learningtofly said:

First of all we must assume that no women are intrigued by pornography or the act of sex-for-money at all.

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Quote:

Degrade
1.  To reduce in grade, rank, or status; demote.


2.  To lower in dignity; dishonor or disgrace: a scandal that degraded the participants.


3.  To lower in moral or intellectual character; debase.


4.  To reduce in worth or value: degrade a currency.


5.  To impair in physical structure or function.

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I don't think that pornography degrades either men or women, though it does present a very narrow perspective on sexuality.  It is arousing to watch other people having sex, and clinical studies have shown that both sexes are excited by graphic sexual imagery.  (Yes, they did clinical studies, and yes, I watched a video OF the clinical studies.  It was not very exciting, as everyone was hooked up to various arousal-measuring devices. .)

IMO, when humans were all living in close proximity, we had many opportunities to watch others engaged in sex play and intercourse.  This is how we learned to 'do' sex, and those who were inspired to have more sex after becoming aroused by watching went on to make more babies.  Evolution, baby!! 

My teenaged son was initially very embarrassed to discuss his interest in pornography.  He was shocked when I validated his attraction to it, and even more shocked when I admitted that I found it exciting, too.  I described the clinical studies & my theory about voyeurism being hard-wired into human sexuality.  I also told him that there was MORE to sex than the animalistic and kinky performances featured in pornography. 

The main issue I have with people watching porn, and particularly with young men watching, is that they have no other frame of reference for the development of their sexuality.  For a sexually-active adult, the occasional X-rated movie or jerk-mag is just part of a bigger scheme.  They know that the imagery is a rarified slice of the broader spectrum of sexual expression, and they can appreciate it for what it is. 

For an inexperienced, sexually-isolated young man, however, this imagery seems to be the WHOLE picture.  The fact that it is novel and exciting, not to mention taboo, makes it all the more memorable and important.  As most parents seem to want their children to STAY children, and be offered abstinence-only sex ed in the public schools, these young men are not offered any contrasting descriptions of what sexuality can be.

Ideally, and this is what I have offered my sons, parents would maintain a totally open dialogue about sex and sexuality throughout childhood and early adulthood.  They would allow their kids to ask ANY question, and research the answer if they didn't know it themself.  They would have a library of books on sexuality, and allow their kids age-appropriate access.  They would offer acceptance and support during puberty, and deal with their hang-ups AWAY from their children (in counseling, if possible). 

Within this framework, pornography would not make such a big impression, and could be enjoyed for the exaggerated and fantastical fiction that it is.

Icelander said:

Pornography only degrades women if they choose to feel degraded by it.

Same for men. Everything has many aspects that can be positive or negative. This must be taken on a case by case basis IMO.

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Veritas said:

Quote:

Degrade
1.  To reduce in grade, rank, or status; demote.


2.  To lower in dignity; dishonor or disgrace: a scandal that degraded the participants.


3.  To lower in moral or intellectual character; debase.


4.  To reduce in worth or value: degrade a currency.


5.  To impair in physical structure or function.

---

I don't think that pornography degrades either men or women, though it does present a very narrow perspective on sexuality.  It is arousing to watch other people having sex, and clinical studies have shown that both sexes are excited by graphic sexual imagery.  (Yes, they did clinical studies, and yes, I watched a video OF the clinical studies.  It was not very exciting, as everyone was hooked up to various arousal-measuring devices. .)

IMO, when humans were all living in close proximity, we had many opportunities to watch others engaged in sex play and intercourse.  This is how we learned to 'do' sex, and those who were inspired to have more sex after becoming aroused by watching went on to make more babies.  Evolution, baby!! 

My teenaged son was initially very embarrassed to discuss his interest in pornography.  He was shocked when I validated his attraction to it, and even more shocked when I admitted that I found it exciting, too.  I described the clinical studies & my theory about voyeurism being hard-wired into human sexuality.  I also told him that there was MORE to sex than the animalistic and kinky performances featured in pornography. 

The main issue I have with people watching porn, and particularly with young men watching, is that they have no other frame of reference for the development of their sexuality.  For a sexually-active adult, the occasional X-rated movie or jerk-mag is just part of a bigger scheme.  They know that the imagery is a rarified slice of the broader spectrum of sexual expression, and they can appreciate it for what it is. 

For an inexperienced, sexually-isolated young man, however, this imagery seems to be the WHOLE picture.  The fact that it is novel and exciting, not to mention taboo, makes it all the more memorable and important.  As most parents seem to want their children to STAY children, and be offered abstinence-only sex ed in the public schools, these young men are not offered any contrasting descriptions of what sexuality can be.

Ideally, and this is what I have offered my sons, parents would maintain a totally open dialogue about sex and sexuality throughout childhood and early adulthood.  They would allow their kids to ask ANY question, and research the answer if they didn't know it themself.  They would have a library of books on sexuality, and allow their kids age-appropriate access.  They would offer acceptance and support during puberty, and deal with their hang-ups AWAY from their children (in counseling, if possible). 

Within this framework, pornography would not make such a big impression, and could be enjoyed for the exaggerated and fantastical fiction that it is.

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Chronic777 said:

I think the only thing it degrades it the sexual act itself, sex can be simply fun and thats very enjoyable, but tantra takes it way beyond fun, but we live in a society that generally shuns it instead of really teaching us about it.

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Veritas said:

I don't think that pornography degrades either men or women

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Icelander said:

Pornography only degrades women if they choose to feel degraded by it.

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learningtofly said:

Honestly, I see pornography as the representation of capitalism. People are "whores" if you will, to the dominant class and engage in acts that of which they may not like in order to get by.

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MushmanTheManic said:

Icelander said:

Pornography only degrades women if they choose to feel degraded by it.

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I can't think a woman is being degraded unless she also thinks she is being degraded too?

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MushmanTheManic said:

Veritas said:

I don't think that pornography degrades either men or women

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Why not?

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Veritas said:

MushmanTheManic said:

Veritas said:

I don't think that pornography degrades either men or women

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Why not?

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To paraphrase Eleanor Roosevelt, no one can degrade you without your permission. The fact that pornography exists is neutral, it is only our perceptions which assign negative or positive attributes to this particular mode of sexual expression. Who has done the degrading?

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