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OfflineStrumpling
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Registered: 10/11/02
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Are we evolving to nature's "Insect 2.0?"
    #1252897 - 01/27/03 11:22 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

From the Evolution thread:

"Just look at cockaroaches. They've survived all these thousands of years through all harsh environments. Today, we use many pesticides against them, but if it doesn't kill them, they'll adapt or evolve to be resistant to it making the previous ones useless. You can see evolution at work in cockaroaches."

I feel many insects have evolved almost "perfectly." From what I've read, many insects haven't really physically evolved much at all for many thousands of years according to fossils and such..... They basically only evolve new defenses in terms of chemicals and internal immune-systems and things like that. Its like they are basically "perfect" beings for what they do. I've also read that they have highly-advanced forms of communication which we have no means of understanding. It appears to me that once "physical" evolution comes to its "peak" with any given being, the neural or mental evolution kicks into full gear. Ants, for instance, have some sort of data-compression that is still evolving in them and used when communicating amongst themselves.

I watched a documentary on ants and there was a very interesting experiment involving locating food. They would place one ant in a maze and have it track down some food. When it went back to the beginning to communicate the location of the food to its fellow captive ants, they would replace the maze with an identical one so as to get rid of any scents or something that the ant may have left behind. The first ant would go back and lock antennae with another. At this time, information would be exchanged, somehow. If locating the food in the maze required taking all left turns, the ant would take a shorter period of time to communicate this to its fellow ants than if it were, for instance, left right right left right left left. Apparently the more they did this experiment, the faster the ants got at communicating the "coordinates," especially after several "generations" of doing so.

On top of this, I'm sure most people here are familiar with the "dance of the honey-bee," where a honey-bee returns to the hive with extremely precise "coordinates" back to the location of a large "score" of pollen. What looks to an observer like a bee simply wiggling around in a figure-8 pattern, some scientists believe is actually a highly-advanced information exchange in which the location of the pollen is pointed out in SIX DIMENSIONS to the other bees. Naturally, this makes it very easy for the bees to locate this pollen.

Terence Mckenna once referred to life as a "Conquest of Dimensionality," meaning life was a natural part of the process of universes which enables to universe to fully "experience" and recognize itself.

Insects are extrordinarily complex collectives with very precise and specific habits and ways of life. While sitting in traffic on the freeway or waiting in line to get food at some shithole fast-food joint, I get the feeling that mankind is mammal's answer to the insect. Insects have undoubtedly been successful here on this planet, as there are more of them than every other life-form combined from what I remember.... Mankind is starting to get pretty good at keeping alive and has evolved this far in a fraction of the time it took the insects. We rule the water, the air, and land, just as they have. Our physical evolution should basically be over, as we've adjusted our environments to suit this form perfectly (just as bees shouldn't need to physically evolve because it suits the bee-hive form perfectly, we shouldn't need to because we have ergonomic keyboards and certain-sized doorways and things that support this exact form), just as many insects have. Evolution seems to be acting much more internally now that we've reached this level, just as it has done for many types of insects many thousands of years ago. Language and cooperation are now more important than ever, just as with an ant colony or a bee-hive. Population-increase is absurd, just as it was with insects long ago before it was finally balanced out (You can imagine the explosion of the insect-population that was required to fill the whole earth with insects as it is today).

Are we mother nature's Insect 2.0?

Am I wasting words?

Come on; lets hear it. Feel free to thrash me or comment on any of the above drivvel.

-=- Matt/Strumpling -=-
I'm hungry..


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE


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OfflineStrumpling
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Re: Are we evolving to nature's "Insect 2.0?" [Re: Strumpling]
    #1252903 - 01/27/03 11:23 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

oh and in addition, many people seem a bit more intimidated by insects and "bugs" than other creatures, even though they're way smaller and way less dangerous.... are we afraid they may have this planet down a bit better than we do? :wink: :tongue:


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE


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Offlinerecalcitrant
My Own God

Registered: 04/20/02
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Re: Are we evolving to nature's "Insect 2.0?" [Re: Strumpling]
    #1253078 - 01/27/03 12:14 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

ya man. but if cockroaches are getting superevolved by living in the cities, they are gonna be fucked when george dubya blows up the world.


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We have to answer our own prayers


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OfflineStrumpling
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Registered: 10/11/02
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Re: Are we evolving to nature's "Insect 2.0?" [Re: recalcitrant]
    #1253091 - 01/27/03 12:17 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

very thoughtful


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE


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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: Are we evolving to nature's "Insect 2.0?" [Re: recalcitrant]
    #1253244 - 01/27/03 12:47 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

ya man. but if cockroaches are getting superevolved by living in the cities, they are gonna be fucked when george dubya blows up the world.

How do we know for sure that GW is not just 100,000 cockroaches in a man-suit doing ventriloquism?


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineDrubuShrume
EAT ME - I'm afungi

Registered: 05/14/02
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Re: Are we evolving to nature's "Insect 2.0?" [Re: Swami]
    #1253722 - 01/27/03 03:37 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

How do we know for sure that GW is not just 100,000 cockroaches in a man-suit doing ventriloquism?


It's a conspiracy maaaaan!!!


--------------------
AH HA....


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InvisibleRebelSteve33
Amateur Mycologist
Male

Registered: 05/28/02
Posts: 3,774
Loc: Arizona
Re: Are we evolving to nature's "Insect 2.0?" [Re: Strumpling]
    #1253836 - 01/27/03 04:20 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Very good post, Strumpling!  You write and convey your thoughts well!

That experiment with the ants was very interesting... I hadn't heard about it before just now.  I've always thought that insects probably have some sort of complex way of communicating that we are just not able to perceive or comprehend because they are on such a different dimension than we are.  Can you imagine what it would be like to be as small as an ant?!

Insects were the first animals to come on land, and they were very important in the evolution of plants, which, in turn, were very important in the evolution of other land animals.  Basically, insects made life possible for us.  I think that's amazing!  And, like you said, insects have probably evolved in ways that we can't even understand because they have been around for so long.  They don't really seem like the smartest creatures on the planet, but how are we to really know?

Anyway... About our own evolution...

I am kind of scared about this topic.  We have evolved to depend on technology.  We have evolved away from person-to-person communication and instead communicate through the use of machines.  The technology we've created (including all of our medecines and such) have made it easy for us to live without maintaining our physical fitness or even having to depend on our own bodies at all.

I'm worried that we might be going through a sort of de-evolution.  Our technology continues to evolve, but we, as a species, are going backward, not forward.  What happens when our technology fails us?  What happens when we run out of an energy supply and all of our machines cease to function?  What will we do then?  Will we know or even be able to survive in a world without them?

I'm not so sure we (or at least most of us!) can.  :crazy:

-RebelSteve 


--------------------
Namaste.


Edited by RebelSteve33 (01/27/03 05:56 PM)


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OfflineAdamist
ℚṲℰϟ✞ЇѺℵ ℛ∃Åʟḯ†У
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Re: Are we evolving to nature's "Insect 2.0?" [Re: Strumpling]
    #1253871 - 01/27/03 04:37 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Maybe extra-terrestrial life is so evolved that it is microscopic in nature. :wink: 


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:heartpump: { { { ṧ◎ηḯ¢ αʟ¢ℌ℮мƴ } } } :heartpump:


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OfflineMurex
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Re: Are we evolving to nature's "Insect 2.0?" [Re: Strumpling]
    #1254047 - 01/27/03 05:39 PM (14 years, 1 month ago)

I think it's a matter of opinion.


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?



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OfflineStrumpling
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Registered: 10/11/02
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Re: Are we evolving to nature's "Insect 2.0?" [Re: Murex]
    #1254761 - 01/28/03 08:57 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Right....... so what's your opinion? hehe I'm simply trying to get some conversation going.. :smile:


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE


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OfflineStrumpling
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Registered: 10/11/02
Posts: 7,571
Loc: Hyperspace
Last seen: 5 years, 9 months
Re: Are we evolving to nature's "Insect 2.0?" [Re: RebelSteve33]
    #1254887 - 01/28/03 09:38 AM (14 years, 1 month ago)

Me being 22 years old, looking back on my childhood, I really do feel like some kind of insect.... Imagine a new member of a large colony of ants - its suddenly birthed into this bustling community with other ants shoving past, on their own missions, scouting for food, heading to an existing food-source, taking over a nearby colony (war is universal, folks).

Really sounds a lot like a human... suddenly born into this GIANT METROPOLIS with helicoptors flying around and people walking around in the streets on their own missions, scouting for food, heading to their favorite food-source, taking over nearby colonies... One difference that scientists have pointed out is that when ants are "born" they seem to already know what to do, as they've been stabilized with these actions for thousands of years. Mankind, however, refuses to stabilize, as we are very ambitious creatures, so our children are all confused and lost. I'll bet raising a sane child in cambodia is a bit easier than raising one here in Los Angeles, for instance.

"They don't really seem like the smartest creatures on the planet, but how are we to really know?"

Well I think this kind of has to do with ambition :wink: - Insects don't seem to care to expand their horizons, as they've perfected living on this planet (we sure haven't..) and most likely don't know there are even more planets for Earth-life to attempt to get to. Although they have more internal boundaries than we do, if you watch ants for a while or watch bees, they are pretty smart when it comes to things like crowd-navigation and food-gathering (things they have to worry about..) and they are very very very good at what they do - all of them; they just don't have much of a nervous-system to work with.

Since we have much more complex nervous-systems, we aspire to do much more complex stuff, especially since some guy (or gal!) discovered the idea of a "tool" long ago, and technology as we know it exploded from there. Although capitalism isn't such a fantastic idea in my opinion, I also feel we'll get through it. I feel that Earth is our "nest" and we will eventually spread as far as we realize we can spread, and most-likely cap-out at some point where our nervous-system simply can't do anymore than what we've accomplished other than shorten and "perfect" the actions that are already being carried out. From there, it will be time for another species to take over for us (possibly one evolved thanks to us, like some type of bioelectric machines or something  :cool: ), and we most-likely won't even try to understand what they're up to, just as insects probably don't give two craps about what we're doing - our activities are simply too complex for them to worry about.

Once-again.... Don't know if I got any ideas across, but simply attempting to get some more conversation going.. This doesn't need to be restricted to insects vs. mankind lol, as reading over what I just typed (phew thats a lot of stuff!) I realize I've expanded this into another "where is mankind going" type of topic as well.. will we peak-out at some level as the insects have, and only develope internally from there, or will we keep expanding our horizens? All the stuff above is simply one of the directions my mind has gone in, and isn't necessarily something I strictly BELIEVE in, as I don't really believe in anything concretely :smile:

Any and all thoughts, insults, and threats are welcome :smile:


--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE


Edited by Strumpling (01/28/03 09:42 AM)


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