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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Mushroom Hunting and Identification
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Re: British Indigenous [Re: Silverwolf]
    #1920984 -

Inthe 1970s my wife and I bought canned frozen hallucionogenic mushrooms supposedly from Mexico. We ate them and they were a little different thana half gram i ate in 1968 which really diod not do much of anything. The can shrooms frozen in K ration cans and sealed were actually agaricus bisporus and lace with LSD and PCP to hide the effects of acid. They are still sold around the USA oin some regions. Similar shrooms have shown up over the years in Europe and Germany made with frozen shitakes from asisa and canned and ssold as Mexican magic mushrooms. that was wahat stemmed my first interest in finding magic mushrooms..

Here int he PNW we had two large muclch piles of tons of alder stacked out near auburn-kent, washington. there was mycelia of both P. cyanescens and P. stuntzii growing rapidulty throughout the stack. when the stack would gt lowered in sizwe from lawnservice trucks loading up to take to various landscapping companies, the logging industry would replendish the pile with new chips and /opr bark fromthe woods and the mycelia kept spreading through the piles and then to0 the various buildings int he cities.

This occured between 1972 and 1986. Int he early 19990-s, clear-cuts became practrically illegal due to environmentalist and spotted fucking owls.

Now there are few and far between and where as inthe 1970s and 1980s, P. cyanescens was comoon mostly in aldewrwood steer-co woodchips and sawdust, today their main habitat is primaroily branches of alder.

and very scattered since many large public places now cut their own trees to make for new mucclch and the closure of many clearcuts has caused a shortage of large crops. although I still know a few lage fruiting sites. when i moved to hawaii in 1986 I had over 100 patches odf shrooms within the city of downtown Seattle.

If you do live here you can purchase a $35.00 permit to go to three locations from warehauser logging sites to collect edibles. and sometimes massive pelliculosa patches hich appear form 2 to five years after logs are logged out and the burn occurs.

Lawns of stuntzii's still appear, mainly from spores inthe squares of sod. but at one time over 80% or more of aevery new lawn hgad blue trringers in them.
A few years ago a report fom England told of a horse race track which was laid over with wood chips and allegedly produced hundreds of thousands of P. cyanescens. Unfortunately no one published any photos of this tratk but the mycologists involved in writing about it and talking to newsmaen in England confirmed they were P. cyanescens. still a picture would havve been fun..

mj

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: Silverwolf]
    #1922547 -

thanks toxic.

mmmm, keep takling :smile: 

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: MagmaManiac]
    #1924378 -

I'm glad you guys are still talking cyanacens,(although I'm still none the wiser as to where to actually FIND any),it means you didn't spot what would would appear to be a glaring error on my part!I've got to,as we say over here, "hold my hand up for this one" , and make a point of it especially, because part of the reason for this thread was to explore the nature of the psychedelic amanita (s ?) and to help make their usage SAFER for fellow travellers.
You see I've made,perhaps understandably,a strange assumption.Knowing (some) of the methods of consumption by which the "hallucinogens" in the fungi ,that for the sake of this debate we shall call "fly agaric", has be introduced into the bloodstream (drinking human and animal urine for example),AND it's latin name "amanita",I mistakenly supposed that "ammonia" was necessarily a major component of it's chemical profile ALONG WITH muscarine.Which explains why I have always wanted to spell amanita with two "m"s.Sorry all you bio-chemists I'm a "failed" political philosopher not a "scientist".HOWEVER I think I have picked up some understanding of the traditional preperation/"strorage" of this fascinating fungi,although before I elaborate some further empiricism IS neccessary.
"..,the Fly Agaric is the most familiar toadstool.It is also known to CONTAIN TWO POISONS (capitals mine ed.).One,muscimol,is mildly (uh huh -also mine ed.-) hallucinogenic,and this species has been used as an intoxicant.The other,muscarine,is sweat-inducing,leading to nausea,vomiting and possibly coma." from "Field Guide to the Mushrooms and Toadstools of Britain and Europe" published by Larousse.So my logostical friends we may NOW assume that lack of sugar provission (or should I now say "polysacchrides"?) owing to insufficient, or complete LACK,of foliage on the "host" tree fails to produce sufficient muscimol ,instead producing too much muscarine?!The "traditional methods" I mentioned therefore concern the conversion of the dangerous muscarine into muscimol!I will elaborate on these In my next post and start to explore some of the "religious" -in "theory and practice" ,as it were- aspects of their usage.
(Also guys any ideas for my "fresh spore transplant" yet please?)


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""

Edited by Lonewolf (09/17/03 05:16 AM)

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: pluteus]
    #1924510 -

Could somebody list, (or point me to a list) of all the psilocybin containing mushrooms that have been found/are currently found in Britain please.

Lonewolf? MJ??

thanks

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: Sin Bad]
    #1924559 -

Look in the fac. and ibotenic acid and muscimole are the two main constituents of Amanita muscaria which means fleigenpilze or fly killer in Germany. I doubot if it has anything to do with ammonia.

mj

here is a list of 187 species of psilocybian mushrooms and a country by country list of specie scan be found at my m site through a linbk on my indes page tot he distributoion worldwide of all species.

mj

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1925346 -

Lonewolf
You say you are none the wiser as to where to find Ps. cyanescens in the UK - just concentrate harder :smile:

As for fly agarics - I'm really not sure exactly what you are trying to find out.

Are you asking something like, "does the health/stage of development of the host plant affect metabolite concentrations in the fly agaric mushrooms with which it is partnered?"

I don't know the answer to this.  It seems reasonable to expect a relationship.  But I think a tree that persistently lacks foliage would be unlikely to support much fruiting of mycorrhizal mushrooms.  It would partially depend on mycelial capacity for long term storage of photosynthates.  I am not aware of any empirical study of the effects of host tree condition on chemical synthesis in associated mushrooms.  So I cannot think of any justification for the a priori assumptions you are making in the case of the active fly agaric compounds. I may be overlooking published research.

As for transferring fresh spores, you may succeed in inoculating new trees, but it is only likely to work if you attempt this with seedlings (of the right species).  Older trees are likely to already have a fully colonized root system and so a newly introduced fungus will not be able to establish itself.

I hope this info is of use

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: pluteus]
    #1925570 -

You might think so Pluteus however I have had first hand experience ,not simply a priori assumptions, which STRONGLY suggest otherwise.I have just walked in the door having visited whilst buying "groceries" (Like some  U.S beers some Americanisms are underated),the site of the struggle with which ,to a certain extent, this thread is concerned.I can still find no evidence of a suitable host tree ,the nearest root system to this small grassy bank would seem to come from a very "average" sized ,and unsuitable, mixed hedge.Furthermore my source of information about the orchid conservation programme from the local study center was clear in his assertion that fruiting bodies would appear on the roots ,and around the stumps of ..my beautiful birches ..sob -yes I can call them mine as they "belong" to all us "commoners" (technically)-.Infact the specimins found on the grassy bank were huge ,and a largish cluster, HOWEVER these were "'ard buggers" if ever there were any.Their prepared presentation was hard,dark red with white cap spots still VERY visible,they were also almost DEADLY my friend;and that's basically ALL,there was very little hallucinogenic activity associated with the experience,apart from "hello,I'm dying!".
The amanitas I wish to transport will come from the orchid conservation area,are you saying that host trees will already be colonised even if they show no activity?One possible site,secluded,relatively unpolluted etc.,did have,a decade ago,a nice little "platoon" of "red caps",however last year there were none whilst activity in other areas was at a reasonably high level.
Also yeah I do take the point about paying attention to Mj,I was going to remark about p.cyanacen's obvious preference for alder.Does this mean we need to look along river banks etc.where this "tree of the vernal equinox" (at least it is in these isles,it is also one of the oldest post ice-age residents I'll have you know) is found ?I've seen reference to both softwood and hardwood chippings,which NATURALLY OCCURING chippings -apart from the alder- does p.cyanacens prefer?  :heartpump: 


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""

Edited by Lonewolf (09/18/03 05:51 PM)

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: Silverwolf]
    #1925578 -

P.S This "bank cluster" is not a "one off",they've appeared there year after year.


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: Silverwolf]
    #1927902 -

MJ - cheers for the advice, but I think there is something wrong with your website; when I clicked on the "worldwide distribution of species" link - I got sent to an Italian site, (nothing to do with mushrooms) Please fix it soon as I am dying to read this page!

Sinbad

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: Sin Bad]
    #1928301 -

WEll the article is in the Italian journal Anali Civ. Di. Mus. Rovereto, Italia vol 14_189-290. Year 2000 (1998).

That is Giorgio sam,orini;'s Journal wher ei he is editor. WEmt to the Italian site and spent 20 mnutes trying to find the article as my Italian only goes to reading not writing.
Here is the correct URL for the page.

[url]=http://www.museocivico.rovereto.tn.it/UploadDocs/104_art09-Guzman%20&%20C.pdf[url]

Okay, I fixed the link and now it works.

It was a bitch finding it at the Italian site but it is an Italian journal it appeared inmaking iit hard for most of the world toi see the publication or the information.

There are about ten shrooms in there placed by Guzman against my swishes which really are not psychoactive or are species inlocations where they di no t really gorow, primarily the out odf state of Oregon P. azurescens placed in this paper by guzman from Paul Stamets book Psilocybine Mushrooms of the wiorld. They include of course the Panaaeolina foenisecii, P. sphinctrinus, and a few others.

mj Yo do not need to do any of the info below to get ther unless theya gaiun change the addy.

Thanks for bringting this to my attention.

mj ]http://www.museocivico.rovereto.tn.it/UploadDocs/104_art09-Guzman%20&%20C.pdf[/url]

mjshroomer

Okay go to this site here






Attenzione!
Pagina non trovata

Attention!
Page not found




try: http://www.museocivico.rovereto.tn.

Then look on the left of the page for the words

PUBBLICAZIONI:
ANNALI
ELEUSIS
ECO NEWS
MONOGRAFIE

And then click on the word:

Ananli:


Then on the left side of the page click on the word:
Anali 14/1998.

Then on the bottom half of the paper is a loink which says the following:

Annali 14/1998 - art09-Guzman&C.pdf| DOWNLOAD

That opens the friggin page. I went there to the page and tried to p open it. I have to cute FTP the page and see if the regular link from my site wirks. If not then use the following instructions above.

mj

Edited by mjshroomer (09/18/03 07:05 AM)

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1928310 -

Thry this one more time. It works from my site becasue I just cute ftp'ed it there but it does not seem to work here when i post the url:

mj



http://www.museocivico.rovereto.tn.it/UploadDocs/104_art09-Guzman%20&%20C.pdf

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1929605 -

Since your here Mj yeah I did go to the FAQs about amanitas.There's alot of stuff there and I'm not,as you might have gathered,a chemist,however it's clearly worth assimilating some of it.I'll get back to everyone on the subject once I've established,from you or anyone else,if psilocybe squamosa is a U.K resident,is it?  :nut:


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""

Edited by Lonewolf (09/18/03 04:09 PM)

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: Silverwolf]
    #1931545 -

Cheers MJ,

I have printed off that beast of an article and look forward to digesting tonight.

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: Sin Bad]
    #1931595 -

n.b.My posts on this thread are subject to revision and therefore subsequent editing.However I will strive to avoid being disingenuous.


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: Silverwolf]
    #1931693 -

psilocybe squamosa is not an active species.

mj


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Re: British Indigenous [Re: mjshroomer]
    #1931978 -

Bugger!
Pluteus are you still around mate?I've identified most of the trees and bushes within any conceivably viable distance for root association with my "'ard bugger" troop of amanitas.These are as follows;ash,plane,crab apple,sycamore,lime,a thorny bush -unidentified but with large thorns and the main constituent of this small "scruffy" hedge- and one specimen of another unidentified bush (not tree).To me the only concievable host would be the plane .You're probably aware of the famous "London Plane",if your not one of your collegues at Kew will surely be.This less numerous deciduous tree might just be the answer,there was NOTHING else around.Comments anyone?


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""

Edited by Lonewolf (09/19/03 09:49 AM)

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: Silverwolf]
    #1932049 -

Amanita's are generally found in the vincinity of birch or pine, birch signifi=ying the Tree of life.

, Maybe some mixed conifers but ther eeocould be such mulches in the top soils.

Here in america lawns are often covered with mulch and some times mulched lawn areas are re sodded years later with a lawn over a mulched are, thuys we have morels here in the city which are oftren associated with apple trees,

mj

Whether youu are looking for bushes is not the corrctr way to find certin shrooms. it is the muclchews and thetypes ofwood used in the mulch. Knowing the tree habitats help in finding the shrooms Yes P. cyanescens is often associated with rhoderdendrons, verinas, strawberry plants and ivy. the latter often overgrows the muclch in ttwo to three years killing off all nutrients and spores and leaving no room for any shrooms to regrwo. GHere we hav a alwn shroom which sometimes will grow all yearr long depending on if we get snow or freeze, Last March and April we had a one day snow fall in both of those months but none all winter,.

But then fertilizers and perpetual lawn care also are equally needed for a good lawn of P. stuntzii and p. fimetaria which we call blue ringers.

And ther are times when a lwn can produce 20 pounds and up. t he same with a garden or a park producing 20-50 ppounds of p. cyanescens ina single season. I have seen such gardens and i look int he gardens for the shrooms from house to house, stret to street and park to park. I know better than looking in oilder lawns which usualy have coprinus or merasmius oreades or agaricus and look in new lawns around restaurants, apratrment complexes condos, office buildings and nursing homes, ridde and park areas and many publisc places without having to go to t field and take a chance on a ticket or worst. But i also ask permission at some farms to go and look and fotograph. The same in the spring a t riding stables between Evrett to Tumwater and from the cascades to the Olympics.

mj

have a shroomy day.

Irt was Gartz and I who reported blue ringers have now traveld as far south to Eugen Oregon and now reports are coming in frm San francisco which is also a home to P. cyanescens but in the December to january season there while ours is CO tober to December.

mj

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: Silverwolf]
    #1932096 -

Are you certain there is no coppiced birch in the headge?
Or that any could have been cut down in the last 2 or 3
years? Coppiced birches can be very small, but have exstensive
root systems.

Been a sad year for fly agrics, most of my patches are fruitless
this year :-( so far. And my dryed store is coming to an end.


--------------------


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Re: British Indigenous [Re: Paid]
    #1933254 -

You're an August A.musc shroomer are you Paid ?What's your location? I've great faith that here in the South of England we will get a decent season.I've read -recently!- about August fruiting but have only observed it once at an oak/beech (?) site ,MANY years ago so please forgive my hazy memory.
If there ARE birches there I couldn't find them.There are however birches in the vicinty,but across the intersection of two roads AT LEAST twenty yards away.There may be some,by now many years past supporting a healthy tree, birch roots in the bank itself,or roots of any other suitable host.However I have examined the hedge closely more than once and can see NO evidence of coppicing.Note again that these are not health giving specimins their sugar supply obviously being much too compromised.


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""

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Re: British Indigenous [Re: Silverwolf]
    #1933277 -

Quote; "Coppiced birches can be very small"..What I'm trying to get at here is this.."If the host is TOO SMALL with insufficient foliage then the fungi they support will be TOO DANGEROUS!" I'd like some support for this one from a bio-chemist.Has anyone done the research?


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Mushroom Hunting and Identification
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