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InvisibleBanez
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Registered: 09/23/05
Posts: 15,181
Pitching Question
    #5694237 - 05/31/06 09:57 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

ok i have no idea how they determine who gets the win, loss, and the save... i thought i had a good idea until

my one pitcher threw 6 innings, 2 hits, 0 er, 5 strikeouts
and the other threw 3 innings, 2 hits, 0 er, 2 strikeouts... and that one got the win...

2 of my 3 runs were scored while the first pitcher was in the game.. it makes no sense to me

and how do they determine what is a save?


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InvisibleOneMoreRobot3021
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Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 61,024
Loc: the sky
Re: Pitching Question [Re: Banez]
    #5694258 - 05/31/06 10:04 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

A pitcher has pitched a full official game when he has gone 5 innings.

If he leaves the game, having pitched at least five innings, with the lead, at that point, he has the win. If his team holds on to their lead and wins the game, that pitcher gets the win. If the team blows the lead he gave them, he gets a no-decision, it is not reflected on his win-loss record.

If he leaves the game, jhaving pitched at least five innings, and the team is losing, at that point he's set for the loss. If the team comes back and wins it, the starting pitcher then gets a no-decision. If the team loses, he gets the loss. If the team ties it up, and then loses anyway, he gets the no-decision, because the loss technically wasnt his fault, someone in the bullpen gave up the winning run later after the team tied it up.

As for saves: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Save_%28baseball_statistics%29

In baseball statistics the term save (abbreviated SV, or sometimes, S) is used to indicate the successful maintenance of a lead by a relief pitcher, usually the closer, until the end of the game. A save is credited to a pitcher who fulfills the following three conditions:

1. The pitcher is the last pitcher in a game won by his team;
2. The pitcher is not the winning pitcher (for instance, if a starting pitcher throws a complete game win or, alternatively, if the pitcher gets a blown save and then his team scores a winning run while he is the pitcher of record, sometimes known as a "vulture win");
3. The pitcher fulfills at least one of the following three conditions:
1. He comes into the game with a lead of no more than three runs, and pitches at least one full inning.
2. He comes into the game with the potential tying run being either on base, at bat, or on deck.
3. He pitches at least three "effective" innings (this is the only subjective criterion and is judged by the official scorer).

If the pitcher surrenders the lead at any point, he cannot get a save, even if his team comes back to win. No more than one save may be credited in each game.

If a relief pitcher satisfies all the criteria for a save, except he does not finish the game, he will often be credited with a hold.

Save rules have changed over the years; the above rules are taken from the Official Baseball Rules 2004.

The save is defined in Section 10.20 of Major League Baseball Official Rules. The statistic was formally introduced in 1969, although research has identified saves earned prior to that point.

A blown save (abbreviated BS) is charged to a pitcher who enters a game in a situation which permits him to earn a save (a 'save situation'), but who instead allows the tying run (and perhaps the go-ahead run) to score. As with any other similar situation, if the pitcher's team does not come back to win the game, said pitcher will be charged with both the loss and a 'blown save.' The blown save is not an officially recognized statistic, but many sources keep track of them. Blown saves have been tracked since 1988. Once a pitcher blows a save, he is no longer eligible to earn a save in that game (since the lead that he was trying to "save" has disappeared), although he can earn a win if his team regains the lead. For this reason, most closers' records include few wins. Closers make the majority of their appearances with their team ahead, so a win usually includes a blown save.

If a pitcher enters a game in a save situation (for a team leading by three runs or less) in an inning which is not the last (e.g. in a regulation 9-inning home game, pitching the top of the 8th), and his team later scores one or more run(s) to extend their lead beyond three runs, then as long as the same pitcher pitches until the end of the game, he is still credited with the save. As the various roles of relief pitchers have changed since the 1960s, closers who often pitch two or more innings have become increasingly rare; although exceptions remain.

A pitcher also cannot create his own save situation. For instance, if he enters the game with a lead too large for a save, he would not make himself eligible for a save by surrendering enough runs to contract the lead to within save range. It must be a save situation when he enters the game, or he will not be able to earn one.


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Acid doesn't give you truths; it builds machines that push the envelope of perception. Whatever revelations came to me then have dissolved like skywriting. All I really know is that those few years saddled me with a faith in the redemptive potential of the imagination which, however flat, stale and unprofitable the world seems to me now, I cannot for the life of me shake.

-Erik Davis


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InvisibleBanez
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Registered: 09/23/05
Posts: 15,181
Re: Pitching Question [Re: OneMoreRobot3021]
    #5694288 - 05/31/06 10:12 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

thanks man.. that clears up a lot for me.. the saves thing especially


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InvisibleOneMoreRobot3021
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Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 61,024
Loc: the sky
Re: Pitching Question [Re: Banez]
    #5694311 - 05/31/06 10:17 AM (17 years, 7 months ago)

No prob Bob.


--------------------
Acid doesn't give you truths; it builds machines that push the envelope of perception. Whatever revelations came to me then have dissolved like skywriting. All I really know is that those few years saddled me with a faith in the redemptive potential of the imagination which, however flat, stale and unprofitable the world seems to me now, I cannot for the life of me shake.

-Erik Davis


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