koods said:

He rattles off statistics about poverty, healthcare, homelessness and literacy and how it’s all improved. He says Chavez is beloved. He says millions of homes have been built despite the economic crisis. These things may all be true. I doubt it.

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koods said:

But that leads to the question, how does a country that has seen a near compete economic collapse afford that kind of spending?

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koods said:

The reporting in mainstream media is very negative about the situation. Is that because there is an agenda or because the facts in the ground are dire?

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koods said:

Media organizations have biases, but they don’t have the same biases, yet almost every major news gathering organization reports the same thing about Venezuela: it’s a failed state. Across the political spectrum, the narrative from professional journalists and outlets is in stark disagreement with what some of the alternative media - such as empire files - are saying. These places have biases as well, and from what I can see their bias is undeniably agenda driven. They have a niche audience of anti-interventionists and anti-capitalists. They are not journalists. They are activists.

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koods said:

Sometimes the mainstream media gets it wrong. (The aide bus wasn’t burned by maduro troops, but we also know this because of the New York Times) But there doesn’t appear to be deliberate attempts to mislead the public.

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koods said:

Fal posted a Wikileaks document from the state department that seemed to be unconcerned with the current human suffering taking place. He never mentioned the document was 45 years old.

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You think the US is suddenly concerned about human suffering abroad?  Jesus koods. 

koods said:

Fal posted a video by a guy who went to Venezuela to report that grocery stores were well stocked and the rumors of shortages were immaculate. It was only mentioned in passing in the video, and not by fal, that the store didn’t accept Venezuelan currency and you had to have American cash or a credit card to buy anything. Nearly the entire population would have no ability to shop there.

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koods said:

It comes down to this. The mainstream media is motivated by maintaining credibility. Reporters lose jobs when they make up stories or lie.

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koods said:

On the other hand, the ideological true believers have every reason to discredit anyone whose makes the Chavez revolution look like a failure. In the end it’s just clear to me that one side is driven by an agenda and the other isn’t.

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Quote:

Venezuela had the richest economy in all of South America before the United States stepped in.  Even Enlil has acknowledged many times that Socialism cannot succeed because the the United States will never allow it.

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Quote:

You've told us many times about how as a youngster, you've travelled to Russia, Venezuela, and places the rest of us could only have dreamed of visiting.  This makes me believe you come from a wealthy family.  Which may be why you support establishment stories that bolster the rich?

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koods said:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:

Venezuela had the richest economy in all of South America before the United States stepped in.  Even Enlil has acknowledged many times that Socialism cannot succeed because the the United States will never allow it.

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Stop with this bullshit. Your entire argument requires that everyone agree that US action is responsible for the current situation. You have not provided sufficient evidence to even consider this proposition. You keep blaming sanctions but the sanctions came long after Venezuela’s economy began to crater. If you’re gonna talk about make believe, I think claiming that the cause of events can occur after those events qualifies. You aren’t just making politcal claims, you are challenging our understanding of a fundamental property of the universe: that time only moves in one direction.

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koods said:

I voted for Bernie. Do you have any other fake news?

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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:

koods said:

Fal posted a Wikileaks document from the state department that seemed to be unconcerned with the current human suffering taking place. He never mentioned the document was 45 years old.

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You think the US is suddenly concerned about human suffering abroad?  Jesus koods. 

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SirTripAlot said:

We need to stop meddling; by not giving them money/aid, it reduces the chances of  US meddling. You agree?

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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:

When I told you there's no proof of Russian Government intervention, you insisted proof only needs to be the smallest amount of evidence, like the FBIs' belief Russia did it based on past Russian behavior (whatever that means).

Now, when I say the sanctions exacerbated the situation in Venezuela and provide an article backing that up, you not only dismiss it, but you say it doesn't count if a reasonable person believes the sanctions were justified. 

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Enlil said:

We have to set the threshold of proof that we're willing to accept.  If you want to set the burden at "more likely than not," that's one thing.  If you want to set it at "mere scintilla of proof," that's another.  I don't care where the threshold is, as long as we're held to the same standard.

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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:

At 13:55 John Oliver said "He (Maduro) chalked up protests against him to this: (shows video of Maduro saying "this is part of scheme of non-conventional war that the US has perfected throughout recent decades"), then John Oliver immediately says "Ok so, here's the thing there - America has undoubtedly done some awful things in Central and South America. We backed coup attempts, juntas and atrocities in Chile, Argentina and Guatemala.  But refreshingly, what's happening in Venezuela is actually not our fault.  Accusing America of creating Venezuela's crisis is about as fair as accusing OJ Simpson of murdering Princess Diana."

I have no idea how you concluded that means US sanctions caused the food 'shortages'.

John Oliver believes America is not responsible for the protests in Venezuela against Maduro, nor many other things happening in Venezuela.  Are you looking for evidence that the US is behind the protests?

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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:

Enlil said:

We have to set the threshold of proof that we're willing to accept.  If you want to set the burden at "more likely than not," that's one thing.  If you want to set it at "mere scintilla of proof," that's another.  I don't care where the threshold is, as long as we're held to the same standard.

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Let's go with 'more likely than not'.  If we disagree, we put it to a vote.

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Enlil said:

The show was talking about food shortages. Then it went on to discuss "the Maduro diet."  Immediately thereafter, they went to Maduro blaming the U.S., followed by Oliver's statement.  To me, it seems like he's talking about the food shortages. 

If you think it's about the protests, make your case for that.

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Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:

Venezuela to Investigate Food Giant Kraft Heinz for 'Sabotage'

Quote:

...Heinz employees reportedly claimed the company’s factories are capable of operating at full capacity to meet the country’s shortage of certain food items—but that the owners do not want that to happen.

The Venezuelan government claims private corporations are deliberately hoarding food items to manufacture shortages ahead of parliamentary elections

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