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Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis * 3
    #15603034 -

Having recently spent a month in a youth "health center" (a place where 16-25 year old's go when they are "unwell") I have seen the inadequacy of modern psychiatry first hand.

I was forcibly taken from my family and friends, and told I would be in there until I "got better" and diagnosed on the first day of entry, after a very traumatic experience and after being put on a cocktail of drugs that screwed my head. I was also coming down from my first experience with heroin+meth, hadn't slept much in 3 weeks, was stoned, and was shaken from the brutality of having my door kicked in and being beaten up while I'm practically naked on my bed by 6 cops.

Anyway, they diagnosed me on that day, with mania. I tried telling them I'm shaman and I just needed some sleep, but of course, that just contributed to their diagnoses.

Inside, I found a lot of people in similar situations to me, but without the 8 years spent reading stuff online, so they weren't able to heal themselves in the way I was. I noticed a mix of kundalini psychosis, shaman initiation being misunderstood, various soul loss or splitting, as well as a couple of people with messiah syndrome (crossed wires). Out of about 20 patients I was able to meet, I would estimate only 4 or 5 had true chemical imbalances, but every single patient was treated with the same disrespect, like a rat in a cage being experimented on, with doctors and psychiatrists on their high horses, asking trick/backwards questions so they could tick their boxes, get a vague diagnoses, get the patient into the system, and prescribe them drugs so they can continue to get their bonuses and kickbacks.

I told the doctors I knew they were just box tickers and that I knew about their kickbacks, they both had a massive smug smile that they did nothing to hide.

I was planning on changing my course to psychiatry just so I could help people out, but upon seeing this, have decided to stick to my original plan. I am forced to conclude that modern western psychology is way off the mark, they do more harm than help (how can the doctors help when they have problems of their own?) and that the tribesman shamans in the amazon or wherever have more healing powers than these shit pharmaceutical drugs. I'm guessing this is a result of modern medicine being a purely "physical" study - they don't interact with spirits or the spirit world, they just assume there must be something wrong upstairs so try to alter the brain chemistry, rather than taking a spiritual view.

Thoughts/experiences?


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Please allow me to introduce myself, I'm a man of wealth, and taste...

:haha:

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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: lolwut]
    #15603058 -

Very interesting. :popcorn:


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You wanna get high? Drink tap water.
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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: lolwut]
    #15603065 -

lolwut said:
Having recently spent a month in a youth "health center" (a place where 16-25 year old's go when they are "unwell") I have seen the inadequacy of modern psychiatry first hand.

I was forcibly taken from my family and friends, and told I would be in there until I "got better" and diagnosed on the first day of entry, after a very traumatic experience and after being put on a cocktail of drugs that screwed my head. I was also coming down from my first experience with heroin+meth, hadn't slept much in 3 weeks, was stoned, and was shaken from the brutality of having my door kicked in and being beaten up while I'm practically naked on my bed by 6 cops.

Anyway, they diagnosed me on that day, with mania. I tried telling them I'm shaman and I just needed some sleep, but of course, that just contributed to their diagnoses.

Inside, I found a lot of people in similar situations to me, but without the 8 years spent reading stuff online, so they weren't able to heal themselves in the way I was. I noticed a mix of kundalini psychosis, shaman initiation being misunderstood, various soul loss or splitting, as well as a couple of people with messiah syndrome (crossed wires). Out of about 20 patients I was able to meet, I would estimate only 4 or 5 had true chemical imbalances, but every single patient was treated with the same disrespect, like a rat in a cage being experimented on, with doctors and psychiatrists on their high horses, asking trick/backwards questions so they could tick their boxes, get a vague diagnoses, get the patient into the system, and prescribe them drugs so they can continue to get their bonuses and kickbacks.

I told the doctors I knew they were just box tickers and that I knew about their kickbacks, they both had a massive smug smile that they did nothing to hide.

I was planning on changing my course to psychiatry just so I could help people out, but upon seeing this, have decided to stick to my original plan. I am forced to conclude that modern western psychology is way off the mark, they do more harm than help (how can the doctors help when they have problems of their own?) and that the tribesman shamans in the amazon or wherever have more healing powers than these shit pharmaceutical drugs. I'm guessing this is a result of modern medicine being a purely "physical" study - they don't interact with spirits or the spirit world, they just assume there must be something wrong upstairs so try to alter the brain chemistry, rather than taking a spiritual view.

Thoughts/experiences?



Bro, VERY similar experience over here.

It really fucked me up for a while. The doctors had me convinced that what I went through was a "chemical imbalance," and my best friend—science type studying Neuroscience, who I thought could help me understand the experience—corroborated their story.

After a period of existential nihilism/hopelessness and an intense self-reflective period, I started studying metaphysics and mysticism and realized I had been victimized hardcore. Stay strong, dude, more of us out there.

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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: thefloodbehind]
    #15603111 -

I'm scared of in patient care. Thats my only fear. Being forced drugs to make you a zombie. How does giving a person more drugs help them get off drugs? Because the drugs given are paying big politician bribes! Why'd u have to go?


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Your god is dead, and I killed him.

When you’re lost, here I am. Forever with your soul


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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: The Phleg]
    #15603229 -

pyrate999 said:
Very interesting. :popcorn:




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check out my music!
drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss

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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: lolwut]
    #15603744 -

.

Edited by cateyes (04/19/12 03:21 PM)

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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: cateyes]
    #15604500 -

Great posts!

It is true, what is really the difference between Mental Illness and Spiritual Crisis? Reality and Perception are so delicate and personal, we need to understand that and come up with better ways of helping people cope than just forcing down drugs to make them feel like a zombie.

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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: emeraldlife88]
    #15604853 -

Thoughts/experiences?

What you're talking about is psychiatry/clinical psychology. And saying psychology does more harm than good is misleading. The problem is not the knowledge this education gives, but the way the jobs requiring this knowledge work. And how our qualification for it interacts with individual psychology, but this type of psychology is in a AB relationship with education. As in A is our brain and B is our observation of it. My conclusion is that knowledge and medicine is not the problem with what you call "modern western psychology". The problem is the system and A (our fallible brain). B (our fallible brain observing and philosophizing or experimenting itself) is only a problem because some people are born in a location in time and space with the kind of A to make it a problem. So, AB are relative, just like good and bad are relative. :evil2:

:2cents:


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"It is the peculiar quality of a fool to perceive the faults of others and forget his own." - Marcus Tullius Cicero

"A room without books is like a body without a soul."  - Marcus Tullius Cicero

"Do not bite at the bait of pleasure, till you know there is no hook beneath it." -Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: dustinthewind13]
    #15610265 -

cool thread interesting stuff in here:)

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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: dustinthewind13]
    #15611129 -

It's really hard not to get the impression it does more harm than good. The illnesses are not very well understood and the whole approach is to give you something to make you calm and submissive, while you're stuck between the white walls for unreasonably long periods of time, with a bunch of people who don't meet the standards of sanity. What makes you think this is a good method to deal with a mentally unstable patient?
The system is definitely a problem yes.

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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: cbub]
    #15611176 -

cbub said:
It's really hard not to get the impression it does more harm than good. The illnesses are not very well understood and the whole approach is to give you something to make you calm and submissive, while you're stuck between the white walls for unreasonably long periods of time, with a bunch of people who don't meet the standards of sanity. What makes you think this is a good method to deal with a mentally unstable patient?
The system is definitely a problem yes.



That's but a small fragment of what we are talking about. And I can't think of a better method right now. :undecided:


--------------------
"It is the peculiar quality of a fool to perceive the faults of others and forget his own." - Marcus Tullius Cicero

"A room without books is like a body without a soul."  - Marcus Tullius Cicero

"Do not bite at the bait of pleasure, till you know there is no hook beneath it." -Thomas Jefferson

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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: dustinthewind13]
    #15611270 -

i've had the opposite experience - that my therapist was telling me I was more in the realm of normal than I realized and that I didn't have an issue.. of course, I've never been hospitalized or put into in-patient care. I'm not even sure if my doc was able to prescribe drugs. I found out some time after my last appointment with him, though, that he and his wife had been visitors of a sweat lodge.

I'm not sure what the op's situation was - sonds like the authorities were called in by an outside party - but choosing to see a psychologist instead of a psychiatrist (one who can't prescribe drugs as opposed to one who can) may help eliminate unwanted medication and thereby sticking to just analyzing thoughts and behaviors.


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full blown human

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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: Penelope_Tree]
    #15614222 -



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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: lolwut]
    #15614491 -

Quote:
Out of about 20 patients I was able to meet, I would estimate only 4 or 5 had true chemical imbalances,



Well I know that you are seeing through the mental illness myth with the things you say, etc, BUT to say that is to actually agree with their BS too because their BS depends on the 'chemical imbalance' myth. So if you claim to 'estimate' that even ONE person is 'chemically imblamces' you are still backing up what is not supported by their pseudoscience.

The Ken Wilbur new age types try and do this. They try and make out that there are 'geniuine spiritual emergencies' (usually meaning 'postmodern, Eastern mystic-oriented, middle classians' like them, but that there is also 'real mental illness'--usually meaning 'rough types---the 'workin classes/chavs etc'. (by the way i am not meaning your saying that)

The other month I found out about Liberation Psychology which I found interesting. I am usually VERY VERY down on 'Psychology' but i thought i'd give the vid a watch and I like that it stresses not to blame the individual but to be aware of the culture the person is in. THAT is something most of the other shit-isms dont do. the y ALWAYS blame the victim and this makes all the other stuff go pooooof, disappear. You know, like a child is not getting on in school? So according to them s/he must have 'ADHD'. So as soon as THAT is established the whole fukin ENFORCED brutalizing open prison system, which is school, magically goes pooof and vanishes. BUT if that is not allowed to fukin disappear, then we are closer to understand dis------ease.By the way I am all for us as communities NOT waiting for the establishment to say yea to being able to have 'psychedelic psychotherapy. As faar as I am concerned it never HAS been ieegal. Only in their insane minds. AND can you imagine if and when it is available to the 'publis' how fukin MUCH it will cost to have. It will only be available for the rich! So we as communities MUST become responsible and be there foe each other. NOT the shamanistic model as such, where only one person in a tribe is THE healer, but encouraging all of us becoming supporters for each other, and for healing ourselves via ecstatic ritual

hmmm cant find the video but here's a good article on liberation psychology http://beyondmeds.com/2011/12/08/occupyliberation/

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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: zzripz]
    #15615471 -

.

Edited by cateyes (04/19/12 03:22 PM)

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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: cateyes]
    #15616023 -

just a note on that video - while i agree with the main premises it presents... i was watching another one with the same theme made by the same organization, and halfway through i started to wonder why the narrator sounded so dramatic and biased against psychiatry, so i did some research. turns out both of these videos are made by the church of scientology. while this doesn't discredit the information per se, it's heavily biased since scientologists have some pretty unusual views about psychiatry perpetrated by their founder - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientology_and_psychiatry#Space_Opera

that said, i think the psychiatric model is very incomplete and potentially very harmful, though i've heard of people being genuinely improved through their methods. just thought i'd shed some light on the documentary, as i think it's an important consideration when viewing the film, as it certainly isn't an unbiased source.


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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: deff]
    #15616354 -

.

Edited by cateyes (04/19/12 03:23 PM)

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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: cateyes]
    #15616511 -

i agree with the sentiments about psychiatry, which is to say i disagree with their models - also i'm sure there is quite a bit of corruption in the industry as there is in most industries - my only issue with the video was the dramatic painting of all psychiatrists as evil (at least in the video i saw) which i think is incorrect. i'm sure many truly believe they're helping others with their methods and mean well - and as such we should have as much compassion for psychiatrists as any other beings. they really cannot help (to a certain degree) their lack of understanding and such. of course some i'm sure are exploitive, but i disagree with labelling an entire profession as shady and manipulative. the reason why the narrator in the video was so dramatic and such is that they (scientologists) believe psychiatry originated with evil aliens billions of years ago and is the cause of most human misery on the planet today :lol:

just thought it was important to put the documentary in context, at least it was for me. i'm certainly not a fan of the psychiatric model and treatments, but i try not to judge/hate the psychiatrists themselves and try to see them as being as much precious human beings as any others. adopting an "us vs them" attitude and demonizing others is not something i think is a good idea - not that you're doing this, but the film i saw was. i would very much like to see an unbiased documentary made on psychiatry and mental illness from some neutral party, showing both sides of the situation :sun: - also i totally understand your dislike of psychiatry given what you've been through - i've also been through anti-psychotic medication and felt tremendously better when i got off them


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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: deff]
    #15616675 -

good conversation going on in this thread

I don't have much to add - although I was in and out of mental hospitals for 3 years, constantly given different drugs to see if they would help

my last stay at a mental hospital was 10 months long and they just kept trying different medications on me and none of them worked.. eventually they booted me out and said "well, good luck with that". After returning home I started exercising and eating well and I got better after a month.

I was diagnosed with schizophrenia, anxiety and depression so I was on a shitload of pills at one time. But I do agree with the idea of spiritual emergency - this was more of an initiation than anything that was really wrong with my brain, in my opinion.


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Re: Mental Illnesses vs. Spiritual Crisis [Re: lolwut]
    #15616766 -

All I have to say is "I fought the law and the law won"


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Why shouldn't the truth be stranger than fiction?
Fiction, after all, has to make sense. -- Mark Twain

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