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OfflineAtomisk
all forms areself awareness

Registered: 02/09/04
Posts: 164
Loc: jungle of love
Last seen: 13 years, 10 months
whats wrong/right about this statement
    #2349991 - 02/18/04 02:05 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

"everything is as it should be...there are no mistakes"

seriously, what do you think about this statement. so many of you are so intelligent and i really am curious to how you look at this.


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o house-builder! thou art seen. thou shalt build no house again. all thy rafters are broken. thy ridge-pole is shattered.


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InvisibleDoctorJ
Minister to the Damned
Male Arcade Champion: Frogger

Registered: 06/30/03
Posts: 8,741
Loc: space
Re: whats wrong/right about this statement [Re: Atomisk]
    #2349994 - 02/18/04 02:07 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Its true in one sense, false in one sense, and meaningless in another sense.


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Deep in the heart of Central Texas
lurks a Doktor
SM tool
Native Dallas brick-chopper...


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OfflineSpecialEd
+ one

Registered: 01/30/03
Posts: 6,220
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Re: whats wrong/right about this statement [Re: Atomisk]
    #2349998 - 02/18/04 02:08 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

"everything is as it should be...there are no mistakes"




Cause and Effect. In any situation, the outcome is exactly as it should be because of cause and effect. That doesn't mean it is good or that you like it.


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--- //
-- :meff:
  /l_l\/
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OfflineAlan Stone
Corpus

Registered: 11/23/02
Posts: 986
Loc: Ten feet up
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Re: whats wrong/right about this statement [Re: Atomisk]
    #2350201 - 02/18/04 02:49 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Is this from Candide by Voltaire? Or just a quote straight from Leibniz himself ("This world is the best it can be")? I'm trying to see the context first, then I'll answer.


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It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.

- Aristotle


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OfflineAtomisk
all forms areself awareness

Registered: 02/09/04
Posts: 164
Loc: jungle of love
Last seen: 13 years, 10 months
Re: whats wrong/right about this statement [Re: Alan Stone]
    #2350334 - 02/18/04 03:13 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

thoughts of my own when i was tripping, i thought, "everything settles in layers, everything is as it sould be, the universe makes no mistakes..." so, just tripping thoughts...they kinda soothed my anxiety


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o house-builder! thou art seen. thou shalt build no house again. all thy rafters are broken. thy ridge-pole is shattered.


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: whats wrong/right about this statement [Re: Atomisk]
    #2350444 - 02/18/04 03:36 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Biological evolution is (one example of the "universe" making) a series of trials and errors (mistakes).


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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineAtomisk
all forms areself awareness

Registered: 02/09/04
Posts: 164
Loc: jungle of love
Last seen: 13 years, 10 months
Re: whats wrong/right about this statement [Re: Swami]
    #2350498 - 02/18/04 03:47 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

hmm


--------------------
o house-builder! thou art seen. thou shalt build no house again. all thy rafters are broken. thy ridge-pole is shattered.


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OfflineAlan Stone
Corpus

Registered: 11/23/02
Posts: 986
Loc: Ten feet up
Last seen: 12 years, 9 months
Re: whats wrong/right about this statement [Re: Atomisk]
    #2350962 - 02/18/04 05:18 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

thoughts of my own when i was tripping, i thought, "everything settles in layers, everything is as it sould be, the universe makes no mistakes..." so, just tripping thoughts...they kinda soothed my anxiety




In that case, I agree, but only when human experience is concerned. You can't make any mistakes, as long as you learn from all of your actions.


--------------------
It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.

- Aristotle


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InvisibletrendalM
tangential derivation
Male User Gallery

Registered: 04/17/01
Posts: 20,635
Loc: Ontario, Canada Flag
Re: whats wrong/right about this statement [Re: Atomisk]
    #2351117 - 02/18/04 05:51 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

"everything is as it should be...there are no mistakes"

I would say that everything is as it has to be according to the tree of cause-and-effect which has lead to the present point in time. There are no "mistakes" as far as cause and effect are concerned...everything happens exactly has it must - the effect being determined by the cause (which was, in turn, an effect created by a cause..ad infinitum).

Most humans I have encountered still seem to think that things could or should have happened differently and that "mistakes" have been made...but if you ask me this is only a human wish for reality. If you follow cause and effect...everything happens as it must.


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.


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InvisibleMal_Fenderson
Space Monkey

Registered: 07/31/03
Posts: 132
Loc: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Re: whats wrong/right about this statement [Re: Swami]
    #2351178 - 02/18/04 06:05 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

I don't see how biological evolution evidences "mistakes". It seems to me that a mistake requires an outcome contrary to that which is desired---speaking about the universe making mistakes, then, strikes me as odd, mainly because I have no idea how to asrcibe intentionality to something like the universe.l


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"Better Dead than Red."


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Offlinesykobish
ProfessionalPsycho - JTOKREW
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Registered: 03/15/03
Posts: 17,805
Loc: Toronto, eh?
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Re: whats wrong/right about this statement [Re: Atomisk]
    #2351393 - 02/18/04 06:55 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

I would agree that there are no mistakes. As someone has already pointed out, there is cause and there is effect. Action and reaction(consequence).

"Mistake" is just a word, an opinion to explain something with an undesired outcome for an action.


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I would rather have had one breath of her hair, one kiss from her mouth, one touch of her hand, than eternity without it. One.
-={Nite-Crew}=-

*-_Thread_Jacker_-*
To love is to admire with the heart; to admire is to love with the mind. - Th?ophile Gautier.
Seek not every quality in one individual - Confucius.
Global Living Space


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InvisibleMal_Fenderson
Space Monkey

Registered: 07/31/03
Posts: 132
Loc: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Re: whats wrong/right about this statement [Re: sykobish]
    #2351589 - 02/18/04 07:46 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

Well, I don't know that there are no mistakes. But I certainly don't think that there are legitimate mistakes made by the universe.


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"Better Dead than Red."


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Offlinesykobish
ProfessionalPsycho - JTOKREW
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Re: whats wrong/right about this statement [Re: Mal_Fenderson]
    #2351698 - 02/18/04 08:23 PM (14 years, 2 months ago)

How I would describe what a mistake is, is it's something that doesn't appease someone else, or yourself. What may be a mistake in one persons eye is not one in another. What a mistake would classify as, is different according to each individual. A judgemental opinion, if you will. As I said before, an undesirable outcome caused by an action. When you think about it, if a 'mistake' you made in the past is the reason for someone finding their calling, so to speak, or opening more desirable doors in the future that would otherwise be closed if that 'mistake' wasn't made, is it really classified a mistake then?


--------------------
I would rather have had one breath of her hair, one kiss from her mouth, one touch of her hand, than eternity without it. One.
-={Nite-Crew}=-

*-_Thread_Jacker_-*
To love is to admire with the heart; to admire is to love with the mind. - Th?ophile Gautier.
Seek not every quality in one individual - Confucius.
Global Living Space


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