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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: venetian-cubes]
    #28928906 -



Well I'm dipping my toes into things with the water tub method(Ahaaaaaa...). First things first, the cakes were clean to the eye and smelled fine, agar was clean from the same batch to inoculate, I waited a week to consolidate, coated in coir admittedly it wasn't very even and may be slightly thicker than suggested. How are things looking so far? The updated pf TEK says to open up the lid 48 hours when it looks a certain way but mine aren't even close to looking like what's pictured in the TEK, probably from the thicker coir. Any thoughts or opinions would be appreciated..the coir seems a little dry to me just by looks I haven't touched it 😂. I haven't cracked the lid yet but in the meantime should I spritz it?


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15 year lurker

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: Meanwhile] * 1
    #28928909 -

I don’t think it needs a spray yet. Looking perfect so far


--------------------
A Love Letter to New Growers
The 7 Edicts of Mushroom Cultivation as Decreed by Smellyhobbit

:kodama:


Anyone can get a canopy. But can you get what you want?

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: callmehippie]
    #28928916 -

callmehippie said:
Meanwhile said:
Smellyhobbit said:
It would be fine, but the larger takeaway is don’t crumble them.

Put as many as you can fit in the bottom of a shoebox and then top them with a couple of inches of compacted coir. They’ll fruit normally and you don’t have to risk contamination.

Like this:




Dang that's sweet.





Do you put a top on it?  What's the rest of the process?


Sorry I missed this. A lid or a big plastic bag with holes snipped in it. It’s not just an open box, no.

Then you just leave it alone, really. Couldn’t be easier.


--------------------
A Love Letter to New Growers
The 7 Edicts of Mushroom Cultivation as Decreed by Smellyhobbit

:kodama:


Anyone can get a canopy. But can you get what you want?

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: Smellyhobbit] * 1
    #28928919 -

Smellyhobbit said:
I don’t think it needs a spray yet. Looking perfect so far


I appreciate it. Should I offset the lid at any point? The lid doesn't seal too well. It's one of those press into place ones, no latches or rubber seal. It said to do so once it's reached 'fruiting conditions' even though from what I've gathered on here they're always in fruiting conditions


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15 year lurker

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: Meanwhile]
    #28928920 -

No, an imperfect seal is actually what you want. That’s enough for FAE.


--------------------
A Love Letter to New Growers
The 7 Edicts of Mushroom Cultivation as Decreed by Smellyhobbit

:kodama:


Anyone can get a canopy. But can you get what you want?

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: Smellyhobbit]
    #28928924 -



Hi, new grower here, just checking to make sure that everything is going fine with my grow. I thought it was fully colonised so I misted it and moved it to a cooler more well lit environment, but it's been about a week and a half now and it hasn't really changed at all. The images above are pretty much exactly how it looked a week ago.

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: Magspy]
    #28928926 -


sorry, one of those photos was meant to be this one, still getting used to the forum.

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: Smellyhobbit]
    #28928937 -

Smellyhobbit said:
No, an imperfect seal is actually what you want. That’s enough for FAE.


Much appreciated, thank you.


--------------------
15 year lurker

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: Smellyhobbit] * 1
    #28928966 -

Smellyhobbit said:
StophJS said:
It was always my LC and now that I've inoculated with confirmed clean culture it's just something totally non-specific about my technique.


I’m getting frustrated vibes, but don’t get grumpy. Yes, it’s something non-specific because we don’t watch your process like a football coach trying to show you where you fucked up the play.

Obviously you’re doing something wrong because something is consistently going wrong and you APPEAR to have clean inoculant.

I know people get away with those stickers, but I’d ditch those for real filters personally. Otherwise you’re going to have to tell us everything and expect some critique. That’s literally why you’re here


I apologize for being snippy. You're right, feedback and help troubleshooting is exactly why I'm here.

I just can't help but wonder if there has been a lack of imagination for what could be going on here. I think my big hangup is that there does not appear to be a "battle" of any kind going on between bacteria and mycelium trying to colonize in the sense that bacteria may have been introduced. It's an absolute nonstarter. Even now as the mycelium is refusing to colonize the grain in these jars, there is no smell of bacterial infection, no signs of it, and there likely will not be for weeks. And this is every jar, every time.

Even if no one has ever heard of well water causing something like this, I'm sure it's understandable at this point why I'm looking there. It is just such a uniform "uncolonizableness" across absolutely all of it from the first moments. This is also why I'm skeptical that it's the filters, but I'm happy to replace them.

I'm just getting to a point where I don't know how many more of these attempts I have in me, pissing away money on grain and feeling like I'm no closer to figuring this out.

Edited by StophJS (08/30/24 07:54 AM)

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: StophJS]
    #28928976 -


Contamination or not?:frown: helpp


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" Antes de que cambien los reinos, es necesario que cambien los individuos"

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: StophJS]
    #28928989 -

So it’s just doing nothing at all on grains?

Do you have any pictures I could peep 👀


--------------------
A Love Letter to New Growers
The 7 Edicts of Mushroom Cultivation as Decreed by Smellyhobbit

:kodama:


Anyone can get a canopy. But can you get what you want?

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: Smellyhobbit]
    #28929019 -








These are a few of the jars. Those are the seemingly strong and nice looking agar wedges placed into them 5 days ago. Maybe it doesn't show well but essentially what has happened is that something thick and gummy has grown around the wedge, sort of gluing the surrounding grains together and to the wedge. And that is it. It's not going any further.

Hydration of the grains seems proper to me. 90 minute PC with 10 minutes vent. Foil over the lids. Could it be the pressure is not permeating the jars somehow? So strange, the whole thing.

Edited by StophJS (08/30/24 01:37 PM)

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: DRAKENCL]
    #28929023 -

Thanks I will pass it to spawn


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" Antes de que cambien los reinos, es necesario que cambien los individuos"

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: StophJS] * 1
    #28929036 -

StophJS said:

It was always my LC and now that I've inoculated with confirmed clean culture


tbh i wouldnt use any of those. did you use those to make lc?

imo more transfers. i wouldnt make lc with something unless it was completely symmetrical and sexy lookin but thats just me.


sterile technique can always use improving.


--------------------
:hypnotoad:
Making Liquid Culture :  Go insane with LC
Mushboy likes these teks : Making shroom tea
Dank Education

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: StophJS] * 1
    #28929050 -

StophJS said:







These are a few of the jars. Those are the seemingly strong and nice looking agar wedges placed into them 5 days ago. Maybe it doesn't show well but essentially what has happened is that something thick and gummy has grown around the wedge, sort of gluing the surrounding grains together and to the wedge. And that is it. It's not going any further.

Hydration of the grains seems proper to me. 90 minute PC with 10 minutes vent. Foil over the lids. Could it be the pressure is not permeating the jars somehow? So strange, the whole thing.


Those all look bacterial to me. I’d be starting from spore if all your cultures on agar are giving your problems, especially if you got your genes from a vendor syringe. Those appear to all be infected.

Have you ever made a jar just to check your grains? One to open and cut some grains in half? I recommend that if hydration is a concern to you.

It’s probably not your grains, but you could also try switching to WBS, which is pretty foolproof, and if you still have the same problem you’ll have more evidence for infection. Oats can give people problems.

But yeah man that looks bacterial.


--------------------
A Love Letter to New Growers
The 7 Edicts of Mushroom Cultivation as Decreed by Smellyhobbit

:kodama:


Anyone can get a canopy. But can you get what you want?

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: Smellyhobbit]
    #28929058 -

I have opened up one of these jars since I consider them lost now and hydration seems good. They are opaque on the inside and can be squished between fingers. I'm going to try some seriously overkill grain sterilization and report back. I can't reconcile the normal growth on agar followed by the non-starting on the grain.

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: StophJS]
    #28929080 -

That also points to a problem with technique or procedure, although Mushboy just said he didn’t like the look of your agar.

The problem is still almost definitely technique.

This is gonna be a pain, but we need to know everything you do from spore to grain in as much detail as you can manage.

How are you handling your agar? How long is your PC cycle? Are you venting properly? How many transfers are you doing? Where are your genetics coming from? Are you starting from spore or are you using that LC still?

I’ve got 1000 questions, but a clinical writeup would be most helpful. If you’ve got the time. Contamination is being introduced and you can’t figure out where. We can’t help you unless we know what’s going on. It might be obvious to us but not to you.


--------------------
A Love Letter to New Growers
The 7 Edicts of Mushroom Cultivation as Decreed by Smellyhobbit

:kodama:


Anyone can get a canopy. But can you get what you want?

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers *DELETED* [Re: Magspy]
    #28929114 -

Post deleted by Ben Phartin

Reason for deletion: .

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: Smellyhobbit] * 2
    #28929144 -

I'll try to do this writeup and include as much detail about technique and the journey so far.

I had success doing tubs with premade spawn bags and injecting vendor liquid culture before trying my own grain spawn several months ago. Since then, I have only had the results pictured in my earlier posts, every jar every attempt.

My first attempts were with oats. I used Bod's easy af oat tek. I rinsed the oats thoroughly, boiled them for 30-45 minutes until a few started to burst, checked the largest one for opacity all the way through, and killed heat. Tossed in colander for a while until no longer steaming. Sometimes loaded jars shortly after and sometimes the next day. Sealed the jars with the above lids (SHIP and supposed .3 micron filter from Amazon with positive reviews). SHIP and filter are glued down and sealed with E6000 adhesive (remember, every jar fails equally every time, so I pretty much exclude possibility that jar variation comes into play).

After loading jars, I cover the tops in foil and put them in my 23qt presto with three quarts of water. I let it get to a boil and let steam come out of the vent for 10 minutes before putting my jiggle weight on. I add a small weight to my jiggle weight to keep it from dancing around at 15-17 psi. I let the presto get to 15-17 psi and start a timer for 90 minutes. Adjust heat and check periodically to keep it at 15 minimum.

When PC cycle is done, I shut off heat and let it depressurize naturally. Remove my jars and set on shelf. Don't take foil off top until inoculation, which is usually next day. When I was running oats, I inoculated with untested liquid culture directly at first, and rightly caught flack for it from people telling me I didn't even know my culture was clean.

I repeated all the above steps again, after testing liquid culture on agar by applying a small side-squeeze drop with gloves in a still air box and validating that culture was lean insofar as I could be sure.

My agar is potato flakes, agar agar powder, corn syrup and water, boiled briefly and then PCd in the frequently recommended bottle with blue cap. Poured into ketchup cups in SAB. I have never seen any kind of growth on the agar cups that sit unused alongside those I inoculate, leading me to believe the agar is sterile. The ketchup cups pictured above are two times transferred and appear to be free of contaminants to me.

When I incoluate with agar, I have all jars, scalpel and ketchup cups in SAB. I flame sterilize blade. 70% iso the shit out of my SAB and let it sit. I then, wearing disposable gloves cleaned with iso, open the jars one by one, cut out my agar wedge drop in, and reclose lid tight.

Whether inoculating with LC directly or with agar wedges, the result is always exactly the same and it's as pictured in my previous posts. One time, I left for a week during a massive heatwave, and came to back to see my jars had appeared to "colonize". The spawn was rubbery and I had to cut it out with a spoon. I sent it to bulk for the hell of it and got a few mushrooms before they all started aborting and coming up slimy and misshapen.

I did this whole process a number of times with oats, decided my oats fucking sucked, and bought rye berries from amazon that I have to say look beautiful and are basically free of chaff and dust.

I repeated all of the above steps with both oats and rye berries to the exact same results. Again... every jar, every time. This is not SOME of my agar cups are contaminated, or SOMETIMES I allow bacteria to get into a jar while inoculating.

My grains reject this mycelium that appears healthy on agar, which is why I so strongly feel that there is something inherently wrong with the grains. I just started an overnight soak on another batch of rye, which I've never done before. I also used RO water rather than my well water. I also plan on leaving the foil off the top of jars and PCing for 120 minutes instead of 90.

I hope this is detailed enough to be of some value. I'm not sure what else to really say about it.

Edited by StophJS (08/30/24 10:35 AM)

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Re: Ask Quick Questions, Get Quick Answers [Re: StophJS] * 1
    #28929152 -

I need more detail on your SAB procedure. How are you inoculating? You’re sterilizing your blade between every jar, right? You’re not touching anything inside the jar with your gloved hands, are you? Because that will definitely introduce contam. Gloves and iso don’t do anything towards making your hands sterile. I don’t use gloves at all and I just wash my hands with soap and water before my SAB sessions.

Are you being careful to not have your hands over or on anything that’s supposed to stay sterile?

Definitely edit out the vendor name. We don’t need to know where they came from, that’s not important. Just wanted to know if they were vendor or not.


--------------------
A Love Letter to New Growers
The 7 Edicts of Mushroom Cultivation as Decreed by Smellyhobbit

:kodama:


Anyone can get a canopy. But can you get what you want?

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Shop: Mushroom-Hut Liquid Cultures   Sporeworks.EU Spores for European Microscopy   North Spore Injection Grain Bag   Myyco.com Golden Teacher Liquid Culture For Sale   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds

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