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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Mushroom Cultivation
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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: ReverendMyc] * 2
    #28726329 -

I'm glad my observation paid off.

Thanks for checking it out, Rev!

I also noticed that when I left bisporus mycelium in vitro in an all-in-one bag, it started producing a lot of metabolites.  The bag went on to fruit fine, so I don't believe this was bacteria but normal enzyme activity.

The enzymes glowed under a black light.

I'll do up some grain jars once I get some LC going and run some bioassays anyway.  I'm curious what the trip is like with bisporus grains.


--------------------
And if I only could
I'd make a deal with God
And I'd get him to swap our places
I'd be running up that road
Be running up that hill
With no problems

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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: tree frog] * 6
    #28732374 -

Ignoring that little dip in the curve around day 100 (which is a well-expected non-outlier error in measurement),
a close fit for the data points so far is something like this :


Extrapolating the curve to 1 year, predicts around 14 mg/g alkaloid content.
Assuming that value as a final concentration, we can easily see that %80 of that alk. conc. is available right after the first 4 months.

so we can happily and efficiently extract the grains after 3 to 4 months and not wait longer for little potency gains afterwards.
or one can wait longer and milk that last percentages as well if he/she doesn't need to trip right away. nothing to lose, but little more added gain.

nice experiments so far.
should even the measurements be all off (whether containing noise and random errors, or all biased toward higher or lower values due to tools inaccuracies)
still the clear pattern is visible and there's close to ZERO chance that the graph carries erroneous data regarding the curve shape.
this means we can be absolutely sure the alkaloids concentration follows a logarithmic function.

for the preset samples and measurements so far something like AC = 3.41768 x ln(0.153677 x ND)
where AC is the alkaloid concentration in mg/g and ND is the number of days after inoculation and ln is natural logarithm.
future data points will of course change this predictor function, but the changes will be very subtle. :thumbup:


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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: psilocybist] * 7
    #28733897 -


36hrs or so, after final shake. Temp mid to high 60s
Agar wedge drop First week of January.

The bluest mycelium I've ever had, next best probably Azzy . But my first time running semps.

Much bluer in person.

Edited by LewDoja (04/11/24 04:55 PM)

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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: LewDoja] * 1
    #28741055 -

Thanks for this thread. I ran a test on a jar of P. Natalensis rye spawn that had been going for 21 days.



This looks like ~7mg/g to me.

Am I off base thinking spawning to bulk is a waste of effort? Mushies are nice, but the grain spawn seems like it'd do the trick in and of itself.

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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: notthatsorry] * 1
    #28757943 -

Great thread! Thank you for sharing.


--------------------
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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: Bra] * 1
    #28759872 -

Interesting experiment, thanks for sharing!


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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: MycCycle]
    #28795403 -

Help me Rev! 😩😩😩

Man I thought I had this shit in the bag.  Thought my techniques were legit.  Thought I was a Tc like you, turns out maybe Im just a garbage grower. 

the orange lids are the older set from march now over two months old.  they started lookin wet at the bottom a couple weeks ago then i noticed the dark spots on the bottom.

now the green lids (from april) are startin to get that wet-ish look towards the bottom. 

Am I garbage? Is this normal?  I feel like i should toss the orange lid ones and maybe just spawn the green lids.  I feel like such a failure and I was so excited to try this out.

thanks in advance rev. 



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Edited by BeefExtreme (05/31/24 07:15 PM)

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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: BeefExtreme]
    #28795484 -

If those are semperviva I think they’re ok. Mine always get orange/brown


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LAGM2020

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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: A.k.a]
    #28795486 -

really?!?!? *sniff*

even the brown spots on the bottom of the jar???? god, why are semps so gross?


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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: BeefExtreme] * 1
    #28795552 -

The spots and colors don't bother me. Like AKA said, subtrops can get U. G. L. Y. (you ain't got not alibi). But if the bottom kind of fills up with liquid, that is probably going to be some smelly bacterial ickyness. You can open a sacrificial one and have a sniff. You will know if it is bacterial.


I just finished the next set of labs for the chart. Need to feed the family and do a couple of chores before can download and edit pix and post.


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Stoned Gummys | BRF Pucks | Primo Reusable Plates | Easy LI 4 Preserv & Propo
"Psychedelics are powerful substances. Nothing that powerful is completely safe... and nothing completely safe is that powerful!" - Abigail Calder at ALPS 2023
Don't Panic

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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: ReverendMyc] * 5
    #28795723 -

I think we are wrapping this little game up, though I will see it to the finish in 98 more days.

It looks like the potency has peaked and since the millet continues to be consumed we are getting diminishing returns. I used my nifty new colorimeter to get an accurate measurement of the actual potency. So I took lots of pictures of my process this time and will be boringly detailed after the initial summary. It was actually disappointing to discover that I was way over estimating my readings. I will have a lot more to say on that topic in the colorimeter thread in a bit. But for this thread, I continue to post the readings using the scale that I was so that the graph stays consistent. However I will need to make some adjustments to fix the scale to be more accurate later. The shape of the graph doesn't change, but the actual potency is much lower than originally reported.

On to the results:

Using the visual scale I get the same potency as the last post on day 192 with the dry myceliated grain weight dropping another 10 grams to 52 & 53 per pint jar.
This time I did two jars to test if there were any differences between them to investigate the potential difference between jars and found none. I will give more details further down.

The biggest thing that I learned using the colorimeter to accurately measure the light absorption for a samples is that every reading I have done was over estimated. On the low end, the error is as much as 10 to 1. On the upper end of the scale where the color is darker, it is more like between 2 and 4 to 1. So I will need to do extensive measuring and some serious recalculating.

What does this mean for myceliated grain versus fruiting? :shrug:
I can't tell from the limited data that I have gathered so far. I ran 4 tests. Two grain spawn and two fruits from different species. Since the two fruit tests were not from subtropicalis, I won't draw any final conclusions yet. But what I will say is that based on what I would have called "off the scale" or near the top was not that high. After finding those results and taking my samples outside into direct desert sunlight, I can see that I was not reading them correctly. I suspect that I am not the only one based on the results I have seen posted versus what the published HPLC labs results have been. I will take the rest of this non-myceliated grain discussion over to the colorimeter thread now.

Now the details and pictures.
Took a bunch of tests out of the fridge to come up to room temperature for testing per the instructions.


Used my fancy new weights to ensure that my scale was reading accurately.


Pulled jars 1376 & 1377 inoculated on 2023-09-22 and opened and dried on 2024-05-24 for 24+ hours.

Before drying they were shaken, then when collected from the dehydrator, they were collected in mixing bowls, poured into the scale bowl, then into jars to be vacuum sealed until the test today. For each jar, before the test, they were shaken vigorously, then 3 grams were spooned into the scale using about six dips of a 1/4 teaspoon measuring spoon taken from different parts of the jar. The three grams were placed into a Mr Coffee grinder and pulsed 10 times, then pureed for 10 seconds, then pureed while vigorously shaking the whole grinder for 10 more seconds to really get it fine and finally pulsed 10 more times before measuring out 0.150 grams.
Why? Because I wanted to be reasonably (or unreasonably) certain that they were a homogenized blend from each jar.
Jar 1376


Jar 1377

Oh, did I mention the cleaning and polishing the interior of the grinder between cycles? Let's don't forget that, or unplugging it during the cleaning. And using fresh disposable condiment cups for each.

One conclusion that I can draw, and is backed up by the colorimeter, is that the two jars gave identical potency readings. That does give me some confidence in my methodology as far as concerns about possible variations in potency between samples from different parts of the jar or different jars from the same clone culture.

So then you pour the 150 mg of powder into the acid solution for 10 minutes shaking every three minutes but letting it rest for the last three before drawing it into a syringe through a syringe filter. Then inject it into a self healing reagent vial that needs to be heated in a water bath for 15 minutes.


And you get this, which I talked myself into calling 10 to 12 mg/g... again.

Depending on lighting and angle I could have believed several of the color bands were a best match. I will say that going by past experience and prior pictures I am confident that it is no lighter than the previous tests, though.

Time for bed. I will have to take on the colorimeter thread at a later time. Stay tuned to this station for more updates and corrections in the continuing saga of the grain munchers.


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Stoned Gummys | BRF Pucks | Primo Reusable Plates | Easy LI 4 Preserv & Propo
"Psychedelics are powerful substances. Nothing that powerful is completely safe... and nothing completely safe is that powerful!" - Abigail Calder at ALPS 2023
Don't Panic

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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: ReverendMyc] * 1
    #28795806 -

I just bought that same scale.

Even if the estimates were high the data should still be correct as far as relative potency levels I think. Although 10:1 and 4:1 is a big gap.  As long as all the prior visual readings were in the same light conditions seems like it would be consistent. It’s interesting that taking it outside changed how dark the color looked, I would’ve thought it would be the same.


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LAGM2020

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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: A.k.a] * 1
    #28795889 -

Doing gods work


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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: ReverendMyc] * 1
    #28796038 -

Nicely done Rev, I look forward to the next thread. On the box, they state their test are good for up to 6 months if refrigerated. Perhaps they could print dates on the chemical vials and box exterior to help with tracking the age of the test to ensure accuracy of results?

We're you running bisporus too?


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Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: YoshiTrainer]
    #28796772 -

You are right. I am surprised that I don't see a date on the kits anywhere.

I couldn't get my first attempt at bisporus to fruit. Fortunately, I have two new lines of spores from @bra to try out. Fingers crossed, I will have some results with those in a bit.


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Stoned Gummys | BRF Pucks | Primo Reusable Plates | Easy LI 4 Preserv & Propo
"Psychedelics are powerful substances. Nothing that powerful is completely safe... and nothing completely safe is that powerful!" - Abigail Calder at ALPS 2023
Don't Panic

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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: ReverendMyc] * 1
    #28796885 -

My bad, I thought you were testing bisporus mycelium, not mush.


--------------------
Low Prep the World! (agar plates)
Low Prep the World! (grain prep)
Trashcan FC
Acidulated extraction gummies and drops
Drying agar and grains using parchment paper
:leaf:Cleaning your bubble hash bags


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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: YoshiTrainer] * 2
    #28797122 -

I'll likely order some test kits for bisporus mycelium in the fall.  Going to put some on popcorn this summer and bioassay a gram of dried grains first to see if it's worth it.


--------------------
And if I only could
I'd make a deal with God
And I'd get him to swap our places
I'd be running up that road
Be running up that hill
With no problems

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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: tree frog] * 7
    #28823950 -

Well rev, today is the day.  90 days on the button.  Honestly I was prepared to toss these.  I thought theyd smell like a corpse but lo and behold i opened them up and...

they smelled good! Like semps, which i swear has a blood smell to them.  So i did the damn thing and put it all on the nesco.  tomorrow if i have time, ill press the first batch of pills and this weekend i should have time to test it out.  no lab testing, no science. no data. just me and my ol nervous system.  my buds are thinkin im gonna get the bubble guts but me? Nah man... i have a good feeling.  that smell.  That deep semp blood smell.  it beckons.  I must obey.



--------------------
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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: BeefExtreme]
    #28824483 -

What does everyone else think they smell like?
Semps.

And not like oyster mycelium, which is gross btw. (Not ew gross just not my personal favorite)

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Re: Myceliated Grain Spawn Potency vs Time test [Re: BeefExtreme]
    #28824647 -

Really curious about how the capsules go, bubble guts aside. I bet they don't do that unless you are sensitive to the grain spawn. Getting them good and dry at pasteurizing temperatures should take care most hidden nasties if they look and smell good.

I can see the blood smell thing. With tamps I get an unripe melon smell. Like a too green cantaloupe. I definitely know the smell of subtrops compared to others but I don't have a good thing I can compare it to like tamps. Pans are not my favorite smell though, a bit stinky. And PE is fine until you get it in the dehydrator and then it is straight ass for the first couple of hours.


--------------------
Stoned Gummys | BRF Pucks | Primo Reusable Plates | Easy LI 4 Preserv & Propo
"Psychedelics are powerful substances. Nothing that powerful is completely safe... and nothing completely safe is that powerful!" - Abigail Calder at ALPS 2023
Don't Panic

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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > Mushroom Cultivation
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