the situation, would you stay silent?
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Yes dear friend Sinbad. If I knew the real truth. But how can I know if I know what the "real" truth is? I am giving it my best guess but I am not foolish enough to declair I know the whole/real truth. That would be delusion. You may choose to claim that you or someone you believe in knows the real truth. But my guess is like everyone else you are taking your best shot and nothing more.

In ten years your real truth may have changed. Unless of course you are fully realized. Are you?

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So your answer is "Yes" you would stay silent? Oh what a compassionate person you must be that when all others are suffering deeply, and you look through the bars of thier self-made prison cells, and think to yourself "Well its there fault, they did it to themselves". And walk away uneffected by their pain.

Since when did i claim that i knew the whole truth? Or even that i know someone who knows "it". Not that there is really any any essential "self" or "other" to know, hence the term "emptiness".

But the term emptiness has a negative conetation within western language and society, so im considering using the word, infinity instead, although infinty descirbes the limitless potenitialty, it does'nt really convey the selfless aspect either, so ill pobably just use the words empty/infinity until i can find a better word to use. Oh how i folly with concepts.

You can know whether your truth is delusion or not by examining "who" knows this truth, and discovering beyond doubt the falicy of this delusion of "self" that seeminlgy knows other things. No i am not fully realized yet, but im certainly confident that im on the correct path to full realization. If by giving my best shot, you mean sharing knowlege from my present view, then yes, this is what i am doing. As spiritual devlopment progresses, i may be able to share, expand upon and percieve new demensions of understanding upon my original foundations.

Im pretty sure of one thing though, at this present point in time. The truth of the situation, like the nature of space, is the only situation, that does not change.