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internet2 piracy
    #4990104 -

this was posted on my school website:

(I decided to post here, because I am interested in discussing the legal aspect of this, as well as the social impact. plus the pub totally sucks)

Ivy League Institutions Slapped for Piracy

Based on a journal article by EBBS Course Director Kim Craft. Christine Baker contributed to this article.

On April 13, 2005, the Recording Industry Association of America (RIAA) announced that it would sue 405 university students at 18 major universities. A little over a month later, on May 26, the RIAA announced it would sue 91 additional individuals from 20 colleges and universities.

The normally more placid Motion Picture Association of America [MPAA] announced in August that it too was suing these same defendants.

The offense? The students were accused of using Internet2, the next generation of high-speed networking, for copyright infringement.

The super high-speed technology is currently unavailable to the public, but is in use by universities and research institutions (schools like MIT, Carnegie Mellon, Harvard and UC Berkeley), and will ultimately be available to the rest of the world ? possibly within the next two years, according to Kim Craft, Full Sail?s Intellectual Property Course Director.

Internet2, or I2, is capable of averaging networking speeds of 655 megabits per second, and researchers are continually trying to set new speed records. Researchers recently used the I2 to send data from Switzerland to Tokyo at a rate of 7.21 gigabits per second ? fast enough to download a full-length DVD in seconds and an MP3 in a fraction of a second.

The film industry, which up until this time has not been so concerned about illegal file sharing because of the time-prohibitive nature of downloading a feature film, is now taking notice. Realizing that the entire contents of a local Blockbuster video store can become available to an I2 user in less time than it currently takes to download a single DVD, the Motion Picture Association of America (MPAA) announced on August 9 that it would file suit against Internet2 users.

According to the Internet2?s website, I2 is a consortium led by 207 universities working in partnership with government and industry (Comcast, Intel, Sun Microsystems, and Cisco Systems) and was created with very lofty goals in mind.

?The goal was, [for example, to] have surgeons in one place communicating or consulting with a surgery over the Internet with somebody in a foreign country, [or] astronomers from around the world tapping into an observatory with this technology,? explained Craft.

?[Or] we could [download] the entire contents of a university library ? just incredible goals. And yet the students and the researchers who are supposed to be developing this are sitting around at their desks with this awesome technology illegally downloading music and movies.?

Not to say the I2 technology will not be used in the many fantastic ways anticipated, said Craft. The University of Pennsylvania, for example, has linked an electron microscope to the Web, allowing for virtual microscopy. They are also creating an electronic archive of digital mammograms, which will enable the spread of high-tech medical specialization around the world.

To the RIAA and the MPAA however, I2 is a new threat on the horizon.

According to the Washington Times, Internet2 researchers demonstrated the ability to download a DVD-quality copy of The Matrix in 30 seconds over their network, something that would typically take 25 hours over the Internet. Even under ordinary circumstances, I2 users can typically download a DVD in just under five minutes, as opposed to well over an hour for the same broadband Internet download.

Quality is also noticeably better: the DVD-like resolution of Internet2 creates a clarity and immediacy not ordinarily seen with choppy streaming video, and audio quality is also at a level better than most CDs.

?This is what is making the motion picture industry freak out because their [position] used to be ?Well, nobody?s going to really download movies because they take forever, and they?re hard to do, and the quality?s bad,'? said Craft. ?Well, not anymore. With this tech, pick a movie ? it?s as easy to download as a song.?

Cary Sherman, the current RIAA president, stated, ?This next generation of the Internet is an extraordinarily exciting tool for researchers, technologists and many others with valuable legitimate uses. Yet we cannot let this high-speed network become a zone of lawlessness where the normal rules don?t apply.?

In an interesting move last week, the MPAA announced it had struck a deal with Bram Cohen, the software developer behind BitTorrent.

According to an article on Forbes.com, BitTorrent.com will remove links to pirated material and could become a movie version of legal peer-to-peer music sites like Apple's iTunes music service.

Craft suggested the MPAA wants to ?get [people] used to the idea of paying for it now so that when this new technology hits the mainstream it might mitigate the blow.?

At this point, added Craft, the deal seems to be one of the only positive solutions the MPAA has been able to come up with to combat a possible serious threat to the movie studios? future bottom lines.


--------------------
No statements made in any post or message by myself should be construed to mean that I am now, or have ever been, participating in or considering participation in any activities in violation of any local, state, or federal laws. All posts are works of fiction.

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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: kotik]
    #4990229 -

I'd probably go to the theaters instead of downloading movies if they didn't charge out of the ass for everything and if hollywood started putting out quality movies instead of the 5 new shitty ones a week.


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"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks

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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: barfightlard]
    #4990475 -

bellylard said:
I'd probably go to the theaters instead of downloading movies if they didn't charge out of the ass for everything
So, it's alright for you to steal a car because you think the price is too high
and if hollywood started putting out quality movies instead of the 5 new shitty ones a week.
Then why would you want to steal shitty movies. Isn't that like robbing the turds in a porta-potty?



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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: zappaisgod]
    #4990553 -

Quote:
So, it's alright for you to steal a car because you think the price is too high


I don't think you can compare grand theft with downloading an electronic copy of a movie that you would never pay to see in the first place.

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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: Catalysis]
    #4990689 -

So, since you would probably never buy a Bentley it's OK for you to steal one? Grand theft, petty theft, what's the diff? They are both theft.


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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: zappaisgod]
    #4990925 -

No, they aren't the same.

If I were to go steal a Bentley, I am actually depriving someone of something material. It cost money and materials to produce that specific Bentley - if I then go and steal it, I am depriving someone of that money/material.

On the other hand, it costs zero money and no materials (aside from the initial investment in technology) for me or anyone else to digitally copy a movie/song/program/whatever. I have not deprived the company of anything material - anything that would cost them money.

What we're talking about when it comes to internet "piracy" is not actual theft so much as a loss of potential profit. By downloading a movie I am not taking anything from the film studio, but I may be preventing them from making a few more dollars on their product. It would have the exact same effect on the company if I just never saw the movie at all.


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: trendal]
    #4991009 -

"By downloading a movie I am not taking anything from the film studio, but I may be preventing them from making a few more dollars on their product."

There is not a court anywhere that has bought into the idea that this is anything but theft. Again, you said "preventing them from making a few more dollars". How about if the Bentley went unsold for several years. The Bentley company was going to destroy it. Do you have the right to save it from destruction? Liberate it, as it were. No, you do not. The fantasist notion that copyright pirates have of their ineffectuality is absurd. Billions are lost every year to crooks. Most of them don't even bother with this foolishness. Most of them know they're crooks. Own your inner bandithood. Just don't bother with this nonsensical argument that they wouldn't have made the money anyway. That is simply not for you to decide.


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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: zappaisgod]
    #4991039 -

zappaisgod said:
bellylard said:
I'd probably go to the theaters instead of downloading movies if they didn't charge out of the ass for everything
So, it's alright for you to steal a car because you think the price is too high
and if hollywood started putting out quality movies instead of the 5 new shitty ones a week.
Then why would you want to steal shitty movies. Isn't that like robbing the turds in a porta-potty?




lol, nice comparison!

I don't download every movie, I used to get alot of them, but after seeing so much garbage I stopped and only got certain ones that looked interesting, and even most of those suck. So I'd rather spend a couple hours downloading shit then spending $10 to see shit.

I'm sorry movie companies that I stopped paying to see your hack job films, now theres maybe $35 less a year you would be potentially making out of your billions, I'm ashamed.


--------------------

"What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks

Edited by bellylard (11/28/05 08:11 PM)

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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: trendal]
    #4991045 -

Thats a good point. I am not advocating theft in any form but I think there are important distinctions to be made.

I think it is a gross abuse of the legal system to sue kids under a law which is mostly intended to prevent the copying and redistribution of media for profit. IMO we need better laws governing digital content to focus more on those who leak and crack the content rather than those who download or participate in p2p.

Even then, the monetary damages are hard to justify considering that the distributors did not make any money from it and the laws are partially based on the recovery of money that was illegitimately made on your copyrighted material. Right now, the RIAA and MPAA are trying to turn a profit on internet copyright lawsuits and I think it needs to be stopped immediately.

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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: zappaisgod]
    #4991120 -

There is not a court anywhere that has bought into the idea that this is anything but theft.

It's a sad fact that the bulk of people over 40 have no real concept of what digital information is, how it works, or what it costs to duplicate (nothing). The number of people who do understand digital concepts probably decreases quite rapidly each 10 years after 40.

With that in mind, it doesn't surprise me one bit that a bunch of judges wouldn't understand the difference between digital copying and material theft.

Also, you may not be aware of the situation here in Canada, but the courts here denied the MPAA and RIAA from suing Canadians over copyright infringement. In Canada there is a law stating that anyone can make LEGAL "backup" copies of their digital media and the courts have, for now, extended this to all copies of digital media.

As long as you don't sell your copy, you haven't broken a law (in Canada).

How about if the Bentley went unsold for several years. The Bentley company was going to destroy it. Do you have the right to save it from destruction? Liberate it, as it were.

That depends. If they keep it on their property then I have no right to tresspass on their property to, uh, "liberate" the car.

Say they toss it in a dump somewhere, then I happen to go to the dump looking for spare parts and find a nice working Bentley. Can I have it, then? (minus the cost of removing it from the dump, of course)

At any rate, the point is moot. As I already pointed out, stealing (or "liberating") a Bentley involves something that is an actual material - while digital "piracy" does not.

Billions are lost every year to crooks.

Please explain how my downloading a movie from the internet costs the film studio any money.

Just don't bother with this nonsensical argument that they wouldn't have made the money anyway. That is simply not for you to decide.

Actually, it is for me to decide - as a consumer. If I decide not to go see their movie in a theatre, or buy it on DVD when it comes out, then I have prevented them from making some money and yes it was my choice to do so.


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: trendal]
    #4991903 -

Intersting issue. I'd be interested to learn exactly how the MPAA comes up with its figures for measuring monetary losses.

Good movies (which are few and far between) I will pay to see in theatres, regardless of whether I can get them for free. There is an experience of going to the theatre with friends that cannot be duplicated. The MPAA won't lose my money here.

Then there's the $4 blockbuster fee. Again, I see it as $4. I will gladly pay this to see a movie. Since there are few movies I like enough to watch twice (much less I'd like to own), I will pay the extra money to own a "real" copy. All in all, the MPAA wouldn't lose much money on me because as someone pointed out earlier; I wouldn't have paid to see the movie anyway.

But make no mistake, it is theft. If I hack into your bank account and drain the money, nothing material has been taken. The same with identitiy theft. I may steal an idea for a superb invention. In these cases, theft is theft. In the modern, digital age there will be more emphasis on the stealing of non-material things. And someone mentioned backups. I believe you need to own an original to be allowed a "backup".


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...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge.  It is an indellible experience; it is forever known.  I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did.

Smith, P.  Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27.

...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely.

Osmond, H.  Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436

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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: badchad]
    #4992018 -

But make no mistake, it is theft. If I hack into your bank account and drain the money, nothing material has been taken.

Yes, something material HAS been taken, because each and every dollar in my bank account represents an actual material dollar.

PLUS, you have hacked into my bank account which on its own is illegal and can be considered much the same as trespassing.

If I were to hack into Disney's computers and download their latest movie, that would be illegal and rightly so - I have trespassed on their property.

If I download a DVD that someone ripped and willingly uploaded to the internet....that is something else entirely. I haven't hacked (trespassed) into anyone's computer. I haven't taken anything material OR anything which directly represents an actual material.

In addition, the copy that I am viewing was paid for - Disney got money for it. So if they've got their money from the copy they sold and I'm not hacking into anywhere to get it........how is it stealing?


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: badchad]
    #4992055 -

Quote:
If I hack into your bank account and drain the money, nothing material has been taken. The same with identitiy theft.


both of these scenarios cause direct harm to an individual person. They are taking away actual money from someone. Only one person can remove money from a bank account before its not there for the next person. And only one person can have a certain identity. With a movie, not only is it just an arrangement of 0s and 1s, but once copied, the original is left unaffected.

I think the south park episode explained it best, with the "save a popstar" campaign, with cats from metallica crying about waiting 3 extra days to pour the cement for their new pool because of piracy.

The real question is which should yield for the greater good of everyone? The freedom to send / receive information at unlimited capacity, or the protection of hollywood movies and recording artists.

I would argue that REAL artists are not in it for the money, despite all the propaganda.


--------------------
No statements made in any post or message by myself should be construed to mean that I am now, or have ever been, participating in or considering participation in any activities in violation of any local, state, or federal laws. All posts are works of fiction.

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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: kotik]
    #4992154 -

Soon, we can all download porn at lightening speeds! :penis:

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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: Le_Canard]
    #4992377 -

With Internet2, im totally gonna bust a nut before my pr0n is even finished downloading

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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: Catalysis]
    #4992387 -

No, silly, it doesn't make you come faster....it makes the porn come faster :grin:


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Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.

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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: zappaisgod]
    #4992421 -

zappaisgod said:
"By downloading a movie I am not taking anything from the film studio, but I may be preventing them from making a few more dollars on their product."

There is not a court anywhere that has bought into the idea that this is anything but theft. Again, you said "preventing them from making a few more dollars". How about if the Bentley went unsold for several years. The Bentley company was going to destroy it. Do you have the right to save it from destruction? Liberate it, as it were. No, you do not. The fantasist notion that copyright pirates have of their ineffectuality is absurd. Billions are lost every year to crooks. Most of them don't even bother with this foolishness. Most of them know they're crooks. Own your inner bandithood. Just don't bother with this nonsensical argument that they wouldn't have made the money anyway. That is simply not for you to decide.


Zappa, you have THE worst points, rebuttals, and comebacks I've EVER heard (today).

Why the fuck would Bently destroy a car if its not sold, and how does that have any significance to this? Movie companies dont destroy movies that no one buys either... they put them in a buy one get one free package.


I, myself, am a proud Net Pirate. Scallywag, if you must.

I think that with the age of information that we're going into, where everything is digital, and everyone has fast connection, which will just get faster and faster, theres nothing that they can do to stop illegal filesharing. Its impossible. All they can do is go down kicking and screaming, as you can now witness.


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that there, thats not me. :noway:
i go where i please. :yesnod:
im not here.:shake:
this isnt happening.:nonono:

Edited by plexus (11/29/05 01:22 AM)

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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: plexus]
    #4993055 -

^^^^^The man's gotta point. Eventually distribution will not be the way movie and music companies make money. They will have to make money by presenting a quality product in the mind of their customers. Not by bludgoning the comsumer to death by exposure. Distributors and retailers have been making hand over fist for decades and getting a ridiculous cut of an artists' work. Time has come artists will get a larger cut from their work and will have to work for it. It will be less in comparison as it has been recently (the past 50-75 years) but will turn out more quality products in the end. Musicians will make money puttng on live performances, not recording music. The art will be better for it and I don't care one bit if the industry ends up in shambles at the hands of thieves. Unfair, yes. Thats life. Thats evolution.


Downloading a movie is theft. I'm a theif, come get me...come get us all....They can sue 40 50 100 people a week and they won't scratch the surface.


Say goodbye to radio(hello WiFi), say goodbye to blockbuster, say goodbye to Sony music...good riddance


--------------------
"And we, inhabitants of the great coral of the Cosmos, believe the atom (which still we cannot see) to be full matter, whereas, it too, like everything else, is but an embroidery of voids in the Void, and we give the name of being, dense and even eternal, to that dance of inconsistencies, that infinite extension that is identified with absolute Nothingness and that spins from its own non-being the illusion of everything."

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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: DirtMcgirt]
    #4993057 -

Quote:
Musicians will make money puttng on live performances, not recording music.


That is already fact - today.

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Re: internet2 piracy [Re: Vvellum]
    #4993065 -

good point.


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"And we, inhabitants of the great coral of the Cosmos, believe the atom (which still we cannot see) to be full matter, whereas, it too, like everything else, is but an embroidery of voids in the Void, and we give the name of being, dense and even eternal, to that dance of inconsistencies, that infinite extension that is identified with absolute Nothingness and that spins from its own non-being the illusion of everything."

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