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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: DieCommie]
    #13843410 -

DieCommie said:
Quote:
I can't prove that something doesn't exist.


Sure you can.  At least, you can as much as you can prove something does exist.  I can claim I dont have a quarter in my hand.  You can look in my hand and have evidence to support that claim.

The burden of proof lies on the person making the claim - it doesnt matter what the claim is.


You can say a specific statement pertaining to a known person is false. However if you said some guy named Jim who lives in China has a quarter in his hand i can never disprove that.


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Live your Life! :heart:

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: DieCommie]
    #13843416 -

DieCommie said:
Quote:
I can speculate on a flying spaghetti monster all I want to and you would never "prove" me wrong.


Incorrect.  Do you know what spaghetti is?  There is copious amounts of evidence against the FSM.


And I would say all of science is copious amounts of evidence against inherent meaning to life.


--------------------
Live your Life! :heart:

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: 4896744]
    #13843424 -

iThink said:
DieCommie said:
Quote:
I can speculate on a flying spaghetti monster all I want to and you would never "prove" me wrong.


Incorrect.  Do you know what spaghetti is?  There is copious amounts of evidence against the FSM.


And I would say all of science is copious amounts of evidence against inherent meaning to life.


Of course.  But what does that have to do with the FSM or atheism?  Nothing really...

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: 4896744]
    #13843428 -

iThink said:
You can say a specific statement pertaining to a known person is false. However if you said some guy named Jim who lives in China has a quarter in his hand i can never disprove that.


Well, you could look in his hand...  Again, that is not 'proof', demanding proof is an unrealistic expectation.  It is however very suggestive evidence.

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: DieCommie]
    #13843444 -

DieCommie said:
iThink said:
You can say a specific statement pertaining to a known person is false. However if you said some guy named Jim who lives in China has a quarter in his hand i can never disprove that.


Well, you could look in his hand...  Again, that is not 'proof', demanding proof is an unrealistic expectation.  It is however very suggestive evidence.


Exactly, that is what i have been saying, I brought up FSM and Atheism just as examples to communicate my point.


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Live your Life! :heart:

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: Orestes211]
    #13843491 -

Orestes211 said:
What are we humans so much more aware of than other animals?


Sea otters have the capability to use rocks to crack open the shells of sea creatures for food. We farm for food, instead of merely smashing rocks against shells...  We have the ability to study, learn things and make things at a higher level allowing us to be more aware of what is possible in the world around us, as well as exact nature of the world around us.  We study things.  Just to name a few: math, physiology, engineering, meteorology.  I think some animals are aware of these studies in a very crude and basic way, not even close to the same as us.


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

Edited by Cognitive_Shift (01/24/11 06:35 PM)

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: 4896744]
    #13843749 -

iThink said:
Therefore, the lack of evidence doesn't "prove" that there is no "deep reality", but it puts it into the realm of baseless speculation where anything goes. I can speculate on a flying spaghetti monster all I want to and you would never "prove" me wrong.


Quite. 

Bringing this point back to the context of our debate...
Which statement is the "flying spaghetti monster" of the argument?
You may choose only one


Votes accepted from 01/24/11 06:28 PM until the end of time

View the results of this poll


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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: random_wanderer]
    #13843771 -

He is trying to say you can only disprove things... which has nothing to do with the argument.


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #13843898 -

Cognitive_Shift said:
He is trying to say you can only disprove things... which has nothing to do with the argument.


But if you followed the original line of debate iThink and i have been having you would also see that he was using the logic that because something has not been proven scientifically, this equates to it not existing to support his argument that life has no meaning.  He has since then half gone back on this but then brought the God vs not-God debate into it to try to demonstrate how assuming something does not exist is more valid than assuming something does exist.  My point all along has been that they are both assumptions, interpretations, noise, swindles, spooks...

...the fact that my noises rock more than anyone elses is beside the point :satansmoking:

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: random_wanderer]
    #13843927 -

Okay.  Welcome my lady.  It's strange to see registration dates in the year 11' and a brit too!  Hope ya stick around!


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #13844092 -

Cognitive_Shift said:
Okay.  Welcome my lady.  It's strange to see registration dates in the year 11' and a brit too!  Hope ya stick around!


Gosh.  Thank you very much  :cloud9: xxx

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: random_wanderer]
    #13844198 -

Cognitive_Shift said:
He is trying to say you can only disprove things... which has nothing to do with the argument.


No, i was using it as an example of the fact that you can't disprove anything. It pertains to the argument because you are invoking some baseless conjecture about inherent "meaning" to life that has no evidence backing it. The flying spaghetti monster also has no evidence backing it. I can't disprove either.
random_wanderer said:
Cognitive_Shift said:
He is trying to say you can only disprove things... which has nothing to do with the argument.


But if you followed the original line of debate iThink and i have been having you would also see that he was using the logic that because something has not been proven scientifically, this equates to it not existing to support his argument that life has no meaning.  He has since then half gone back on this but then brought the God vs not-God debate into it to try to demonstrate how assuming something does not exist is more valid than assuming something does exist.  My point all along has been that they are both assumptions, interpretations, noise, swindles, spooks...

...the fact that my noises rock more than anyone elses is beside the point :satansmoking:


First of all give me an example of something that exists that hasn't been proven scientifically.

Lastly, yes they are all interpretations, but here is why you can put more faith in scientific interpretations. The very fact that they allow us to sense things competently enough to survive, not to mention things like airplanes, space shuttles, medicine, and the internet which rely on this "interpretation" of reality.


--------------------
Live your Life! :heart:

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: 4896744]
    #13844222 -

iThink said:
No, i was using it as an example of the fact that you can't disprove anything.


Disprove the acceleration of gravity on earth at sea level is 9.80 meters per second per second...


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: Cognitive_Shift]
    #13844233 -

Cognitive_Shift said:
iThink said:
No, i was using it as an example of the fact that you can't disprove anything.


Disprove the acceleration of gravity on earth at sea level is 9.80 meters per second per second...


Sorry, you can't disprove anything exists.


--------------------
Live your Life! :heart:

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: 4896744]
    #13844265 -

:lol:  i can't get around your double negatives.  What exactly are you asking in understandable word choice?


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L'enfer est plein de bonnes volontés et désirs

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: 4896744]
    #13844709 -

iThink said:
Cognitive_Shift said:
iThink said:
No, i was using it as an example of the fact that you can't disprove anything.


Disprove the acceleration of gravity on earth at sea level is 9.80 meters per second per second...


Sorry, you can't disprove anything exists.


As I said earlier, you cannot prove anything exists either.  Proof is not possible with empirical science, its only possible within an axiomatic system.

With empirical science you have evidence.  You can have strong or weak evidence for the existence of something or against the existence of something.  It is symmetrical in that regard.

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: DieCommie]
    #13844777 -

science = strong evidence:satansmoking:

Mysticism = weak evidence:hellfire:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: Icelander] * 1
    #13844791 -

[devil's advocate]

consciousness = strongest evidence possible (it's self-evident)

science's explanation for consciousness = basically non-existent

:omgz: :satansmoking:

[/devil's advocate]


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: Icelander]
    #13844795 -

You are more generous than I...

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Re: Is life inherently meaningful? [Re: DieCommie]
    #13844807 -

I know but not always.  You were kickin ass in the Mystery forum last week however.:lol:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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