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OfflineAdamist
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Lucifer
    #730040 - 07/07/02 09:03 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

I've been thinking about the story of Lucifer and how he "rebelled" against God by making his own creation, which is supposedly the reality we live in.
Well would not that be the same as one of us deciding to create a video game with artificial intelligence?
I don't see how creation could be rebellion, especially towards the almighty Creationist, or God.
Is it wrong because Lucifer seperated himself from God, the Source, to create a world of polarity? This would create suffering, but it would also create growth, learning, and an outside experience to take back to the Source (and make it stronger). I don't see why Lucifer is portrayed as such an evil being... he was just a curious dude who wanted to experience something outside of God. Isn't that the same as a child who wants to experience something outside of the restricted world of their parent's protection?

Forgive me if I got some aspects of the story wrong.... I am not too familiar with it.


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Anonymous

Re: Lucifer [Re: Adamist]
    #730049 - 07/07/02 09:08 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

My understanding is that Lucifer 'rebelled' against God by creating his Merkaba externally, as a technology rather than function of the spirit. God intended for the Merkaba to be an internal function of the spirit. By doing this, Lucifer did the opposite of what God intended, thus creating the material world. Perhaps this is why God put Lucifer in charge of the material plane, because he created it and was thus responsible for it.

I don't see Lucifer as bad at all, just an opposing force that is neccessary for Creation to continue learning. It's a fine cosmic balance.


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Anonymous

Re: Lucifer [Re: ]
    #730089 - 07/07/02 09:25 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

You two sinners are going to burn in hell for your heresies...

or something like that.


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Anonymous

Re: Lucifer [Re: ]
    #730093 - 07/07/02 09:27 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Where's a catholic when you need one?


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Anonymous

Re: Lucifer [Re: ]
    #730101 - 07/07/02 09:30 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

I'm a recovering Catholic.


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Anonymous

Re: Lucifer [Re: ]
    #730105 - 07/07/02 09:31 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

I'm so sorry..

Here.. have a hug


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Anonymous

Re: Lucifer [Re: ]
    #730108 - 07/07/02 09:34 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

You're not a priest are you? I don't like hugs from priests, they don't know where to put their hands...


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Anonymous

Re: Lucifer [Re: ]
    #730114 - 07/07/02 09:37 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Sorry, I got off topic. I always saw interesting similarities in the Lucifer myths and the story of Prometheus.


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OfflineEllis Dee
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Re: Lucifer [Re: Adamist]
    #730121 - 07/07/02 09:39 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Lucifer's sin was the sin of pride. He wanted to be worshipped ahead of God. He was cast down to the earth for is sin. Lucifer is not a creator. He is a destroyer. A murderer from the beginning and a father of lies. All he wants to do is take as many souls to hell with him as he can.


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"If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon

And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,


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Anonymous

Re: Lucifer [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #730129 - 07/07/02 09:41 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

What is hell? Can you provide some proof of it's existence?


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OfflineEllis Dee
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Re: Lucifer [Re: ]
    #730139 - 07/07/02 09:44 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

What is hell?

Here's some of what the Bible has to say:

A place of weeping and gnashing of teeth - And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth" (Matthew 25:30).

A place of outer darkness - "Then said the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away, and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth" (Matthew 22:13).

A place of torments - "And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom" (Luke 16:23).

A place of Sorrows - "The sorrows of hell compassed me about; the snares of death prevented me;" (2 Samuel 22:6).

A place of everlasting destruction - "Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;" (II Thessalonians 1:9).

A place where men are tormented with fire and brimstone - "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death" (Revelation 21:8).

A place where fire is not quenched - "Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched" (Mark 9:44).

A bottomless pit - "And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit" (Revelation 9:2).

A place of no rest - "And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name" (Revelation 14:11).

It is ultimately a lake of fire - "And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death" (Revelation 20:14).

A place of hopeless of unsatisfied desires - "And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame " (Luke 16:24). The rich man wanted water but could not get any.


--------------------
"If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon

And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,


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OfflineAdamist
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Re: Lucifer [Re: ]
    #730140 - 07/07/02 09:44 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

LOL, Evolving


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:heartpump: { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } } :heartpump:


Edited by Adamist (07/07/02 09:45 PM)


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InvisibleSwami
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Re: Lucifer [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #730152 - 07/07/02 09:48 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth" (Matthew 22:13).

Ashes to ashes; dust to dust. According to both science and the Bible we lose our body at the time of death. So how can there be a "gnashing of teeth" after death?



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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineEllis Dee
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Re: Lucifer [Re: Swami]
    #730170 - 07/07/02 09:55 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

The answer is simple, you get your body back, including teeth.

John 5
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.


--------------------
"If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon

And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,


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OfflineAdamist
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Re: Lucifer [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #730290 - 07/07/02 10:55 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Here is part of a "channeling" by Lucifer called "The Fallen Angel"...

"As I fell as a pattern, a blueprint of an idea, I held in form an energy that enabled beings such as yourselves to experience, light and dark, good and bad. You all come from many places in the universe; there is much healing to be done. The only place in the universe where beings can transmute negativity into positivity is on planet Earth. This is enabled because I, Lucifer, hold a framework that allows there to be duality, judgement.
You see, it is not me that commits the sins you project on to me; it is yourselves. You cannot bear the darkness in your own souls, so you disown it and project it onto me. Such is your nature, being held in duality. You, as a species, have a tendency to judge, and this in itself is the downfall of man. You have heard the story of the fall from Eden. I did not commit any sin. I just gave you the choice. You, in your truth, choose to judge the situation and fall from Grace. Grace is the ability to blindly follow the intent of the Creator. You as creative beings choose to choose. It was when you judged, that you fell from your place in heaven. All I did was give you the space where you could have a choice.
I have held this energy framework for millions of years and allowed beings from all over the universe to come here and transmute karma, to learn the lessons Earth so gladly teaches.
Through me, you will learn to heal your judgements and will learn to love the darkness as well as the light as they are the two faces of God.
Wake up to yourselves. Gather in the projections that you have surrounded me with and begin to heal.
Wash away the darkness that encases me and I will be free to be the Lightbringer!"


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:heartpump: { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } } :heartpump:


Edited by Adamist (07/07/02 10:58 PM)


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OfflineAdamist
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Re: Lucifer [Re: Adamist]
    #730325 - 07/07/02 11:19 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Here's some more:

" I am a mirror to the human soul. I only reflect your darkness, all that is not with God. The darkest recesses of your soul are reflected in the vision that you have of me. You cannot accept that there are places in your souls that are dark. You talk about being sinners, but how many of you have the courage to accept the darkness within yourselves. You have spent an eternity trying to project this failing onto others and myself. Blaming, judging, simply digging deeper and deeper grave for yourselves. Yet I do not judge. It is all fine with me. There is nothing that would shock me. I have been very curious watching you from within my space create a world that is constantly on the verge of destruction. You are such exciting beings; I am amazed watching you.
You are living breathing expressions of the Creator, creating dark and fore-boding clouds in your very own reality. This has been a necessary part of the plan. You have come here from many places in the universe, bringing many issues with you to be played out. You are using the energy space that I provide to experience good and evil, right and wrong, light and darkness.
You are learning choice and free will. I have held for you a framework where you can experience light and dark. I will hold this framework until the last of you have finished playing
in the darkness. For that is what it is, play.
Elevate your consciousness into the fifth dimension for a moment, and look at me and you will see that I am friend, a brother, enabling you to experience a creative process that allows you to forget, to dream, and to awaken as God once more. It is to waken in the dream, to allow the God that you are, to awaken in the lucidity of your reality!
From the level of non-judgement, it has all been a cosmic joke. All is God; nothing can possibly be left out, so, therefore, so am I and so is the darkness. For the darkness is a very creative process and fear in its transmutation is an experience never to be missed by any
enquiring and curious soul.
When you can accept and love the part of you that is the dark as a creative part of your consciousness, then I will free you from my grasps and we will move together into the Oneness of New Planet. When you no longer look at me as outside of yourself, when you have pulled all the aspects of yourself into the fullness of your souls you will move in consciousness. When you can look upon evil acts without judgement, then you have truly entered the realms of heaven. I await you there. It is not about living your life without care or purpose. It is about feeling and following the intent of the soul without judgement. I have faith in you as I waken within you. As you integrate me as your own, we will both be free to play once more in Eden. For within my soul and yours, there is the information we will use to find our way Home to bathe in each other's love once more. I cannot wait for the embrace. I have felt the love. It has made me hungry. Finally I know what will satisfy this empty heart. The love of your soul. For it is through beings such as you that mankind can free the perspectives that you have around evil. Only when you can look upon darkness with the love of the Creator, which you are, will this planet of yours shift in vibration.
I hold the key. I am a blueprint. Not only do I hold the idea of separation and duality, but I also have the means with which to transform your world into a unified world of oneness and
light. No longer will you see black and white, yin and yang, but you will perceive the unification of spirit and matter. You will literally become Gods living in physical forms. For this was the plan that we had all along to transform the very negativity of the universe through the love of beings such as you and me. For are we not all fallen angels?
The blueprint is a matrix that contains all the necessary information to create a New Planet frequency; beings are being aligned with the crystal at the centre of the planet to access this information. When the time is right, every-one will be aligned and I will send out a new intent.
With this, we will bathe in the Light of the Creator once more. So, until the last person is finished dancing with the devil, I will hold the old way, but I am eager to shift into a new role,
one where I will be misunderstood no more."


--------------------
:heartpump: { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } } :heartpump:


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OfflineEllis Dee
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Re: Lucifer [Re: Adamist]
    #730330 - 07/07/02 11:29 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Keep in mind that Lucifer is the accuser, the murderer, the rebel that wants to be worshipped, and above all else, a master of lies. Lucifer will do or say anything to decieve people from the truth. I know, because I've been in bondage. My old friend Lucifer came, he fought to keep me in chains, but I saw through the tricks of old six-sixty-six.


--------------------
"If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon

And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,


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Invisiblemr crisper
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Re: Lucifer [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #730431 - 07/08/02 02:58 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

i love using the bible to prove things
isaiah 45:7 " i make peace, and create evil; i the lord do all these things"
to assume lucifer has broken away from god, gone against the will of said god. been a naughty angel.....implies some weakness or lack of control on god's part, isn't that a little presumptuous of us?


Edited by mr crisper (07/08/02 03:01 AM)


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Invisiblemr crisper
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Re: Lucifer [Re: Adamist]
    #730437 - 07/08/02 03:21 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

In reply to:

. All is God; nothing can possibly be left out, so, therefore, so am I and so is the darkness. For the darkness is a very creative process and fear in its transmutation is an experience never to be missed by any
enquiring and curious soul.





its about the same message. not that i wish to draw any comparisons to the bible. where did these texts come from?


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OfflineAdamist
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Re: Lucifer [Re: mr crisper]
    #730465 - 07/08/02 04:23 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Alloya.de A very interesting website, to say the least...


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