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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Mushroom Hunting and Identification
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Re: U.K cyanescens indigenous or import? [Re: Zen Peddler]
    #6060625 -

He he! he! Ho ho if only the news were better!
I do actually believe that some of the questions about a.muscaria have now been answered, or at least signposted. I'm pretty happy with where we seem to be at with them now.
Now Amanita Pantherina?..


--------------------
"Odrade read the word silently and then aloud.
"Arafel."
She knew this word.Reverend Mothers of the tyrants time had impressed it into the Bene Gesserit consciousness,tracing it's roots to the most ancient sources.
"Arafel:the cloud darkness at the end of the universe.""

Edited by Silverwolf (09/14/06 02:30 PM)

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Re: U.K cyanescens indigenous or import? [Re: pluteus]
    #16328605 -

pluteus said:
Pluteus still lives; I am his colleague and am posting this message on his behalf. 


If anyone knows what Pluteus is up to at this juncture, can they please PM me?  He promised me he'd get back in touch when he got out of jail and I've been crying all these years.

:frown:

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Re: U.K cyanescens indigenous or import? [Re: Silverwolf]
    #26096415 -

im not sure if it would be possible to find the answer to that but spores can spread across the world if the wind is strong enough. i think its possible it was a world wide evaluational step, their must have been a first but the first would have spread the spores so much it would be impossible to know the original spot,

but now they grow all over the world eather way, rejoice

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Re: U.K cyanescens indigenous or import? [Re: mushycone]
    #26096468 -

The only known record of Psilocybe cyanescens in Northern Ireland was found in an old wood forest, on an uninhabited island, in the middle of a fresh water lough. This would indicate to me that it was more than likely not introduced by human activity, but has been there all along, and the reason why they are so rarely found in their natural habitat (i.e. other than wood chip mulch beds) is because we have cut down most of our old wood forests.


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How to add a picture to a post

Sample ID request - READ BEFORE POSTING AN ID REQUEST!

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Re: U.K cyanescens indigenous or import? [Re: Silverwolf]
    #26328638 -

Not really related to the thread question but m new here and just wanted to check whether its normal to get blacky inky slime on the tops of your Cyan's after picking them? Mine have got loads of it on, and its my first cyans pick.

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Re: U.K cyanescens indigenous or import? [Re: Barryfrombradford]
    #26330143 -

In regards to the OP's question, my take on this is that the P. cyanescens group species occurring in the northern hemisphere (P. cyans, allenii and azurescens) are not indigenous to anywhere in the northern hemisphere.  I believe these "species" originate in Australia and can be more accurately described as strains or phenotypes of P. subaeruginosa. Recent DNA/ITS gene sequencing data supports this notion, with Australian samples of P. subs clustering very close to northern hemisphere P. cyans group species, even overlapping them in a couple samples. This tells us they are very closely related, possibly even considered the same species. When I first pondered the data, I was holding on to the notion that P. cyans are native to the North American PNW, so I imagined that the Australian P. subs might originate from NA P. cyans. However after further study, I believe that is highly unlikely. The key is examining observational history of these species, taking into account the principals of what's called the Founder Effect in genetics and locating Epicenters of Genetic Diversity (the standard that botanists use in identifying geographical origins of species). If you look at a wide range of observations of Australian P. subs and compare them to an equally large range of any one of the NA P. cyans group species, one of things you'll notice is that the Australian P. subs exhibit a much broader range of phenotypes, running the whole gamut, with some looking identical to P. cyans, P. allenii and even P. azures. Whereas, if you look at North American P. cyans, P. allenii or P. azures observations, you'll notice far less variation - they all pretty much look the same. This is exactly what you would expect to see in a scenario where you have an indigenous homeland of a species showing an epicenter of genetic diversity, with evidence of genetic bottle-necking (The Founder Effect) in populations where the species has been introduced. Another piece of evidence is comparing the proportions of observations made in wild/native habitats vs. man-made habitats, which shows the Australian P. subs being much more commonly observed in wild habitats compared to Northern Hemisphere species. As far as the timing and mechanism of the introduction of P. subs into NA and Europe, I believe it must have been in or around the 1800's, when loads of native Australian plant species were being exported and introduced into Europe and NA . P. subs mycelium and/or spores could have easily "hitch-hiked" along with the plant/soil samples.

BTW I'm skeptical that spores could have traveled by way of wind from Australia to Europe/NA from what I understand of global atmospheric air currents, that doesn't seem plausible in my mind, but who knows.

D

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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Mushroom Hunting and Identification
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