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When did belief become more than hope?
    #8256503 -

after listening to the audio in the 'dangerous for our children....' thread, i got to thinking:

when did people take belief from having something to hope in, as factual? why did this change take place? what benefit do they gain by imposing their beliefs as fact, as opposed to maintaining them as a hope?


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channel your inner Larry David

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Re: When did belief become more than hope? [Re: demiu5]
    #8256526 -

when they started to try to make money off of it.

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Re: When did belief become more than hope? [Re: im_on_a_boat]
    #8257391 -

is this seriously the only reason? money/power?


if so, how do others/most people not see this? especially when putting their money into the collection plate every week?


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channel your inner Larry David

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Re: When did belief become more than hope? [Re: demiu5]
    #8257422 -

you're preaching to the choir.

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Re: When did belief become more than hope? [Re: demiu5]
    #8257560 -

For the best guess about this, I recommend "Denial of Death," by Ernest Becker. He posits that we create religion, culture, art, etc...as a means to distract ourselves from the unbearable awareness of our mortality. Whether you agree or not, his book is a great read. Once you've finished his book, watch "Flight from Death," an incredible documentary which follows research based upon Becker's work.

http://www.flightfromdeath.com/index.htm

http://faculty.washington.edu/nelgee/lectures/speeches/hughes_1.htm

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Re: When did belief become more than hope? [Re: Veritas]
    #8258015 -

Then read Leonard Orr's "The Common Sense of Physical Immortality". :wink:


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Re: When did belief become more than hope? [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #8258891 -

demius said:
after listening to the audio in the 'dangerous for our children....' thread, i got to thinking:

when did people take belief from having something to hope in, as factual?  why did this change take place?  what benefit do they gain by imposing their beliefs as fact, as opposed to maintaining them as a hope?




imo hope is blind faith, beleif is based in experience.

You can have hope that leads to belief through experience, but i don't think you can truly believe unless you experience, otherwise why should you beleive? I wouldn't!

Jesus said "blessed is he who has not seen yet has believed" i would disagree, i think anyone who believes without first hand experience is a blind fool. The buddha taught to not believe anything he said unless you experience it.



Veritas said:
For the best guess about this, I recommend "Denial of Death," by Ernest Becker.  He posits that we create religion, culture, art, etc...as a means to distract ourselves from the unbearable awareness of our mortality.




Religions such as buddhism & hinduism make you face death, not distract you from it, they teach you to face everything and be aware of it. They more than likely would have started from a fear of death & mystical experiences but they do not teach you to distract from anything, especially not death.

Conscious dying is one of the best things a person can practice in meditation. The fact we humans can consciously die through the awareness of our own mortality is such an incredibly beautiful thing, i have been obsessed with death much of my life and enjoy facing it, its very humbling.

Buddha used to train monks by making them watch burning bodies in a cemetary for 24 hours a day, i don't consider this "distraction" from death anxiety. :wink:

the ultimate paradox is in truly facing you own death you realise immortality, not of "you" but of life, of which we are all a part of.

:peace:


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Re: When did belief become more than hope? [Re: Chronic7]
    #8260428 -

Yes, "distract" is not the most-accurate wording for Becker's theory.  "Cope with" is probably closer to his idea, as he does claim that there are methods of reacting to death anxiety which are healthy and balanced.  Some coping mechanisms are distractions, and allow people to persist in denying their mortality.  Others involve creative means of using one's life, and even direct confrontation with the reality of death (such as meditating on burning corpses.)

IMO, "memento mori" is a far-healthier method of coping with death anxiety than endless distractions and religious rituals.  YMMV.  :grin:

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Re: When did belief become more than hope? [Re: Veritas]
    #8264657 -

Veritas said:
For the best guess about this, I recommend "Denial of Death," by Ernest Becker.  He posits that we create religion, culture, art, etc...as a means to distract ourselves from the unbearable awareness of our mortality.  Whether you agree or not, his book is a great read.  Once you've finished his book, watch "Flight from Death," an incredible documentary which follows research based upon Becker's work.

http://www.flightfromdeath.com/index.htm

http://faculty.washington.edu/nelgee/lectures/speeches/hughes_1.htm



:thumbup: right, if you are able to take a real good look at yourself and can follow the trail you will end up with fear and while every moment may not be lived this way, it just might.


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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