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Re: I LOVE Chemistry [Re: Cepheus]
    #8673914 -

Quote:
Cepheus said:The principles established through physics are cornerstone of our entire understanding of the universe :grin:.


The entire universe?  I dont think physics can explain all phenomenon we observe, hence we have fields like biology.  Perhaps one day biology and other sciences can all be reduced to physics... but maybe that is an impossibility?  We dont really know if the entire universe, all phenomenon, can be reduced to the basic interactions.

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Re: I LOVE Chemistry [Re: DieCommie]
    #8673945 -

Read what I said; I said our understanding of the entire universe.


--------------------
"I only ever hope to reach equilibrium, in Nature's matrix, in line with the meridian" ~ Jehst

:sun: "...and I know that I have to keep breathing, as tomorrow the sun will rise, who knows what the tide will bring?" :sun:

Free Spore Ring Europe
Send any spare spore prints you might have and help the distribution :grin:

Open Source. Freedom.  GNU/Linux

Addicting is not a word.

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Re: I LOVE Chemistry [Re: Cepheus]
    #8673987 -

Yea, Im with ya.  Still, I cant help but think of biology.  Our understanding of biology cant be tied to basic physics.  Psychology, Sociology, Economics, even what we understand about personality and emotion... our knowledge in these fields cannot be tied to basic physics. 

What I am appealing to here is 'anti-reductionism'.  There is a preconceived notion in science that all can be reduced to the basic constituents, but as of yet we cannot be sure this is the case.  I feel compelled to link to a post I made on similar lines.... http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/8670135#8670135

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Re: I LOVE Chemistry [Re: DieCommie]
    #8673988 -

DieCommie said:
Quote:
Cepheus said:The principles established through physics are cornerstone of our entire understanding of the universe :grin:.


The entire universe?  I dont think physics can explain all phenomenon we observe, hence we have fields like biology.  Perhaps one day biology and other sciences can all be reduced to physics... but maybe that is an impossibility?  We dont really know if the entire universe, all phenomenon, can be reduced to the basic interactions.


I think most biological phenomenon can be reduced to physical terms, can't they? Maybe the interactions are so complex that they haven't been for the most part.  I guess the brain is an example of something that hasn't though; it's like an organic quantum mechanical computer.


--------------------
check out my music!
drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss

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Re: I LOVE Chemistry [Re: g00ru]
    #8674087 -

Shit man, you may as well get out your prayer mat and start facing east.

I'm one of those people, a 'reductionist'. I agree that the infinite complexity of all universe is impossible to fathom and pretty much just as impossible to reduce to its constituents... When such things come into question you can't help wonder whether there is some kind of benevolent 'creator'.

As far as I'm concerned every different science is another level of abstraction:

Mathematics, which is the language of science, sits at the base of the pyramid, whereas intangible 'human' sciences (psychology, sociology etc etc) sit at the top. 

I view modern sciences to be the empirical based on the evolution from base principles; which are rooted in mathematics and physics.

I can't be bothered to read your post right this second (the determinism or free will) as its 5:31am (and I'm on an mdma comedown :grin:), but I will bookmark it for tomorrow :grin:.


--------------------
"I only ever hope to reach equilibrium, in Nature's matrix, in line with the meridian" ~ Jehst

:sun: "...and I know that I have to keep breathing, as tomorrow the sun will rise, who knows what the tide will bring?" :sun:

Free Spore Ring Europe
Send any spare spore prints you might have and help the distribution :grin:

Open Source. Freedom.  GNU/Linux

Addicting is not a word.

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Re: I LOVE Chemistry [Re: Cepheus]
    #8674431 -

when i was in highschool our teacher said something long these lines

"does math actually exist or is it just our ways of wrapping our heads around something."  stumped the entire class nobody had an answer.  the quote might be a bit off hopefully it still conveys.


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We were sent to hell for eternity :hellfire: Ø:omgawesome:h®
We play on earth to pass the time :foreheadslap:

Over-population the root of all Evil-brings the Elites Closer to the gates.

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Re: I LOVE Chemistry [Re: DieCommie]
    #8674633 -

DieCommie said:
Yea, Im with ya.  Still, I cant help but think of biology.  Our understanding of biology cant be tied to basic physics.  Psychology, Sociology, Economics, even what we understand about personality and emotion... our knowledge in these fields cannot be tied to basic physics. 


In theory they could, if we knew everything. We could look at someone's behaviour and explain it with psychology which we could explain with biology (cognitive neuroscience) which we could explain with chemistry (biochemistry) which we could explain with physics (atomic theory) which we could explain with maths.

In practice we might never reach that point.


--------------------
I know... that just the smallest
                                                part of the world belongs to me
You know... I'm not a blind man
                                                    but truth is the hardest thing to see

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Re: I LOVE Chemistry [Re: zouden]
    #8675520 -

Quote:
In theory they could, if we knew everything.


There is no theory that says that!  That is a pre-conceived notion that has not been shown.  It seems like thats the way it should be, but we just dont know. 

If anybody has read my other post, and is still interested.... http://www.shroomery.org/forums/download.php?Number=8293996

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Re: I LOVE Chemistry [Re: DieCommie]
    #8675727 -

my high school education is bad. mostly my fault, i graduated from an alternative education school (because i got expelled from the regular one). most of the science i had there sucked and was dumbed down and you did your work on computers. i feel that i kinda fucked myself over because i have never had a chemistry class. i think that i would excel in this area. i am in a trade school right know and i am almost finished. i am thinking that after i am done with this school that i would look into a university and go for a science degree. i always like to know how shit works.


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"A friend is not a fellow who is taken in by shame, a friend is one who knows my faults and doesn't give a DAMN!!!"

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Re: I LOVE Chemistry [Re: DieCommie]
    #8675731 -

DieCommie said:
There is no theory that says that!  That is a pre-conceived notion that has not been shown.  It seems like thats the way it should be, but we just dont know. 

If anybody has read my other post, and is still interested.... http://www.shroomery.org/forums/download.php?Number=8293996


I think there probably is an underlying, fundamental order to the universe; I don't really see how there couldn't be. The only question to me is whether it is observable.


--------------------
check out my music!
drowse in prison and your waking will be but loss

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