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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3370663 -

Not so much misunderstood...impossible to explain :wink:

Yes, you CAN lose your Ego for a short time and continue living. Your Ego is a part of who you are, not the whole thing. No one intends "ego-loss" to mean the DEATH of Ego, a permanent thing, though that word is sometimes used in reference to the death/rebirth aspect to ego-loss.


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: ninjapixie]
    #3370686 -

You don't lose everything.. that is the beauty of it. All thought is stripped away, and you are left with pure awareness. Pure consciousness.

After such a long time going through our day to day lives, we forget who we really are. We end up identifying with our ego. We believe our ego is who we are.

When we experience ego loss, it is very frightening because it feels as if the very thing that we ARE (the ego, which we are falsely identifying with) is being stripped away.

Once it has been stripped away, we are blessed to find that there IS something left. It is pure awareness. It is the very essence of life.

You won't fully understand until you experience it.

When we are not pre-occupied with our brains constantly throwing a barrage of random thoughts at us, we are left with a peaceful calm.

The idea is to learn to enter this state without the assistance of psychedelics.

It is not happiness you are left with IN the moment of ego loss. In the moment, you are left with peace. Rest. Not physical rest.. that we already know. But we can use physical rest as a comparison. We know physical rest, so it becomes a worthwhile item for comparison.

This rest I speak of is mental rest. It is like walking a thousand miles, and finally being able to collapse on a big comfy bed--only mentally, instead of physically.

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: trendal]
    #3370688 -

The ego is the face that you show the world...you can change it, but it don't go away. Some of the most self absorbed assholes I have ever met had lost their ego, by their own judgement.

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: JacquesCousteau]
    #3370706 -

:thumbup:


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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3370708 -

Hue: In a moment of complete mental rest, you show nothing to the world. You simply exist. IN THAT MOMENT, ego loss occurs.

When the next thought pops into your head, ego loss has ended.

As Trendal was saying, it is not a permanent notion.

Tell me.. if what you say is true, then in a moment of absolutely no-mind (thinking absolutely nothing.. simply being mentally STILL) what are we "showing the world"?

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3370722 -

Huehuecoyotl said:
The ego is the face that you show the world...you can change it, but it don't go away. Some of the most self absorbed assholes I have ever met had lost their ego, by their own judgement.


So just because some individuals are confused and believe it to be a permanent concept, and that they had not reformulated an ego the instant they even thought "I have lost my ego!"... because of this, you declare that ego loss is nonexistant?

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: ninjapixie]
    #3370735 -

The flaw lies within the misconception of percieving love, joy and peace as a polar opposite of hate and agony.
In the egoic mind there is an unavoidable dualism.. Here, pleasure is the opposite of emotional pain [hate].
What is often thought of as love or joy, in the egoic-mind identified state, is actually the pleasure side of the continuously alternating cycle of pleasure/pain duality.

True love stems not from the ego, but from Being - the One-life beyond and within all myriad forms of life, the very essence of all Life, that is obscured in the mind-identified state and may only be felt in glimpses of moments that render the mind temporarily powerless.
In Being - which is what surfaces in an ego-loss - Love, Joy and Peace are all facets of the same jewel which I refer to as Stillness...
The joy of Being, Love and Peace arise from beyond the mind and has no opposite. They are beyond such dualities and are the states of inter-connectedness with Being - which is, what I refer to as GOD.

Beware of getting stuck on the level of words... they are merely signposts that point towards That which cannot be encapsulated by mere thought alone.



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Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: SkorpivoMusterion]
    #3370751 -

As usual, skorp comes along and makes my point for me all eloquently and poetically.  :grin:  :heart:

Ninjapixi: To further connect Skorp's details to what I've said already, the concepts he refers to as "love" and also "stillness" are what I refer to when I speak of this peaceful rest.

His elaboration about misidentification of pleasure as love is very insightful; and should also be taken to heart.

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: JacquesCousteau]
    #3370753 -

I have experienced what the Buddhists call samadhi,through meditation and during entheogenic experiences, but it is a short lived experience that CAN have long term impact. I do not accept it as ego loss because one is still exhibiting a behavior. I prefer self-actualization or realization as they are much more accurate terms. In this context I think it is more clearly understood.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3370761 -

What behavior is this?

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: ninjapixie]
    #3370789 -

All of our suffering stems from this sense-of-self that we have. We have a picture of ourselves as a lover, or as an artist, or at hinker, or whatever model we desire, and when something happens to challange that, our thinking mind makes us unhappy. When we don't associate our pure consciousess with this sense-of-self, we aren't living in the dead past or the imagined future. We are ceasing our thinking mind from engaging anything other than the direct reality of here and now. Pure existance and consciousness is a blissful state of being. If thinking makes us unhappy, usually, stopping thought should make us happy. When you don't have expectations or preconditioned addictions, everything that happens is wonderful and perfect.


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Jackie Treehorn treats objects like women, man

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: SkorpivoMusterion]
    #3370795 -

You're right in that love/hate are not polar opposites and only appear so in your ego state, and are actually the same. Therefore shouldn't the 'very essense' of life be both love/hate which are one and the same and not opposites, and cannot exist without each other? I still can't get past this view.


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Put that monkey back in the oven.

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: ninjapixie]
    #3370797 -

I think first we must define what the ego actually is.

the ego is the  sense of self.  it is the emotional filter we put on reality. WE needed this while we were young so we wouldn't hurt ourselves. to be told "no!" and "that's bad or wrong"

when I came back down from "ego loss," I realized for that period of time I didn't know "who" I was.  I didn't have any memory of my name or past.  furthermore, I wasn't even concerned with who I was. so why is this blissful?

the mind is constantly chattering away, judging this and that as right or wrong.  clarity is what we lose when the ego is in full control.  its like old programming that can bog our awareness down and thus, needs to be reformatted every once in a while :wink:  when I was at that state, my mind was blank...no worry...no frustration..no anxiety.  I didn't think this was ever possible.  it showed me a state of mind that I could reach.

before my first ego loss trip, I believed that my name, my personality was my essence or my true nature.  now that I know that I can lose my personality and my name, I know that this is not "what" I really am.  This allows my mind to relax a whole lot more because I realize that all of the opinions that I have on the world isn't what I am.  I don't have to be busy defending every little action that I do because its jsut a mask or a role that I play. 

I realized that my true essential nature was just pure awareness, that which picks up on reality around me.  to describe this better, if you close your eyes for a couple of minutes, you might notice that you pick up on sound a whole lot more.  its your awareness that is picking this up.  if you were in a room devoid of sight and sound, your mind would start to pick up on minor bodily sensations that are normally pused out the way because of the input of sight, sound, and thought.  the more still you become, the more of your awareness your mind can use to view reality

with clarity comes bliss..why?  it provides more focus on what is.  when you lose every sense of self around you, all you are left is this physical reality to enjoy.  lots of people feel love because most of the time their older programming (the ego) would be so caught up in its own opinions that they forget the awe in existence.

ever get the giggles out of no where while shrooming? its been my experience that when I ask people what they were laughing at, they reply with "I don't really know."  :heart:


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Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: ninjapixie]
    #3370828 -

Quote:
ninjapixie said:
You're right in that love/hate are not polar opposites and only appear so in your ego state, and are actually the same. Therefore shouldn't the 'very essense' of life be both love/hate which are one and the same and not opposites, and cannot exist without each other? I still can't get past this view.



See, the reason you're not getting this is that you're not grasping the complete illusory state of duality in the first place.

Duality is a product of the ego. It is illusory. There is no such thing as good, and there is no such thing as bad. Things just are. By having egos, we subjectively apply meaning to things.

The ego PRODUCES the very concepts of love and hate. Without the ego, there is only one thing... a pure form of energy. It is not good, and it is not bad. It just IS.

It is this purity that we strive for.. we simply do not know it. Ever had a feeling like there was SOMETHING that would make you satisfied, but never seem to be able to find it?

We are "bored" so we "do something".. but doing something only temporarily relieves the boredom. It does not fix it.. we did not have the SOMETHING that we truly needed... we simply substituted something else as a means to an end.

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: JacquesCousteau]
    #3370881 -

If you are alive you exhibit behavior...doing nothing while speechless is behavior...sleeping is behavior. All behavior is not concious. Anything you do at all is behavior. During a peak experience one also exhibits behavior.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #3370900 -

Shrug.. you've got your opinion on the matter, and we've got ours.  :grin:

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: ninjapixie]
    #3370904 -

your confusion lies around the linguistics of the experience

let go of those

go beyond everything you know, all aspects of self

and observe the purest state of being

nothing/infinity are not far apart

:mushroom2:


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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: deff]
    #3371164 -

Interesting thread. At the risk of being redundant I would like to elaborate on the concept of the "Middle Way". The Middle Way is not the mean of two extremes, or both existing at once, but a complete transendence of each, both, and neither. It is IS, the existence that is beyond conceptual thought. The Middle Way means neither existant, nor non-existant. This is because both are simply conceptual terms used in language and thought, they are not real things. The Middle Way is the truth beyond any possible mental or linguistic conceptualization.


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1. "After an hour I wasn't feeling anything so I decided to take another..."
2. "We were feeling pretty good so we decided to smoke a few bowls..."
3. "I had to be real quiet because my parents were asleep upstairs..."

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: Divided_Sky]
    #3371169 -

Well-put. :smile:

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Re: To those who've experienced egoloss [Re: JacquesCousteau]
    #3371258 -

JacquesCousteau said:
The ego PRODUCES the very concepts of love and hate. Without the ego, there is only one thing... a pure form of energy. It is not good, and it is not bad. It just IS.




Now you're saying it is neither good or bad, it just is a pure form of energy. How can you then say existence/energy is all blissful/love when you just said it just is?

If anything those believing the nature of existence is all love etc are holding onto this duality and putting love on a pedastal over hate because thats what they prefer not realizing they are the same.


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Put that monkey back in the oven.

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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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