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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Zanthius]
    #10626167 -

I won't disagree there, but still, just because civilization wouldn't exist if we were all liars, murderers, and theifs doesn't mean that it is absolutely objectively immoral to lie, kill, and steal. Morality is more than that which helps keep civilization from crumbling.


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Poid]
    #10626185 -

Poid said:
I won't disagree there, but still, just because civilization wouldn't exist if we were all liars, murderers, and theifs doesn't mean that it is absolutely objectively immoral to lie, kill, and steal.


I said that it was general ethical guidelines, rather than absolute rules. Almost everybody would lie, steal or murder in order to survive.

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Zanthius]
    #10626193 -

Agreed. :mushroom2:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Zanthius]
    #10626356 -

That people shouldn't steal from each other and shouldn't lie to each other is a shared agreement between individuals

Yes, this would explain why there aren't any liars or thiefs. :smirk:

Edit: Oh my, there's a FOURTH page.


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Let's get the fuck out of here.

Edited by Bernackums (07/05/09 08:38 PM)

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Bernackums]
    #10626376 -

Bernackums said:
Yes, this would explain why there aren't any liars or thiefs. :smirk:



The more liars and thieves there are in a society, the less civilized the society is. If everybody were liars and thieves, then there wouldn't be any civilization at all.

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Zanthius]
    #10626443 -

I suppose. A lot of businessman make good liars and theives and we've got far too many of those. :smirk:


--------------------
Let's get the fuck out of here.

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Zanthius]
    #10626496 -

Zanthius said:
Bernackums said:
Yes, this would explain why there aren't any liars or thiefs. :smirk:



The more liars and thieves there are in a society, the less civilized the society is. If everybody were liars and thieves, then there wouldn't be any civilization at all.


One could put forth the claim that lying and stealing is what makes our economy and politics go 'round. :shrug:


Lawyers lie all the time, and many people think that lawyers are basically stealing from them, considering the high legal bills involved when hiring a lawyer.


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Poid]
    #10628313 -

Poid said:
One could put forth the claim that lying and stealing is what makes our economy and politics go 'round. :shrug:


Go to the most corrupt countries in the world. They have the highest concentration of thieves and liars. See for yourself how much better everything "goes around" there.

Lying and stealing generates disharmony in your economy and in your politics.

Edited by Zanthius (07/06/09 05:00 AM)

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Zanthius]
    #10628395 -

We have a lot of theives and liars in our society, but maybe that's why some things are so fucked up, who knows...:justdontknow:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Poid]
    #10628417 -

Poid said:
We have a lot of theives and liars in our society, but maybe that's why some things are so fucked up, who knows...:justdontknow:


It is definitely one of the reasons why things are so fucked up in your country. :tongue:

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Zanthius]
    #10628431 -

The whole world is pretty fucked up; it's not just America, it's the human race.


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Poid]
    #10628506 -

Poid said:
The whole world is pretty fucked up; it's not just America, it's the human race.


I agree, but some countries ( like mine ) are less fucked up than others. :tongue:

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Zanthius]
    #10628829 -

Lucky you.


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Zanthius]
    #10630059 -

Yeah, lucky you! :shakefist:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Zanthius]
    #10633178 -

Quote:
Zanthius said: I wouldn't avoid to steal because of fear, but because I understand with my frontal cortex that stealing is wrong, and that the world will be a better place if people aren't stealing from each other.


The problem is that even if crime is detrimental towards society (which it certainly is), stealing does benefit the thief.  If we're trying to stop immoral actions then we need a convincing incentive to the individual not to steal, and I'm not sure there is one besides just the fear of getting caught.


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: deCypher]
    #10634894 -

So right:thumbup:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: deCypher]
    #10639643 -

deCypher said:
The problem is that even if crime is detrimental towards society (which it certainly is), stealing does benefit the thief.


I am not capable of thinking in such a limited perspective. Whatever benefits society, also benefits me, as I am an integrated part of society.

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Zanthius]
    #10639650 -

:lol:, what if your death and/or suffering benefited society? :strokebeard:


--------------------
Well I try my best to be just like I am, but everybody wants you to be just like them. --  Bob Dylan
fireworks_god said:
It's one thing to simply enjoy a style of life that one enjoys, but it's another thing altogether to refer to another person's choice as "wrong" or to rationalize their behavior as being pathological or resulting from some sort of inadequacy or failing so as to create a sense of superiority or separation as yet another projection of a personal fear or control issue.

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Poid]
    #10639693 -

Poid said:
:lol:, what if your death and/or suffering benefited society? :strokebeard:


Nobody's suffering benefits society, but if I was a malevolent creature only spreading malevolence to my sorroundings, then I think I should be eliminated for the greater good of the universe.

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Re: Overcoming fear and turning to LOVE? [Re: Zanthius]
    #10639700 -

Quote:
Zanthius said: I am not capable of thinking in such a limited perspective.


Since you are an individual and not society, thinking in such a perspective is all you'll ever be able to do.


--------------------
We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Unfolding Nature Shop: Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order

General Interest > Philosophy, Sociology & Psychology
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