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Spiritual Ideals and Community
    #7118916 -

Many young folks here have conceived of some sort of quasi-utopian society. Well, I am not sure about the rest of the world, but only one family-oriented spiritual community in the US has survived sinced the '60s.

If there were truly something deep to spiritual ideals, meditation, vegetarianism and cooperation, why does nearly every social experiment end in failure? (I know the answer, but I will open the floor for discussion.)


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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7118989 -

Disinterest within the involved individuals to truly ascribe to the ideals sought to be manifested? Inability for devotion?

It seems as though most monasteries seem to manage pretty well, although I admit I don't have any real first-hand experience with monasteries (feel free to refute this assumption if you deem it fit to be refuted).

It would seem obvious that it is simply a question of the purpose and intention of those involved.

Perhaps monasteries do not apply to your topic because you are asking about "social experiments", and monasteries have been in existance for at least 2400 years. Definitely not an "experiment". Perhaps the experiments you refer to simply fail because they are not rooted in historical understanding and tradition. :shrug:


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:redpanda:
If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you
:heartpump: :bunnyhug: :yinyang:

:yinyang: :levitate: :earth: :levitate: :yinyang:

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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: fireworks_god]
    #7119062 -

I excluded monasteries as they are not 'family oriented'; i.e. not a self-sustaining microcosm of society with full freedom of expression, but a closed hierarchal society which must constantly recruit outside members.


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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7119342 -

OrgoneConclusion said:
Many young folks here have conceived of some sort of quasi-utopian society. Well, I am not sure about the rest of the world, but only one family-oriented spiritual community in the US has survived sinced the '60s.

If there were truly something deep to spiritual ideals, meditation, vegetarianism and cooperation, why does nearly every social experiment end in failure? (I know the answer, but I will open the floor for discussion.)


SEX!


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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: Icelander]
    #7119490 -

May we have some adult answers now. :tongue:


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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7119790 -

I agree that sexual jealousy is a MAJOR reason communal living has failed. Others I would suggest are greed, competition, intolerance, shame (and the resultant need for privacy), and a complete lack of cultural preparation for successfully managing cooperative living.

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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: Veritas]
    #7119802 -

Not all communes are into 'free' love or polygamy or exchange of partners. At Ananda, where I stayed, marriage was considered sacred and sex outside of such a union was passively discouraged.


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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7119845 -

So there were never any issues of sexual jealousy?  What about unmarried couples, or singles?  Did they ever fall in love or lust with someone who had a partner?

I would say that communes where polyamory was encouraged would be less likely to be broadsided by sexual jealousy.  :shrug:

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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: Veritas]
    #7119877 -

Quote:
So there were never any issues of sexual jealousy?


Not in evidence, but most people residents lived in separate dwellings or tents or yurts or RVs rather than a large shared house.

The biggest issues were ego, spiritual arrogance and power struggles just like most everywhere else.


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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7120326 -

what community? i can only think of steve gaskin and the farm....


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Everything is better than it was the last time.  I'm good.

If we could look into each others hearts, and understand the unique challenges each of us faces, I think we would treat each other much more gently, with more love, patience, tolerance, and care.

It takes a lot of courage to go out there and radiate your essence.

I know you scared, you should ask us if we scared too.  If you was there, and we just knew you cared too.

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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #7122762 -

"only one family-oriented spiritual community in the US has survived sinced the '60s."

i'd sure like to see your sources on that.

also, i am just fucking with you because its fun... i'm pretty sure you have no source on that, since i doubt you, or anyone else has kept records on every family-oriented spiritual community in the US since the 60's


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You can check the last post in my journal for contact info.

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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: CosmicJoke]
    #7122808 -

Ananda, outside Nevada City, in north central California.

Edited by OrgoneConclusion (07/03/07 02:06 AM)

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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: truekimbo2]
    #7122816 -

Doubting Sean Connery is never a good idea. :nono:


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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7123045 -

i'm not doubting there is one, i'm doubting that there is ONLY one...

like i said above. i'd like to see some sort of data on that.


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You can check the last post in my journal for contact info.

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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7244904 -

but only one family-oriented spiritual community in the US has survived sinced the '60s.

Seems to me that, family-oriented spiritual community, describes every church in the US.

In which case I would guess there are about 100,000 family-oriented spiritual communities, that have been around in the US since the '60's, not that there is anything wrong with that.

Edited by falcon (07/31/07 07:58 PM)

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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: falcon]
    #7245291 -

Quote:
Seems to me that, family-oriented spiritual community, describes every church in the US.


Really? They live, eat, work & reside together? And pray/meditate together daily?


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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7245564 -

There are farm communities in Israel which have run according to a socialist style brought over from idealistic immigrants from Russia.

Many were strict about dorms where the children lived together. The workers shared the work in shifts and shared the wealth of the reaping at the end of the season. They had a communal dining hall and no choice but that of communal meals. They did not pray/meditate together as the ideal as they saw it, precluded ackowleding the existance of a creator/soul/other world beyond this or even a spiritual connection to the land.

There are still farms like that there but the children's dorms have all but been eliminated as far as I know and many have a choice of family or communal meals. Some have instituted a choice of prayer services on site. It was fought against for years but the old communist-fed guard is growing old. The youngsters either left and returned with citified ideas and changed things or were disenchanted with living by the sweat of one's brow being the ultimate goal in life.

They wanted spirituality and brought it in. I've heard that the synthesis of socialism and spirituality reaped some positive rewards...like respecting elders as a rule and pausing from work three times a day to gather, reflect and connect with the world beyond the physical.

Sounds nice eh? If no one shoots you and your family up in your beds it is. Sorry to bring in politics. It's rough to seek utopia in a crazy world.

Hang loose y'all. :smile:
MIC


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My inner child runs with scissors but plays nicely with others!

Sometimes the light's all shine'in on me,
Other times I can barely see.
Lately it occurs to me,
What a looong strange trip it's been! ~ Truck'in

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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: OrgoneConclusion]
    #7245663 -

Really? They live, eat, work & reside together? And pray/meditate together daily?

No, they do not, yet this does not make them any less of a family-oriented spiritual community.

Edited by falcon (08/01/07 06:05 AM)

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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: falcon]
    #7246116 -

falcon said:
No, they do not, yet this does not make them any less of a family-oriented spiritual community.


Excuse moi.
Please explain specifically to whom you are referring when you wrote "No they do not". Which "they" are you speaking of and what do they "not" do which maintains their status of "family-oriented spiritual community". 
Merci beaucoup!
This is a *fascinating post. I'd sure like to see this subject delved into in a sociology class. It must have been done somewhere but not the classes I took. Thanks! :thumbup: :smile:
*a word I reserve for only what speaks to my leanings towards being an armchair mouse-wielding sociologist...
The Unique Monique aka MIC


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My inner child runs with scissors but plays nicely with others!

Sometimes the light's all shine'in on me,
Other times I can barely see.
Lately it occurs to me,
What a looong strange trip it's been! ~ Truck'in

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Re: Spiritual Ideals and Community [Re: MyInnerChild]
    #7246555 -

Please explain specifically to whom you are referring when you wrote "No they do not".

They are the members of churches across the US, churches that have been in existence since the 60's.

what do they "not" do which maintains their status of "family-oriented spiritual community".


Their not doing the things on a daily basis that were asked by Orgone in his query, in the last post I replied to of his, do not make them any less of a "family-oriented spiritual community", though it could be argued that since they all live on earth, they do indeed do these activities together.

I edited my last post to include Orgone's query, 

thanks falcon

:eek: socioligist

Edited by falcon (08/01/07 06:42 AM)

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