proud_republican said:

as sad as it is, all of these religious wackjobs will all kill each other eventually. once birth control becomes more accepted in that area, all the stupid will stop procreating. buy condom company stock if you want to take advantage.

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Prisoner#1 said:

blewmeanie said:

scruffymafia said:

So what if they did? Am i saying that a jewish state is bad? No im not.

What was left as Palestine is a sovereign country. israel has no fucking right invading it, so learn some facts or shut up.

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Perhaps you should take your own advise considering no country outside of the Arab world recognizes the Gaza strip as a sovereign nation. Many of the countries in the middle east including Saudi Arabia, and Egypt don't even recognize the current government that is in power.

Egypt annexed "The Gaza Strip" (I believe in the 40's, though it may have been the 50's) and then refused to grant the people who lived there Egyptian citizenship. Hence the position that they are in now.

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well, so the israelis stole the land from palestine

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twighead said:

Why can't people understand what's done is done? Britan gave the land to Israel (it was Britan's land, not Palestinians) and Israel has tried to make do with what they have and has for the most part been very successful (albeit not without help). I cannot understand how anyone would like Palestine to take over this land, the muslims in power are delusional beyond what many, even christians, in the west would consider insane... I mean that whole 72 virgins thing? Completely batshit.

Palestine must realize they have been outdone, unfair? So what? Life's unfair isn't it. If they were to take control you could see a modern high standard society crash to the ground in months.

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blewmeanie said:

The land was set aside by the league of nations (not the UK) for the creation of a Jewish homeland. Due to years and years of fighting, the British government which was in charge of setting up the state eventually got sick of dealing with it, so the united nations set aside the Gaza strip as an area for the creation of a Palestinian state. However as soon as they declared themselves a sovereign nation, Egypt invaded and took over.

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blewmeanie said:

I'm well familiar with the history of the area. Both because I am a Jew, and because I have an interest in Arab culture and history. Its an absolutely fascinating place to study.

The Partition Plan is what I just referenced in the post you were replying to. As I said, as soon as the Palestinians declared themselves a sovereign nation, Egypt invaded and took over.

The entire situation truly is tragic, and I wish I new of a solution, but I don't.

On one hand the Palestinian people have a right to govern themselves, and to trade peaceably with the rest of the world, however Israel and Egypt also have a right to secure their borders, and to defend themselves when attacked.

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The solution is gradual as I see it: both sides stop fighting, and relations eventually improve, which causes Israel to ease up on Palestine, and Palestine to be more acceptable of Israel... eventually when the two come to terms, they could be made into one state or simply just live in the separated regions they enjoy right now.
But if Palestine wants to keep trying and fight a losing war rather than accept it and try and improve their condition in a practical manner this will never happen

DimensionX said:

What i don't understand is what gives Israel the right to encroach onto their lands. They seem to be doing it constantly. It seems to me that if you do this and people start fighting back you shouldn't be surprised.

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twighead said:

blewmeanie said:

I'm well familiar with the history of the area. Both because I am a Jew, and because I have an interest in Arab culture and history. Its an absolutely fascinating place to study.

The Partition Plan is what I just referenced in the post you were replying to. As I said, as soon as the Palestinians declared themselves a sovereign nation, Egypt invaded and took over.

The entire situation truly is tragic, and I wish I new of a solution, but I don't.

On one hand the Palestinian people have a right to govern themselves, and to trade peaceably with the rest of the world, however Israel and Egypt also have a right to secure their borders, and to defend themselves when attacked.

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The solution is gradual as I see it: both sides stop fighting, and relations eventually improve, which causes Israel to ease up on Palestine, and Palestine to be more acceptable of Israel... eventually when the two come to terms, they could be made into one state or simply just live in the separated regions they enjoy right now.
But if Palestine wants to keep trying and fight a losing war rather than accept it and try and improve their condition in a practical manner this will never happen

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blewmeanie said:

twighead said:

blewmeanie said:

I'm well familiar with the history of the area. Both because I am a Jew, and because I have an interest in Arab culture and history. Its an absolutely fascinating place to study.

The Partition Plan is what I just referenced in the post you were replying to. As I said, as soon as the Palestinians declared themselves a sovereign nation, Egypt invaded and took over.

The entire situation truly is tragic, and I wish I new of a solution, but I don't.

On one hand the Palestinian people have a right to govern themselves, and to trade peaceably with the rest of the world, however Israel and Egypt also have a right to secure their borders, and to defend themselves when attacked.

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The solution is gradual as I see it: both sides stop fighting, and relations eventually improve, which causes Israel to ease up on Palestine, and Palestine to be more acceptable of Israel... eventually when the two come to terms, they could be made into one state or simply just live in the separated regions they enjoy right now.
But if Palestine wants to keep trying and fight a losing war rather than accept it and try and improve their condition in a practical manner this will never happen

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Check into the history (even recent history), both Egypt, and Israel have tried countless times to ease the restrictions on the Palestinian border, and every single time they immediately begin smuggling weapons and explosives across the border, sending suicide bombers into Israel, kidnapping people, and overall just being dicks to everyone around them.

Even other Arab countries recognize hamas as a terrorist organization, and an illegitimate government. Even Abbas, which is recognized as the only legitimate government (and located on the west bank) has fought against hamas. These guys are fucking cunts, they do not want freedom, and they do not want peace. They want a totalitarian Islamic government, and the destruction of israel.

The truly fucked up part is that the people of Gaza actually elected these guys. The people overall just want to live peaceably, but they never will as long as there are extremists in power.

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scruffymafia said:

How about this, i was just doing some research on hagigat and found this quote which i think speaks volumes.

Quote:

When drawn on the subject, most Tel Aviv residents favour compromise to achieve peace with the Palestinians. But on the whole they try to block out the military regime and the oppression of Palestinians.
"I can appreciate it isn't much fun living in a refugee camp, or in the West Bank," Mr Bar Yitzhak said. "But I think it is hard for people elsewhere to imagine what it is like for someone to come to your favourite bar or cafe and blow themselves up.

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http://www.drugs-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12424

It seems the israeli people dont think the occupation is a good thing either. Just like i said before. I win, again.

:smug:

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blewmeanie said:

Thats basically what there doing now, They've realized that Hamas cannot be reasoned with, and they're going in to wreck their fucking day.

I truly hope that the Abbas government can gain control, because if they do, there is a real chance for peace. They've already received backing from many other Arab nations to take over control of the Gaza boarder into Egypt.

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Prisoner#1 said:

blewmeanie said:

The land was set aside by the league of nations (not the UK) for the creation of a Jewish homeland. Due to years and years of fighting, the British government which was in charge of setting up the state eventually got sick of dealing with it, so the united nations set aside the Gaza strip as an area for the creation of a Palestinian state. However as soon as they declared themselves a sovereign nation, Egypt invaded and took over.

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slightly one sided isnt it?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1947_UN_Partition_Plan

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blewmeanie said:

I'm well familiar with the history of the area. Both because I am a Jew, and because I have an interest in Arab culture and history. Its an absolutely fascinating place to study.

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my father was a jew, simply being a jew doesnt make you knowledgeable in the affairs, it takes a bit of reading, under the british mandate the jewish state looked like this

Quote:

The Partition Plan is what I just referenced in the post you were replying to. As I said, as soon as the Palestinians declared themselves a sovereign nation, Egypt invaded and took over.

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Quote:

On one hand the Palestinian people have a right to govern themselves, and to trade peaceably with the rest of the world, however Israel and Egypt also have a right to secure their borders, and to defend themselves when attacked.

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matt said:

Prisoner#1 said:

blewmeanie said:

The land was set aside by the league of nations (not the UK) for the creation of a Jewish homeland. Due to years and years of fighting, the British government which was in charge of setting up the state eventually got sick of dealing with it, so the united nations set aside the Gaza strip as an area for the creation of a Palestinian state. However as soon as they declared themselves a sovereign nation, Egypt invaded and took over.

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slightly one sided isnt it?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1947_UN_Partition_Plan

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Whether or not the partition plan was one-sided is debatable. Both groups of people were given a chunk of land to call their own. It was a hell of a lot more land than they have now after spitting at the two state partition plan and attempting (and failing miserably) to create "The United State of Palestine". The Israelis fought for their land and won, period. They then built a democratic Oasis in that war-torn shit hole dubbed the middle east. The Palestinians need to get over it and move on with their lives. Stop fighting with Israel and learn from them.

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Prisoner#1 said:

does that give israel the right to blockade gaza and prevent
that trade? there is a coastline that the could make use of if
it wasnt for israel

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