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Work = Pay / But What Is Play?
    #25948707 -

Obviously we profit when we play. We profit in the decrease of boredom. But I don't feel comfortable with the statement that youngsters are working when they play.

I'll turn this around and say that people use work as a means to decrease boredom, the difference being that the decrease in boredom is an end result/ not immediate (except in the case of us workaholics).

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #25948716 -

'Work' would need a definition and even then, it's going to be subjective.

It's probably safe to assume that many people primarily work 'day jobs' to earn a living, which can potentially cause boredom.

The 'end result' is an economy.

A 'hobby job' is something else..

Edited by Duncan Rowhl (04/22/19 07:38 AM)

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: Duncan Rowhl]
    #25948765 -

Duncan Rowhl said:
'Work' would need a definition and even then, it's going to be subjective.





QFT



a job is almost always work, but work doesn't =/= a job.  Garden work is work, but it doesn't pay (unless you hire out and/or sell products from the garden) in financial terms [directly.]

i do intensive labor in forestry, and on good days it hardly seems like work at all, cause the benefit of "running around in the woods with a chainsaw and playing with fires" far outweighs the mental construct of WORK in relation to other tasks/jobs.



so like Duncan said, a definition is needed, otherwise it's all relative.

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #25949386 -

No, Homo Ludens is not a Gay cough drop.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homo_Ludens


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #25949485 -

Quote:
Huizinga makes it clear in the foreword of his book that he means the play element of culture, and not the play element in culture.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homo_Ludens#Foreword_controversy

Anyway...We play before we learn to work at improving our game. Both are rewarding pastimes.

How is play rewarding? As an outlet for energy and exuberance...Then youngsters play more than tired, old people, but old people play cards; maybe less old people play cards when they have TV. So it still comes down to breaking monotony and boredom.

Edited by Buster_Brown (04/22/19 05:42 PM)

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #25949555 -

Quote:
But I don't feel comfortable with the statement that youngsters are working when they play.


They are learning whilst they are playing.

'Working' just means functioning and everyone functions to some extent.

It is the 'job' which is the clincher.

If the job (the activity) is not attractive, the child won't play and won't learn, much like the adult who won't work and won't get paid, or the adult who will work with a grudge in a state of boredom.

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #25949651 -

i guess the point of my post was to ask this:  why can't work and play be the same thing?  for me it often is.

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: Tulipslave] * 1
    #25952062 -

Because lots of work in not creative, it is mechanical or repetitious, but there is little novelty and latitude to be creative. Thus it becomes little more than strife in the service of survival, the grind, the rat race, a Sisyphusian torment.


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #25952181 -

MarkostheGnostic said:
Because lots of work in not creative, it is mechanical or repetitious, but there is little novelty and latitude to be creative. Thus it becomes little more than strife in the service of survival, the grind, the rat race, a Sisyphusian torment.





i've been there, but i feel it ultimately comes down to choice.  choose to have kids? you are likely going to sacrifice the ability to [comfortably] choose a career/job that provides satisfaction and "novelty"


choose to break laws that lead to years of repercussions down the road?  you are likely going to sacrifice the ability to [comfortably] choose a career/job that provides satisfaction and "novelty"



choose to gamble everything away?  you are likely going to sacrifice the ability to [comfortably] choose a career/job that provides satisfaction and "novelty"



choose to tie yourself down to a half-million dollar house?  you are likely going to sacrifice the ability to [comfortably] choose a career/job that provides satisfaction and "novelty"


choose to accept one's current state of being and not strive for/attempt change or betterment?  you are likely going to sacrifice the ability to [comfortably] choose a career/job that provides satisfaction and "novelty"



choices are made every moment of every day, and consequences follow.

Edited by Tulipslave (04/24/19 04:50 AM)

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #25952346 -

It's easy because it's hard.

Like John Denver sung.

Like the Amish. Joy in farming.

And you can smoke herb while ye farm!


--------------------
TRUMP 2020

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: XUL]
    #25957976 -

Work and play may be different based on strain..

But both stretch the limits of the body and mind


--------------------
Thank you for your Time...

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: BrendanFlock]
    #25958360 -

BrendanFlock said:
Work and play may be different based on strain..



I have the idea that there is no difference between work and play to the workaholic.

I'm saying that the context of work includes playing around with ideas, and that play is the initial stage of a workaholic.

Therefore everyone retains the expression of work/play whether they get paid in cash not.

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #25958393 -

Buster_Brown said:
BrendanFlock said:
Work and play may be different based on strain..



I have the idea that there is no difference between work and play to the workaholic.

I'm saying that the context of work includes playing around with ideas, and that play is the initial stage of a workaholic.



:yesnod::thumbup:

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: Tulipslave]
    #25958424 -

Tulipslave said:
:yesnod::thumbup:



Someone's bound to call me a communist when I tell them that it's our ego that is dissatisfied with our lot in life and it's our ego that desires to have an advantage over someone else measured by the size of a paycheck.

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #25958452 -

Take honey for example; it's not a necessity. Neither are Nike running shoes. People like these things and are willing to reward the provider with something nice which for the sake of simplicity has been reduced to the form of cash.

Now in order to do something nice for someone in order to get what we like we have to have cash.

In other words if we have enough cash to reward people with we can have anything we like whenever we want it.

For the sake of simplicity we don't need the honey or the Nike running shoes.

Right, so in order to be nice to someone I support their choice of simplifying a process into the form of cash. If cash is not available that doesn't stop me from being nice to whomever I want, it just limits what people are willing to provide to me in the way of niceties.

In other words if I don't have the simplified version of niceness in the way of cash then they are no longer nice.

That's their prerogative. It's all ego anyway.

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #25973980 -

For me, the difference between work and play is a goal. Work involves an established goal while play has no goal or a focus on achieving a particular end result. Workaholics often have difficulty playing for this reason, that there are no goals. A workaholic prefers competition and achievement (even if it just means catching fish) over freestyle fun.

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: RJ Tubs 202]
    #25974024 -

The point I'm trying to convey is that play evolves into goal orientation and is an end in itself. Goal orientated play will exist beyond the point when technological advances make wage earnings unnecessary for life-support.

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #25977242 -

Work is food, water, and shelter.

Work is food.

Either you farm your own food or you buy it from the farmer with money you worked for.


--------------------
TRUMP 2020

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: XUL] * 1
    #25977719 -

XUL said:
Work is food, water, and shelter.

Work is food.

Either you farm your own food or you buy it from the farmer with money you worked for.


With the precept that a psychopath cannot entertain concepts that counter their established beliefs without getting upset[1]
 we could expect to some people to express their displeasure at the idea of giving handouts of free food to future generations.

[1] egotistical traits

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Re: Work = Pay / But What Is Play? [Re: Buster_Brown]
    #25978544 -

Buster_Brown said:
the point when technological advances make wage earnings unnecessary for life-support.


the technology that enables life is already here, its called the ecosystem, modern man and his destructive actions will never bring anything but suffering and death


--------------------
evil always wins, good can only do good, evil will lie and cheat until it fools good into doing evil

freedom is the ability to take wrong action, right actions are constrained by nature

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