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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > The Psychedelic Experience
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Amanitas and brain lesions
    #8688355 -

Quote:
Repetitive injections of ibotenic acid induce a transient change in GABA receptor sensitivity (...) and might produce lesions in the basal forebrain as it destroys a small percentage of cholinergic cells (...); the consequence in vivo would be a significant and prolonged learning and memory deficit (...).

Source: http://www.erowid.org/references/refs_view.php?A=ShowDocPartFrame&C=ref&ID=6472&DocPartID=6005 , p. 8


I've no scientific knowledge about brain and it's bio-chemistry. That's why I come with questions. I believe that this topic should be treated as high priority for our community. Many of us tried, tries or want to try Fly Agaric mushroom. I live in Poland and there are plenty of those mushrooms in our forests. I want to stay on the side of the law and I want to find an ally that is growing where I live. Probably, eating this mushroom once in a while won't do much harm. Still, we cannot be sure. Some people use dried skin of Fly Agaric as a mild, intoxicating smoke, so the risk is getting higher. I was wonder about few things. I would appreciate answers.

1) Ibotenic acid brakes down to muscimol at higher temperatures. How long would I need to dry or cook them to get as little ibotenic acid as possible? I've read recommendations about drying but I want to get maximum effect. What about boiling in water?

2) How much of ibotenic acid is destroyed while smoking dried skin of this mushroom?

3) Brain regenerates its cells and alcohol is an intoxicant that also damages this organ. Can anyone compare those two poisons?

In Poland people drink quite a lot. I don't like alcohol too much and I would be happy to smoke some Fly Agaric instead of few beers... or just add another dimension to alcoholic inebriation. Maybe a poll directed to users of amanitas would be a good idea but without pinning it I doubt that we could collect sufficient data on learning and memory deficit in regular users of those mushrooms.


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enjoy life!

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Re: Amanitas and brain lesions [Re: Kras]
    #8689300 -

If you're determined to prepare fresh Amanita mushrooms, the literature says to steep for at least thirty minutes in 170-200 degrees Fahrenheit water to convert all the ibotenic acid over to muscimol.  Drying in the oven at this temperature should get you the same effect.  I don't know much about smoking the dried skins, but since you're setting the mushroom aflame, odds are that you're already exceeding the 170-200 degree range and therefore automatically converting the ibotenic acid over.

Now, eating properly dried Amanitas will not cause brain damage.  I've heard tales of seizures and convulsions resulting from massive overdoses, but if you stay within the recommended dosage limit, you should experience no harmful effects.  Ibotenic acid is known to be a neurotoxin (and in fact is used for this purpose as a brain lesioning agent by medical professionals), but this is caused by direct injection of the chemical into neural tissue.  Oral ingestion of ibotenic acid is a different story, however.  Some does enter through the blood-brain barrier if you eat fresh Amanitas (which is why this is highly inadvisable without proper preparation beforehand), some is metabolised into the psychoactive compound muscimol (which is the cause of the majority of Amanitas' effects), but most is excreted harmlessly from the body.  If you've heated your mushrooms properly while drying, there will be no ibotenic acid left in the mushroom to cause any worry for potential harm.

That being said, it is easy to mistake deadly mushrooms for Amanitas if you don't know what you're doing.  Know your mushrooms backwards and forwards before you go picking fungii and putting your life into your own hands.


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We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: Amanitas and brain lesions [Re: deCypher]
    #8691097 -

How about letting it dry on the sun and then putting it into the oven? The reason to do it is that I don't like the idea of the mushroom "sweating" its precious juice and me standing there pouring it back on the caps. Why? Because I don't want to hear questions from other mates that live in my apartment and I can't use oven where I will collect mushrooms.

Won't boiling Fly Agaric for 30 minutes destroy muscimol as well? I was wandering about making a water extract.


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enjoy life!

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Re: Amanitas and brain lesions [Re: Kras]
    #8691719 -

Thanks for this information guys. Glad I read this before I went and tried some Amanitas.

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Re: Amanitas and brain lesions [Re: Kras]
    #8691911 -

Dunno... so long as you have that thirty minute period of high heat in the oven, the ibotenic acid conversion should be adequately covered.  The muscimol should be fine, as many people consistently boil Amanitas with no loss of psychoactive effect.  I'd be interested to hear how a water extract turns out, though.

If you're overly concerned about roommates and such, you could try ordering pre-dried Amanitas from a reputable online source.  Living in a place far from Fly Agaric myself, this is all I do; and you can just munch on 'em as soon as you get them with no need for an oven or drying time.


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We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

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Re: Amanitas and brain lesions [Re: deCypher]
    #20654016 -

Okay so if you buy pre dried amanitas then you don't have to put them in the Oven to convert the ibotenic acid or should u still? What temperature in the oven and how long?

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Re: Amanitas and brain lesions [Re: Kras]
    #20654814 -

I think amanita muscaria is fairly safe in moderate doses.  I believe the ibotentic acid is metabolized into muscimol so you can get away with eating it fresh, but its not recommended.  you just need to make sure its totally dry.  doesn't matter how you do it-oven, stove top, let it sit in front of a fan, etc...


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:leaf::leaf:

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Re: Amanitas and brain lesions [Re: Shroomin Capote] * 1
    #20654880 -

SIX YEARS DEAD!  justinkl74 gets today's prize:



:peace:PS


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if you stand too close to the machine it'll start to eat you
Primal's simple tested teks and projects: :awesomenod: Wheat Prep 2.0  Acidic Tea Tek  Potency Project! 

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Re: Amanitas and brain lesions [Re: PrimalSoup]
    #20655753 -

PrimalSoup said:
SIX YEARS DEAD!  justinkl74 gets today's prize:



:peace:PS


shit I didn't see that. :facepalm:

:baseballfuck:  I hate it when this happens.  all old threads should be locked


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:leaf::leaf:

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Mushrooms, Mycology and Psychedelics > The Psychedelic Experience
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