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InvisibleDragonaut
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Registered: 06/24/04
Posts: 5,832
Loc: Burn Ward
What a surprise...
    #4346564 - 06/28/05 01:36 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I hope I don't get banned for this or anything silly like that.

I thought the Shroomery was a place where you could freely and openly debate issues regarding the site, but I guess not. It seems like once a decision is made by an Admin/Mod, that's final. And if they don't like what you have to say about it, they won't hear it and they'll just lock the thread. It's obvious they think they're the only ones who know what's best. Don't they care what we think of the site? Is it here for everyone, or just them?

This is in regards to the locking of the "Thread Rating" thread. I don't want to start another thread to discuss the issue of that particular feature's removal, but I do have something to say about the way that thread(and others) are handled by the Admin and Mods.

Please stop turning your back on the Shroomerites! If we have something to say, please take the time to listen and understand where we are coming from and what we have to say and why. Don't go locking threads left and right. Just because you run the site doesn't make what you are doing right. It's going to piss alot of people off and ruin the atmosphere of the site.

Also, this forum is here for a reason: When a change has been made to the Shroomery, or going to be made... it is announced here. That wasn't done in the case of removing the thread rating feature. Sure, it took a little while for a post to be made noticing it's removal. But I can tell you I noticed it right away when I wanted to use it to check out which grow logs were good. And I know I'm not the only one who noticed(and regrets) that it was removed.

Maybe it wasn't a feature that was used much. Maybe that's because its use wasn't promoted enough. Mabey that's the Admin/Mod's fault for not promoting it. Maybe they should have taken another action instead of removing it from the boards without letting anyone know, and without asking for feedback.

...Sorry, that was starting to go a little off subject there. Anyways...

In conclusion, I just want to say that for the most part I appreciate and respect the work of the Admin and Mods. However, it's instances like this where I'm left feeling like you guys just don't care sometimes. That's crap. That needs to change. WA&F is here for a reason.


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OfflineInfrared
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Re: What a surprise... [Re: Dragonaut]
    #4346590 - 06/28/05 01:46 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

thread ratings were dumb anyways.... good move imo


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: What a surprise... [Re: Dragonaut]
    #4346597 - 06/28/05 01:48 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I wouldn't worry about being banned for THIS thread.

Yeah, this forum is here for a reason, but IME, people will keep complaining and arguing well after the Admin have said their piece. Sometimes a thread will be locked to move things along in here, and give new people a chance to bitch about new things. :wink:

Not enough people used thread ratings. One, one-shroom rate could impact most any thread negatively, and more people were rating threads with 1 shroom than with 5. That is not representative of this community as a whole. It only represented the 3 or 4 shroomerites who  used the feature.

Besides, and LISTEN WELL TO THIS NEXT PART... Thread ratings had been gone for A WEEK before anybody even noticed, and/or complained... so it can't be a HUGE issue. Anything Shroomery related that goes on a week before someone complains, can't be too big a deal. :smirk:


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InvisibleDragonaut
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Registered: 06/24/04
Posts: 5,832
Loc: Burn Ward
Re: What a surprise... [Re: Rose]
    #4346618 - 06/28/05 02:00 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Again, no announcement was made about the change. The change was noticed, so I'm sorry no one brought it up in what you consider to be a timely manner. But maybe that is a direct result of not announcing the change in the first place. Is the general feeling here that it didn't need to be announced? WHY? Isn't that what this forum is for???

You guys dropped the ball and took something away that didn't need to be taken. Couldn't you have just deleted those bad/abusive ratings instead of wiping out the feature entirely?

Anyways, this thread wasn't started to discuss that feature's removal. This thread was started to bring attention to the abuse of power that is going on with the Shroomery Mods and Administration.

This is feedback, but is anyone listening?


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: What a surprise... [Re: Dragonaut]
    #4346628 - 06/28/05 02:05 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

If you are being ignored, why have all your questons been answered already in this, and the other thread?

Besides, I think a couple Admins are out of town this week, so the Administrative response may be less than usual... but that is because they AREN'T HERE... not because they hate you.

To be fair, the tone of the other thread was pretty sour... this thread has kept a better tone... although you have yet to show an abuse of power (like you claim) by the Mods and the Admin.

I, as a Mod, have as many rights in this forum as you do... NO MORE. No Mod removed the feature. No Mod could lock the thread in question. The Admins lock the threads in THIS forum. The Admins removed the thread ratings.

Mods weren't consulted either.


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InvisibleDragonaut
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Re: What a surprise... [Re: Dragonaut]
    #4346647 - 06/28/05 02:10 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

It's just the attitude of some of you guys that I, as well as others, have an issue with.

It's like:
"Oh he's saying something I don't want to hear. He's pressuring me to think before I take actions...Thread closed. Issue resolved."

Well, the thread may have been closed, but the issue never got resolved. The door got slammed in my face, that's what happened.

I just feel that it was a disrespectful and unprofessional way of handling a situation like that, and I hope it changes and doesn't catch on. Think before you lock threads people. Also, think before you make decisions that affect the site and it's users. We'll try to think before we post and rate.


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Edited by WI_Shroomer_Skater (06/28/05 02:14 PM)


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: What a surprise... [Re: Dragonaut]
    #4346656 - 06/28/05 02:15 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Well, when you accuse Mods AND Admins of abusing power... because a thread in THIS Forum was closed by an Admin... and a feature was taken away by the Admin... I, as a Mod, don't appreciate being lumped into THAT group.

Mods had nothing to do with it... and Admins didn't get a complaint for a WEEK.

This is a non-issue.

If you found a Mod or Admin actually ABUSING their power, and made a post in here, it WOULD be looked into... and Mods AND Admins have been reprimanded because of such threads... bans have been lifted, and threads have been unlocked.

However, in this case, you are just making a mountain out of a mole hill.

Abuse of power by the Admins? It is THEIR website! And they let YOU complain!

What more do you want?


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InvisibleDragonaut
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Registered: 06/24/04
Posts: 5,832
Loc: Burn Ward
Re: What a surprise... [Re: Rose]
    #4346670 - 06/28/05 02:23 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Cervantes said:
If you are being ignored, why have all your questons been answered already in this, and the other thread?





They havent been answered, really. Not all of them.

Quote:


Besides, I think a couple Admins are out of town this week, so the Administrative response may be less than usual... but that is because they AREN'T HERE... not because they hate you.





That's understandable if they're out of town. I can wait.

Quote:


To be fair, the tone of the other thread was pretty sour... this thread has kept a better tone... although you have yet to show an abuse of power (like you claim) by the Mods and the Admin.





Locking threads for a bogus reason isn't an abuse of power?

Quote:


I, as a Mod, have as many rights in this forum as you do... NO MORE. No Mod removed the feature. No Mod could lock the thread in question. The Admins lock the threads in THIS forum. The Admins removed the thread ratings.

Mods weren't consulted either.




This I did not know. I apologise to the Mods for dragging them into this.


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: What a surprise... [Re: Rose]
    #4346679 - 06/28/05 02:29 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Dude, trust me, I am the first to fight behind the scenes, when the Admins change something BIG w/o consulting us, or the public.

In THIS case, it is just a feature nobody but a select few used.

If you are patient, I guarantee you will find a better fight to fight than THIS one. :wink:

This one's pretty futile, and like I said, a couple Admins are on vacation... so you may have a long wait for further response.

But threads in this forum get locked a LOT. Mainly because once the situation is explained FULLY by the Admins, they don't wish the argument to continue.

Search this forum for locked threads, and you'll see what I mean.

Besides, now EVERYBODY must leave a REASON for a locked thread. Thor left a reason for his locked thread, and it was within the Shroomery requirements for locking a thread. Plus, it is Thor's Website. He is an Admin. He can write his own rules.


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InvisibleDragonaut
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Registered: 06/24/04
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Re: What a surprise... [Re: Dragonaut]
    #4346719 - 06/28/05 02:43 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Again, I understand why the thread rating system was removed. The reason given was than no one used it, and a select few even abused it. That is not an issue. The issue, which should still be up for debate in the other thread, is that no one said anything about it being removed. No one asked for user feedback. No one said, "Hey Shroomerites, this is the deal: We have a problem with the way the thread rating system is being used. What do you guys think? Should we leave it, for those that actually find it useful? Should we trash the feature? Or should we take steps to improve it's functionality?"

The reason Thor gave for locking the thread: "Issue resolved." That is not true. The locking of that thread was unwarranted and I consider it to be an abuse of power. It was a disrespectful action that he used to end a conversation that he didn't want to hear, about something he didn't want to undo, because he doesn't care what people think. Well, he should be hearing it because that's what this forum is for. The post should be unlocked. I'm going to start a poll to see what people really think.

Maybe I'm making a mountain out of a mole hill...next time use discretion when locking threads, maybe I wont bitch so much. That goes for everyone.


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InvisibleStonerguy
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Re: What a surprise... [Re: Dragonaut]
    #4346771 - 06/28/05 02:54 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

This isn't a democracy,  they have all the power.  Although our input can put things in motion they have the final say in everything.  If you can't handle things like this sorry.  When they lock the threads it is when they feel like the topic has had enough debate.  Smart move though,  alot of people just rated the threads with 1 just to do it.  I agree that they should inform us of MAJOR changes, but this thing isn't worthy of even a thread.

My new thread rating  :thumbdown:.


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OfflineAnnoA
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Re: What a surprise... [Re: Dragonaut]
    #4346777 - 06/28/05 02:55 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

>Maybe I'm making a mountain out of a mole hill

Absolutely.

>The locking of that thread was unwarranted and I consider it to be an abuse of power.

You seem to not distinguish abuse from USE.
Thor used his ability and right to close a thread that has run its course in a forum he moderates. There is nothing abusive here.

Please find something constructive to do, here, www.shroomery.org/wiki is always waiting for constructive contributions.


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InvisibleDragonaut
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Registered: 06/24/04
Posts: 5,832
Loc: Burn Ward
Re: What a surprise... [Re: Anno]
    #4346802 - 06/28/05 03:03 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

So, if I continue to speak out about people locking threads, and how I wish the Thread Rating system would be re-instated, should I have to worry about this thread being locked? Should I worry that because I'm speaking my mind that I might be banned? I hope not, but I do worry. This is the way things seem to go in a case like this.

I'm not complaining just to complain. I'm merely giving feedback and making suggestions that I feel would make the site better. I hope someone respects that and is willing to listen to those and other opinions.


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: What a surprise... [Re: Dragonaut]
    #4346819 - 06/28/05 03:11 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

That is the second time in THIS thread where you have acted like you THINK you will be banned for making THIS thread.

Paranoia much?

This IS the Feedback Forum and you are giving feedback, you don't get more ON TOPIC than THAT.

The only thing you risk is putting your foot in your mouth... since this isn't a BIG issue, it would be a shame if you went balistic over it. So far though, so good...

Although if you have not had all your concerns addressed by now, could you please summarize what you STILL need to have addressed?

Your logic is becoming circular... it seems all your points have been made (at least twice). What have we missed? You may not like your answer, but your issues have been addressed.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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InvisibleDragonaut
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Re: What a surprise... [Re: Stonerguy]
    #4346820 - 06/28/05 03:11 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I find that to be kind of rediculous. I know its they're site, they own it, and that it's not a Democracy and all that. But because of that it seems like kind of a joke that the shroomery is promoted as this "community" where you can speak freely and where the Admins and Mods care about the quality of the site and what users think. Go ahead and lock WA&F if you're not going to listen, that's what I think they should do. Otherwise have an open mind, inform users of changes, and take their feedback into consideration. Some are just too trigger-happy when it comes to locking threads.


--------------------
:dragon: See all my Favorite Threads (lots of info)

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InvisibleDragonaut
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Re: What a surprise... [Re: Rose]
    #4346840 - 06/28/05 03:19 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Okay, the reason why I am paranoid about this thread being locked, and me possibly being banned: I see it happen to people on here all the time. Thor was so quick to lock the other thread. I'm surprised that hasn't happened to this thread.

I know that some people don't consider it to be a big issue. But I feel it is. I feel that locking threads without a good reason is an abuse of power. That's what hasn't been adressed in this thread. And I can't even say what was unresolved in the other thread because it was locked. Unlock it. If it wasn't locked so hastily by Thor, this thread and this issue might have never even come up, but I'm glad it did.

My logic isn't circular, although it may appear that way to those who aren't paying close attention to what I'm saying.


--------------------
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OfflineRoseM
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Re: What a surprise... [Re: Dragonaut]
    #4346860 - 06/28/05 03:28 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

I'm just going out on a limb but, comments like this:

Quote:

WI said in the locked thread:

I suppose it's because the Admin's/mods are too lazy or inconsiderate to do anything about it.





... THAT is part of the reason why the thread was locked.

Your issues were addressed, yet you made and CONTINUED to make rude AND false statements about the Admins/Mods/Staff... as a WHOLE. And you made those comments in THIS forum.

This is not a good way to have a constructive discussion with our Admins, WI.

Besides, comments like THAT show how little you ACTUALLY understand how the Shroomery Staff works.

We have gone OUT OF OUR WAY to answer your concerns, and STILL you were RUDE. You lumped ALL THE MODS AND ADMINS into a group, and blamed us all. IN BOTH THREADS!

Let me tell you WI, that isn't smart... especially in the Administrator's Forum. The reason should be self-explanitory.

I guarantee you, we Mods and Admins take A LOT OF FLACK FOR DOING OUR JOBS. If you wish to stand on a soapbox and TAINT ALL OF OUR NAMES for FALSE REASONS, at the VERY LEAST, your thread should be locked.

No wonder you are afraid of being banned!

There are enough Shroomerites who disrespect authority. Thread ratings is not worth an uprising... but you FLAMED THE STAFF... in TWO THREADS, then you complained about ONE FLAME THREAD BEING LOCKED.

If the Admins weren't SOOO FUCKING NICE, and PATIENT, and dare I say HELPFUL... you would have been banned for some of the FLAMES you have made. You CAME INTO THE WA&F Forum, and FLAMED THE ENTIRE STAFF... MORE THAN ONCE!

Is that smart?

Is that helpful?

Then, when a thread was locked, due in great part to your flaming, you started THIS thread and FLAMED THE WHOLE STAFF AGAIN!

That is NOT smart.

You are lucky you weren't warned and/or banned, but like I said, our Admins are NICE and PATIENT... and they want to give you a chance to say your piece... but DUDE, you could choose your words better... MUCH BETTER.

And WHY did you FLAME the STAFF? You just learned Mods had NOTHING to do with either of your complaints, but we were lumped into your flames, BEFORE YOU EVEN KNEW WHAT THE FUCK YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT. Heh.

Are you upset because thread ratings were removed a week ago, and you NEVER NOTICED until someone else made a thread about it? :wink:

Give me a break WI...

Let this one go.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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InvisibleStonerguy
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Re: What a surprise... [Re: Dragonaut]
    #4346867 - 06/28/05 03:30 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Quote:
Then why, instead of removing the feature from the website, didn't the Administration make a sticky or something encouraging people to properly use the rating system and not abuse it? Was there even an announcement from the Administration about removing the rating system? If there was, I missed it.

And yes, it is the Administration's website, so for the most part these type of decisions are up to them...but this is supposed to be a "community" not a dictatorship.


I take that personally, this group of admins is one of the most active I've ever seen in any website. We are constantly updating and adding features to this website which take great effort and committment.

We can't take a poll for every little decision, the vote on it was done by the masses, we gave it 1 year and it was consistantly not used so an announcement wouldn't have done much of anything.

In fact it took almost 5 days before the first post was made noticing it was gone, that speaks volumes on a busy site like this.

Quote:
I guess all decisions are final at the Shroomery. I suppose it's because the Admin's/mods are too lazy or inconsiderate to do anything about it.


Thats just a ridiculous statement, first of all if we were lazy why have the admins added at least 40-50 modified features to this board software? All the added features on this were worked on by very dedicated guys who work very hard to add cool features that were not part of the software, which is honestly bare bones without their add ons.

Its unfortunate that some people choose to be insulting and rude when we have done so much for this community and given them soooooo many cool features that no other community would bother with.

All that and we do it inspite of comments like this which certainly no one enjoys.

We have constantly strived to improve this board and much of our ideas come from the community via suggestions.

However not every small decision will have a community say, in fact in order to keep things running smoothly we have to make decisions we feel are in the best interest of the website.

I again remind you that of our 'active' user base of roughly 2000 users in the last month posting, ONLY 2% or less rated a thread, and of that 2% just over half were 1 shroom ratings done by only a few users

Because of this we can safely say that:

#1. This is a very unpopular feature
#2. Because of the low use rate, its incredibly easy for 1 or 2 users to mess up ratings.
#3. Less than 2% of our membership used this feature, I say again for effect, and this is after having it around for well over 1 year.

Not every decision we make is going to be 100% liked by everyone, but you have to accept it because there is very few who care about this feature and even fewer who used it.




He answered why they took it away, he felt like since he explained his reasoning for it it was a closed matter.

And remember
Quote:

Not every decision we make is going to be 100% liked by everyone, but you have to accept it because there is very few who care about this feature and even fewer who used it.




--------------------
yawn...
SG


Edited by Stonerguy (06/28/05 03:30 PM)


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InvisibleThorA
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Re: What a surprise... [Re: Dragonaut]
    #4347176 - 06/28/05 04:57 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

We make a lot of minor changes weekly to this website which affect its usability and functionality. Like I said minor things are constantly done without any input because if we went public with every little issue this place would move at a snails pace.

You are one of the few who care and are making this into an issue which simply isnt one. The people of this community vote by their use of the function, and you are simply one of the few who cares.

I was the admins who helped bring us trade/user/thread ratings by initiating the idea to help us create a system of trade accountability and of course so users could rate each other.

I wished the trade rating would work, it was given well over a year to become something that would work but by overwhelming fact it did not.

You were very rude in the original thread and that was a big reason why it was closed, mind you this decision is not going to be reversed as its about as universal of a decision as I've seen.

We always have people complain about changes, because there is always a few who might not agree but this is a CLEAR case of the vast majority not caring about this feature.

Issue is closed.


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InvisibleThorA
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Re: What a surprise... [Re: Dragonaut]
    #4347180 - 06/28/05 04:58 PM (11 years, 5 months ago)

This thread has been closed.

Reason:
Issue is closed for discussion.


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