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OfflineSynthincog_Nito
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feeling weird during trip?
    #671245 - 06/10/02 08:20 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

i had my first trip the other week and it got pretty intense at times. i brushed my hand past the back of my hair and thought i was a wolf. i couldn't even tell if i was still breathing and when i did hear my heart it was going fast. this shit really scared me. is it possible to die on really good shrooms, or have a seizure/heart attack etc? it was a huge dose for my first time and i couldn't feel my body sometimes. is this normal at all? these kinda things worried me and that's why i got scared.


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Offlinepostalboy
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: Synthincog_Nito]
    #671266 - 06/10/02 08:31 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

No you may think you are going to die but you won't
The LD 50 for mushrooms in tests is roughly 17 grams in a mouse or a rat. since those animals weigh between 3 oz and a pound the LD50 for a 150 lb human would be about 2500-5000 grams thats a whole bunch. Which translates to about 5-10 pounds of dry shrooms. if you can eat that much without sharing you deserve to die. those arent exact but you get the idea. remember, its all in your head. Postalboy


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OfflineLOBO
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: Synthincog_Nito]
    #671403 - 06/10/02 10:04 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

What you felt is normal, In my first trip I did a high dose, and I actually thought I had died and was a spirit, In high doses your body will not function that well, like moving peeing and doing things in general, that’s why when you trip do it in a safe place were no one will bather you.
And the weirdness, well that’s the world of the shrooms just a different reality; as you trip more often you will navigate the realm a little better, but never 100%.
Good luck


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OfflineHBS
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: LOBO]
    #671411 - 06/10/02 10:09 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

I've tripped over 40 times now on shrooms, done acid a few times, DXM, Foxy methoxy, E, etc etc ... and I STILL get nervous before each and every trip, no matter the dosage. The nervousness often lingers and turns into anxiety on the trip, and I start questioning things like whether this is the one shroom trip I'll never come back from ("I finally fucked my life over"), and such. I've been learning to not worry anymore, by taking lower doses and getting completely used to them before dosing any higher. It works well.


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OfflineLOBO
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: HB]
    #671534 - 06/10/02 11:38 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

That’s the beauty of the shrooms, I get the same exact feeling every time, because you know you are going into the unknown, the unpredictable; venturing into infinity is no trivial matter, is like doing skydiving, but the diving is with in.


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InvisibleRipple
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: Synthincog_Nito]
    #671851 - 06/10/02 03:23 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

yea sometimes you get so concious of your body functioning you start to think that something is wrong with you. It's not a good idea to trip at a high level until you know what to expect and even then nothing is a sure thing when tripping! Go for a level one trip next time. how many grams did you eat and what strain?

If your feet are cold put on sox!


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OfflineSynthincog_Nito
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: Ripple]
    #671985 - 06/10/02 04:48 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

i ate 3grams dried of some cubensis. my friend bougt me a 1/4oz of dried ones in a chocolate piece. its gonna be good but i might split it up into 4trips. bc i heard u only need like 1 or 2grams to trip.


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: Synthincog_Nito]
    #672415 - 06/10/02 11:41 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Hi Synthincog-Nito!

I have to agree with the rest here: Death by the Shroom is highly unlikely. They're not poisonous in the usual sense. You may easily eat a plate full of fresh Cubies & your friend who happens to be a doc wont see dangerous alterations in the body-signs. However: so much Shrooms may easily spell disaster psychologically... It might be a guided Trip to Hell, only because it was STRONGER than you can deal with on that particular day. (Your response varies from Trip to Trip!)

Physical malaise can be very shocking but usually it's all in the Mind. I myself get frequent visits from the Asphyx. I then feel like I'm breathing (amniotic?) fluid & that my involuntary breathing stops: that I have to consciously breathe to stay alive & feel suffocated, this while on the objective level I probably am in fact HYPERVENTILATING.

Perfectly harmless, all in the Mind, but it feels SO REAL, It scares the shit out of me & that's just the ticket for a Bad one, as you know from reading the "Psychedelic Experience FAQ" on this site.
Am I a newbie? Hell no! 67 Trips & counting! Usually this happens when I take more than that's right on that day.

The dose part. You're quite new to the Experience.
I beg of you: do the Right thing and take 0.5-2gr of your cubies the next time out, 1gr of good cubies is probably just right.
One of the best-known Tripgroups is the Alexander Shulgin one. (read his TIHKAL & PIHKAL: true treasuretroves!!!) Shulgin reccommends for Psilocybin a dose of about 10-20mg. This amount is usually contained in 1-2 dried grams of cubies.

Like I found my last time out (S-67, a few weeks ago) half a gram of dried Cubies that're real strong can hit you like a ton of bricks when you're sensitive that day.

Take a small amount & wait 1 1/2 hours. If it's just right or a little too intense: you did right. If it's to little, munch some more. Is it WAY to little, double your initial dose, but never more than that.

DO NOT GET MACHO ON SHROOMDOSE: you may bitterly regret it in the subsequent hours! It's not like you have to prove your worth or "fuck yourself up": Cubies can be quite intense & give more than you've bargained for, even at amounts less than one gram, occasionally. Respect yourself, Respect the Mushroom & remember what Versache said:
"Less Is More!"


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OfflineLOBO
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: Asante]
    #672500 - 06/11/02 03:01 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Well it all depends what you are looking for, 1-2 g barely does anything, just scratches the surface of the experience, (maybe for recreational use) if you are into that.
But if you are going to use this sacrament for inner exploration, you have to at least take 3.5 g, I agree that this type of experience is not for the faint of heart and the mentally immature. Shrooms are not toys to be played with!


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: LOBO]
    #673080 - 06/11/02 12:27 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Differences, Lobo, individual differences!

I'm quite sensitive myself where it comes to things like LSD and Mushrooms. My response tends to be several times that of alot of others.

Not to be snotty, but alot of literature points in the direction that a lot of people can get into serious dyscomfort above 20mg should the going get rough. And it can get very, very rough as you probably know. I've seen people on 3 strong grams of Cubies (about 30-40mg Psilocybine) lose control & getting completely gored. Not by particular sensations, Miracles or the like: by sheer OVERLOAD.

I myself had an hourlong "teaching" by what one might call an "entity" which was unbelievable. Several clairvoyant things happened. Lying in darkness everything was alive with bright & intricate patterns and symbolic representations of the "teachings" & more than I can begin to describe a million times over. The amount used was 1.2 dried grams of Liberty Caps: about 10-15mg Psilocybin which it was until the big wave crashed in at about the 3-hourpoint.

This ain't weird. I've read several times (f.i. in Stafford's "Psychedelics Encyclopedia") that above an average threshold of 10mg Psilocybin can generate the full spectrum of experiences: Anything a high dose can do can be brought about by a low, over-treshold dose of Shrooms. Above 20mg Psilocybin there's a sort of transition in most people that can bring about overload. 20mg is easily provided by 2gr of dried PF-TEK shrooms, which may be as strong as 30mg...

If you take your average Tripper there are people about 5x more sensitive and people who don't react at all. I really believe that it was the use of high doses in the case of LSD in the '60s that gave it a bad name. Of the newbies that flock on the Shroomery alot are sensitive. Others have serious troubles & may be unaware of that. And some might be too young or immature to handle an experience as potent as the one the Mushrooms provide, as you pointed out.

But when it comes to dose-recommendations I'm always careful. I did my 3 microdots & what happened to me... Wish you all were then and there Shroomites! I wish the whole world would have a Trip like I had then! But I would never recommend such a dose & ain't planning to go there anymore. I've come to believe that Shrooms will show it to you on a low dose when the time is ripe, but that you "force your way in" with high ones. Most trippers I've met who had Bad Trips said they happened or began after boldly upping the dose. Allthough I was a Highdoser some years ago I decided to go low and recommend that. I've seen a good Tripping friend go weird, real weird in an unhappy way.

I think Mushrooms are Divine keys to the Divine Mind. I also believe they might be doing alot more, maybe 1.000 times, than we tend to imagine. The Shroom flips the switch & the Mind unfolds. You explore the Experience for Inner Exploration & so do I. The Shroom has shown me sooo much on the Lowdose and I've seen it do so much for others: I highly recommend them!

But: Darkness & lying down comfortably, preferably with closed eyes is absolutely the KEY to Growth success at low doses, because it's eliminating all the "real" distractions & it'll be just you & the shroom for the 4hours of the strongest effects. Triptalk can be especially wonderful then, but the experience becomes less deep then, usually. And every once in a while...
You're blown away like it was 5gr, every bit as powerful.



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OfflineACidVOnVOid
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: Synthincog_Nito]
    #673222 - 06/11/02 02:33 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Who are these pussies

I dont start to trip until 5 grams dries
i can controll my trips and socialize with people
on shrooms and good acid.

The way i see it
is i prefer to get deep in my experiance

if your gonna explore the depths of the mind dont get scared and go halfway


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OfflineSheepish
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: ACidVOnVOid]
    #673319 - 06/11/02 03:58 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

I don't think that's being a pussy. You have to know your own limits. It doesn't matter if someone else can do 20 tabs and be fine, you need to know how your own body reacts and what is more comfortable for it. Some people can trip HARD off just one tab, others might need a few to get them going. It differs for everyone.


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OfflineLOBO
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: Asante]
    #674060 - 06/12/02 01:44 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Don't take me wrong Wiccan, I am a strong believer that is better to start at lover doses and work your way up, and as some one said find what your limit is or zone dosage is.
I wish I was as sensitive as you, because I don't enjoy eating them that much (yack), but the average tripper will need a little more, and some at the other side of the spectrum will need even more (this guy I know, we were tripping good with 3.5 g but his brother nothing, we gave him more that 7g and just got a buzz), and again I am not making this stuff up, just use the dosage calculator and it will give you the same numbers, but it is just an average.
In My case, I can tell you that I have done 2g of pf and 5g and it is a world of difference, but usually 3.5 with rue is optimal for me.
2g will just give me a level 1 or 2 trip, and 5g well how should I put it "At the gates of infinity"


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: LOBO]
    #674120 - 06/12/02 04:16 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Allright Lobo! You're probably right too!

It's just that I've become abit cautious on the topic of dose. I've been on my bicycle last month, on my bicycle at 4am in the morning rushing to a Trip gone sour. One friend and 2 newbies, one of which was in grave trouble.

He was screaming uncontrollably nearly foaming at the mouth with negative rapture, and he DID piss his pants from sheer horror. He used 2.5gr Cubies, Equadors I believe. It was Hell for him & the other newbie was bleak at the nose from the sight of it too. I had to work him the Grof way (INTO it except distracting him as in "Hippy Talkdown") because it was what Grof would call "Deep Dynamic Activation": a REAL inner conflict in his governing dynamix. I managed to lull him into a sense of security with great effort, but he still had psychosomatics (nausea) the subsequent week.

Can you imagine the shock of it all? You expect a super-tripnight, gently being deflowerd by the Sacred Mushroom and instead Freddy Krueger pops up and shoves a barbed-wire pole up his butt.
He expected joy and awe (religious too: RC) and instead he gets run over by Hell on wheels. So now he's convinced that the Shrooms are Evil (note the capital E) and has vowed to never take them again. His friendship with that friend of mine is precarious now too.

And I've seen, and even experienced, more too. You're 100% right: I may be overcautious, but it's better to laugh "One more Shroom for me please!" on the 1 1/2-HP than to beg the Gods for mercy two hours into it like I once have on 3 solid grams. (about 30mg, by the way)

Oh, if all could take our 8 dried grams and florish! But alas: that ain't so.
I don't wanna accuse YOU of anything but I see alot of Dose-Machoism on the Shroomery. "Aww, c'mon newbie! Take your 1/4th like a man or you haven't tripped at all!" But reading high-level Tripreports I often find myself thinking: Is that the SAME Shroom we're talking about? Where's the GODS in this?!

Different strokes for different folks! It's great you're a Serious Tripper too, but... Have you had Lowlevels in dark setting? It's a Must! Most of the times you won't be smitten, but you'll discover the Mushroom WILL Guide you, even on that petite amount. It's best to be underimpressed than overimpressed. My first Trip was on 1.2gr Liberty Caps back in '94 and it was completely awesome & memorable for everybody present... I've become a Teonanacatl-devotee ever since!


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OfflineLOBO
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: Asante]
    #674380 - 06/12/02 08:39 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Wow that sounds nasty, that's why I trip with experienced people only, you must have some very potent shrooms there!
I am with you there is nothing funny about the "macho attitude" in taking huge doses, I don't trip that often maybe 2 or 3 times a year so I go for the wider experience, but I will try a low dosage in complete darkness, I am intrigued now by your experiences.
Question have you ever tried Goff's holographic breathing? I read his book and sounds very interesting but I am not sure how effective is it.
Thanks


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Offlinebaraka
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: Asante]
    #674386 - 06/12/02 08:41 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

I know where you are coming from wiccan. I have had a good friend of mine run over from 3.5 grams of lipa yais. They where for some reason lots more potent the average cube. Im an expierenced tripped but i could barly contain myself at times and i had to worry about him and talk him down. He kept sayingthings like, whats wrong with me, I dont know whats going on, where am i, just mushrooms zach just mushrooms. It was not cool.


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OfflineSquirtle
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: ACidVOnVOid]
    #674873 - 06/12/02 02:19 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

>who are these pussies?

c'mon man. i've eaten and felt effects from 1 to 7 grams of dried cubes. i dont want to be a pussy, so why dont you tell me where the line is so next time i know how much to eat? sorry if i sound like a dick, you seem to have just that macho attitude that wiccan seeker is talking about. it takes a certain ammount of maturity to understand that its not about how much you eat, but what you get from the experience. on the occasions that i ate 7 or so grams i was looking for a deep, exploratory introspective trip. if i eat 3 or 4 grams im looking for something different. people are not pussies for how little drugs they do, or manly and cool for how much they do.


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OfflineSquirtle
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: Synthincog_Nito]
    #674881 - 06/12/02 02:26 PM (15 years, 2 months ago)

yeah man, i feel you. during one particularly intense trip about every 30 minutes or so a wave would hit me and i would start to lose all motor control and just ease myself to the ground. one time on dxm i was 100% convinced i was dying. i was lying in bed saying to myself "so this is what its like to die." i was at piece with it, but i was sure i wasnt going to wake up. i will never underestimate the powers that psychedelics can have over your perceptions. it can be scary at first, but after you get used to it (or as used to it as one can) you can embrace it and it can be a very powerful (in a good way) experience.


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: LOBO]
    #675847 - 06/13/02 12:32 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Meeeoww! I'm a pussy & low doses make me purr like a kitten!

Sometimes 1 gram may strike you like 5 solid grams. Everybody who has done alot of researching or low-dose exploration can vouch for that. The shroom doesn't make the experience: these exist within you & any noticably active dose of Psilocybin may activate it. The more pressing the issue, the more easily it pops up.
Nobody's perfect, or Shrooms would probably do nothing for nobody.

Holotropic Breathwork... Yeah, a couple of times. 1-2hour breathing sessions. Unfortunately it didn't do very much for me. But take like 10 deep, rapid breaths on Shrooms & the Universe may explode, so mr. Grof certainly is on the right track. Breating thusly isn't nearly as tiresome or boring as I feared. It's quite easy, actually, and when you stop... A blissful peace trough your entire body. Very few visuals for me though. What a bummer!

Please try the lying comfortably in darkness/closed eyes & Lowdose thing! You'll likely discover that seeing your surroundings (distortedly) greatly distracts from what the Shroom tries to tell you. And it's my experience that generally:

"The more Shroom you take, the less of baseline-You there is to see what's going on."

I find lowdoses generally less spectacular, but more insightful then high ones. A note on the funside: I once took 3 microdots of LSD. Super, super Trip! solid gold rotating Ankh-symbols abound with open eyes... Suddenly I heared a Magical, Divine sound. It was one of the most beautiful sounds I ever heared. An eternity later the air became perfumed with the most delicious, Organic fragrance. Incense of the Gods??? A year later I re-listened the sessiontape & figured it out: my tripping friend had farted!!! "when your rationality's absent, All's a Miracle!"
Lemme know how your lowdose thing went?


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Re: feeling weird during trip? [Re: Synthincog_Nito]
    #675860 - 06/13/02 12:55 AM (15 years, 2 months ago)

Ive never thought I was going to die on shrooms but last time i tripped on 5g dry puertos I actually forgot the english language for a brief time, I could think inside my head but forming words to say was tough! Again, people dont die from the shrooms unless you eat pounds and pounds of em, and I guarantee you'd puke after the first pound hehe

have fun


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