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Offlinecapliberty
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: Icelander]
    #5699743 - 06/01/06 01:48 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

---Wisdom is spread through out the earth like rain, and when they collect to create bodies of wisdom, a religious and spiritual tradition is born.----

This applies more to certain sects. then the actually religion itself. Such as the Protestant sects of Christianity, or the sects. of Buddhism


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: capliberty]
    #5699746 - 06/01/06 01:49 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinecapliberty
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: Icelander]
    #5699760 - 06/01/06 01:53 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

This is my theory about collected wisdom, look at the Mormons they just pick and choose what they want to believe in the Christian doctrines and then kind of derive there own religion with there own point of views there own prophets and lifestyle.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: capliberty]
    #5699777 - 06/01/06 01:59 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I see what you're saying now. :thumbup:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlineleery11
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: Icelander]
    #5699813 - 06/01/06 02:10 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

the fact that we need religions to connect to God seems to be evidence of God's absence from huamnity's presence.

now how is this interpreted? That it is against our "natural" nature to be spiritual beings? Or is it against the nature of SOCIETY to be spiritual?

If you look at all the smallest tribes, they have their own rituals and religions or spiritual codes... and they have shaman that directly access and bring archetypes back for the people to follow....

yet the more condensed and profit driven humans get, the more they unite together to do pointless things...... the less GOD is actually present in their daily lives.

Religion seems to be simply be a pacifier against the fear of death. Beneath the surface is God waiting to find those who truely seek..... but in the most part it is as if the fact that so many people are religious, but so few people are spiritual denotes that there is something fundamentally wrong with both religion and society.

Society creates religion so perhaps it is society to blame, and perhaps it goes back to something so simple as this:
Religions start out as pure spirituality but spirituality is comrpomised for flash and pizazz, such as the matrial art illlustration.

So instead of having every follower of a path being enlightened, such as the case of a tribe that is very close to one another....... you have as many followers as humanly possible, yet only very few of them will be able to attain that enlightened because the religion is watered down so heavily.

It's hard to say.

There is something, if there weren't, we would not have consciousness. If there weren't we truely in all fervent honesty would be better off as animals....... but most of us are stil living as animals and neglecting the higher spiritual prospects of our inner nature that have been buried beneath huge piles of filth, greed, and apathy.

If you pray to God... and God doesn't answer..... you'd better LEARN TO PRAY so that he does, right? Because if you do a hail mary 30 times and you are still the same person...... that should be saying something to you, shouldn't it? Don't stop seeking till you find.... weren't those Jesus's own words? But we don't want to seek we just want to say one prayer and be saved for eternity so we can get right back to watching American Idol.

This is also why I like Buddhism..... even if Buddhism isn't right if you spend enough time in meditation you'll figure that out for yourself anyway, and in the meantime you have an excellent and simple set of rules for eliminating suffering from your daily life. It's very meditation oriented so as to cut out the middle men, the dogmas, and to just experience.


--------------------
I am the MacDaddy of Heimlich County, I play it Straight Up Yo!

....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human......
Om Namah Shivaya, I tell you What!


Edited by leery11 (06/01/06 02:13 PM)


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: leery11]
    #5699830 - 06/01/06 02:18 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Nice post. I agree with a lot of it. :smile:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinefireworks_godS
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: Icelander]
    #5700035 - 06/01/06 03:11 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
And this all says to me that I need to go and find my own thing and have a direct experience. I can check in with all the others but in the end I  need to walk it alone. Then when I come back, if I do, I should keep shut for the most part.




:thumbup:

:earth: :sun: :headbang: :satansmoking:
Peace. :mushroom2:


--------------------
:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you

:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:


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Offlineporcupine
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: Icelander]
    #5700092 - 06/01/06 03:25 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

you seem to have totally misunderstood my thread. im not worried about anything, im not even a buddhist. i was just curious about what buddhists had to say on this question. i found most of the posts in the thread completely off topic and i wasn't gonna say anything because people are free to respond however they want but sometimes i think it would be better if you could simply let things alone and go with the flow.


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: porcupine]
    #5700436 - 06/01/06 04:53 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Did I say you were worried? I took the part of the discussion that interested me and moved it into this new thread.  :confused:

Also your initial questions were answered in that thread and my "off topic" reply was way down the line.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Edited by Icelander (06/01/06 04:57 PM)


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Offlineleery11
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: Icelander]
    #5701026 - 06/01/06 07:30 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
Nice post. I agree with a lot of it. :smile:



it felt strange for me to write.

I went from being anti-religion, to freaking out on drugs and trying to be a Christian, to being anti-religion again.

I mean God is fine I just don't know what in the world "he" is, how to get to him other than meditate or maybe get stoned or do LSA.... and frankly I mean.... I went thorugh the motions of reconnecting to Christianity a lot, they bore some fruit but not really.

I just mainly appreciate Jesus's teachings and consider him to be a wonderful role model.

And am still open.

But yet... if Jesus saves... why are the saved watching American idol and driving cattle off to their deaths in their rusty old trucks? Or supporting the war in Iraq?

The saved don't go around with a bumper sticker saying "I'm saved." because they're far out of those head games, aren't they?

I mean not that Jesus doesn't save. I think he does probably... but it probably takes a lot of hard work on your end too I bet.

I'm not sure at all. If there's a God reading this know that I'm still trying, I just don't know what to do to go about it other than meditate or drugs.
Quote:

porcupine said:
you seem to have totally misunderstood my thread. im not worried about anything, im not even a buddhist. i was just curious about what buddhists had to say on this question. i found most of the posts in the thread completely off topic and i wasn't gonna say anything because people are free to respond however they want but sometimes i think it would be better if you could simply let things alone and go with the flow.



ah i think you made this post in the wrong thread?


--------------------
I am the MacDaddy of Heimlich County, I play it Straight Up Yo!

....I embrace my desire to feel the rhythm, to feel connected enough to step aside and weep like a widow, to feel inspired, to fathom the power, to witness the beauty, to bathe in the fountain, to swing on the spiral of our divinity and still be a human......
Om Namah Shivaya, I tell you What!


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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: leery11]
    #5701066 - 06/01/06 07:40 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

At one time in my life I went through many of the mind gyrations that you are.

My problem was that I had fear of God and damnation deeply programmed into my psyche. It was a hell of a problem and took a lot of shamanic journeys and time to root it out.

With out fear I was free to choose my path. God doesn't concern me now. :thumbup:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: Icelander]
    #5701777 - 06/01/06 10:17 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

With out fear I was free to choose my path

You can't find god if you live in fear.


--------------------
Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future


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Offlinekotik
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: niteowl]
    #5702088 - 06/01/06 11:28 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

what about the fear of god?


--------------------
No statements made in any post or message by myself should be construed to mean that I am now, or have ever been, participating in or considering participation in any activities in violation of any local, state, or federal laws. All posts are works of fiction.


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OfflineTelepylus
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: kotik]
    #5702178 - 06/01/06 11:53 PM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Religions start when somebody witnesses a miracle.
Religions start whenever someone actualizes Proof of God.
True religions are trying to supply Proof & Miracles.
Mostly, they fail. But not always.


--------------------

Law of Love


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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: kotik]
    #5702216 - 06/02/06 12:05 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

kotik said:
what about the fear of god?




Why would you fear god?

How can you be close to something you're afraid of?

I have no fear of god.

The fear of god comes from organized religion.
Trying to scare you into doing what they want you to do, rather than what god wants you to do.

God doesn't want you to fear him


--------------------
Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future


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OfflineTelepylus
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: niteowl]
    #5702361 - 06/02/06 12:30 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

God wants you to obey him.
And he wants you to fear the consequences of disobedience.

God will tell you "FEAR NOT" when he doesn't want you to fear him.

It is tricky to define words sometimes, like fear.
A better word might be RE:spect, to reinspect.

God is Love, and when you have Love(God) in your heart, then you are essentially fearless.

Terms like this often get misconstrued when taken out of context.


--------------------

Law of Love


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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: Telepylus]
    #5702426 - 06/02/06 12:42 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Fear and respect are not the same thing.


--------------------
Live for the moment you are in now
Don't be bogged down by your past
Don't be afraid of what lies in your future


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OfflineTelepylus
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: niteowl]
    #5702507 - 06/02/06 01:08 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

didn't say respect.
RE:spect means "to not turn away"
sorry for your confusion

the fear of God doesn't come from organized religion
it comes from disorganized religion

i'm sure there are a few organized religions you've never even heard of. and they don't endorse fear based consciousness.

likewise, absence of religion often propogates fear based consciousness as well.


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Offlinemr_kite
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: Icelander]
    #5702783 - 06/02/06 02:41 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

I was always under the impression that most religions existed primarily to persecute the Jews...


--------------------
let yourself be silently drawn by the stronger pull of what you really love


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OfflineDeviate
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Re: How do religions start? [Re: Icelander]
    #5702870 - 06/02/06 03:43 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
At one time in my life I went through many of the mind gyrations that you are.

My problem was that I had fear of God and damnation deeply programmed into my psyche. It was a hell of a problem and took a lot of shamanic journeys and time to root it out.

With out fear I was free to choose my path. God doesn't concern me now. :thumbup:




Why would you fear God when Jesus taught that God was a god of love?  if God is just and merciful, what reason could there be to fear him? Did you fear the truth?


Edited by Deviate (06/02/06 03:44 AM)


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