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Re: The Lemon Experience... [now a community experiment - please contribute] [Re: wazo]
    #5823631 -

ok.. i've been reading about this for a while, and still haven't directly tried this method.. but here is what i did do that relates...

I made a large batch of mush. tea a few weeks ago (~2gal).  Before adding the mushrooms to the tea, I soaked them in enough lemon juice just to cover them for ~20mins.  I then added the entire goopy mess to the warm water to make the tea.  i also added a few tablespoons of rue to this tea mix...

This tea was the most potent tea I've ever tried... and i usually make awesome tea, anyways.  This stuff though, w/in 5min of finishing ~.5c a good friend of mine was already tripping... and w/in about 10min of finishing about 3/4 of a keg cup, I was definately tripping.  The come-up was very rapid to the point of almost being uncomfortable... the visuals came on w/in minutes... and overall the trip seemed to be a little shorter than normal.  I talked to several other people that tried the tea over the weekend and heard similar results to this from all of them...

i know the rue added to the potency, but I have never had rue shorten the come-up and everything like that before.. so, i have to attribute some of the amazingness of this tea to the lemon juice soaking prior to tea making. 

i will definately be trying the direct method sometime in the near future.

:smile:

yos-

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Re: The Lemon Experience... [now a community experiment - please contribute] [Re: Yoschie99]
    #5823798 -

U gave out tea with rue in it? I thought u really had to fast and watch your diet before and after using rue?

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Re: The Lemon Experience... [now a community experiment - please contribute] [Re: Yoschie99]
    #5823950 -

i tried this out last night with about 4gs of dry.

we squeezed a lemon and a lime into 2 cups and put a bit of OJ in em.

i ate the shrooms and then used the lemon/lime/OJ to wash down the remains.. i kept a bit of juice and some shroom powder in my mouth for about 5 mins and swished it around. its almost 7pm.

i could feel the shrooms within 10 mins, and it was the most intense come up ive ever had. i was flying and my friends were just sorta laughin around.. one asked how long it had been since we comsumed them.. it had seemd like a hour at least, but i knew it was less than 25 mins. a little bit after my friend ased the time everyone was in full swing (7 people) we then proceeded to ooze (as one guy put it) out of the house into my yard and started to light up some fireworks (i myself have had bad experiences with fireworks, so i just played guitar and watched from the porch. let me also say that all but 2 of the 7 were hippie flippin.

the flippers go nuts. one girls got 10 sparklers in her hand and their all lit. she proceedes to just stare at them and then lays them down and catches a small patch of grass on fire. another girl is doin a rave style dance with some sparklers.. one of the guy flippers then goes out and lights up a mortar.. this was an old as hell mortar apparently and blew up right outta the tube.. creating a wall of green purple and white that shot about 30 feet in each direction along the road (if the explosion had been rotated 90 degrees it would have killed me and the other non-flipper, the guy who lit it, the neighbors across the street, and prolly caught the girls on fire). its now about 8.30

i say somehting to the likes of "hey chauncey, no more mortars, ok?" and the flippers look at me like ive just sucked the high right out of them.. and start getting on to me like im a buzz kill.. but the guy who lit the mortar had A MORTAR IN ONE HAND AND A LIT CIGARETTE IN THE OTHER waving them around very retardedly..

this is where my logic sets in. i tell em all there nuts and head inside, away from windows. we trip out for a while and then decide its time to go to the lake and watch the citys fireworks (the original plan) but some flippers odnt want to go.. they want to lay around the yard and catch shit on fire.. so me, the other non-flipper and 3 flippers hop into a car and head to the lake (none are sober in this car)

we get to the lake and have to walk up this outrageous hill called the dam. we get to the top and its amazing.. wind in your hair, tons of fireworks shooting up all across the city, and you can see the works of like 3 surrounding cities.. not to mention some big bad shit form the city above the lake.

at this point was when i was starting to reach my peak.. it was already like 3 hours into the trip and i was still getting higher. the walk up the dam was nuts! the grass was moving and it felt like i was walkin on a treadmill. i make it to the top and look out over the water.. which is a dark purple blanket. i then turn around to look over the city and its beautiful. there are at least 10 mortars going off at the same time all across the city, all different types, for at least an hour (thats as long as we stayed). its now like 10.

we get worried about the remaining 3 flippers and decide to head home. we get back and the house has been brought out to the yard like 8 chairs (even though there were only 3 people there), a ton of random trash and some blakets, which are just wadded up in certain spots on the lawn. this is about 10.45

my mind is still flying and i know the neighbors think were all nuts. there are children walking about their yards and here weve got like 7 wide-eyed hippies flocking around this mess..

but i head in and get the idea of painting a guitar. everyone else heads in and the flippers dont even seem to have common sense. were smoking joints and bowls with the door wide open (i keep shutting it) and people are standing in the door way yelling drug related talk. this is when i have to do something. so me and the other non-flipper get on to them for being "too ecentric" and they flip out "well were all crazy!!" "yeah.. but you can keep the crazy on the inside, you know? it all in ur head, the neighbors dont need to see it"

this apparently brought some people down (back to earth) and ive offended someone. oops sorry we said it.. didnt mean it like that. just that the neighbors dont need to see us gooked as hell and you did almost blow them up, you know.

so the party mellows but were all still flying. its been about 4 hours and ive showed no signs of comming down, hell i just reached the peak about 45 mins ago! so then we paint. it now almost midnight.

we get this acoustic guitar and just go at it. a large green triangle turns into a mountain with a dude smokin in it and some fire on top. theres a peace sign engulfed in a psychedelic swirl, a random assortment of flowers: roses, a lilly of some sort, and some kind of vined-grape/blueberry/blue bonnet flower. then theres this insane green-yellow-red-blue-white-orange abstract mural that leaks down the side of the guitar.. a rose also turns into a red n yellow water fall off the side. love is written on the pick gaurd and we checkerboarded the fretboard, with a rainbow at the 12th fret.. the headstock then became a swirl of colors that was planed out to be a sun.

people are now talking about comming down and how "that was a good trip" ..but i havent even seen any signs of comming down.. the guitars paint wont keep still and i cant tell whats wet.. so we paint me, or just some bits of my chest, and light up a J or two.

about 7-8 hours after i took the lemon/lime shroom juice i was starting to come down.. it was now about 1:30am and the rest of the crew had been comming down for about 2 hours prior. i didnt even feel like i was off it til around 3.

i say this is the way to do shrooms, it was the most intense come up ive ever had. i dont think im goin to take shrooms with a lemon and a lime in me.

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Re: The Lemon Experience... [now a community experiment - please contribute] [Re: hippie_cune]
    #5830778 -

friend tried it with cranberry. didn't do anything to him.

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Re: The Lemon Experience... [now a community experiment - please contribute] [Re: gub]
    #5831755 -

used lemon/lime juice, 4g's of bomb shrooms shredded in it. too intense by a large degree. i could not distinguish reality from anything, and i got lost walking around on campus with my friend (also shrooming) for like six hours, but it was still somewhat enjoyable despite the terror and what-not.

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Re: The Lemon Experience... [now a community experiment - please contribute] [Re: Flop Johnson]
    #5845425 -

Alright, I would like a little help before i try this experiment tomorrow night. first off I have successfully tripped twice on shrooms(not a lot i know)since last August. My first trip was a very mild and soothing trip with little to no visualizations. This was from a 1/2 8th dose around 2 grams(give or take .2 grams dried). My last trip however, was an amazing experience full of colors, adventures, and ideas that filled me with glee(lets just say my friends found me half naked in a field, crying over a weed i had befriended and named Ralph). This was from a full 8th dose(about 4 grams dried). I am now ready to try this lemon experience and was looking to see what some of you more experienced trippers would recommend as a dose for me. I am looking to reach a high level 3 trip to a low level 4 like last time. Now i know that no one can be 100% sure for what i should take, but any helpful advice would be appreciated. Also i plan on grinding and soaking for about an hour in lemon juice and drinking everything including powdery goo.

Edited by ludicrous50 (07/11/06 12:53 AM)

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Re: The Lemon Experience... [now a community experiment - please contribute] [Re: ludicrous50]
    #5846557 -

Just to let you know, a full 8th dose is not 4 grams died, it is 3.5 grams. I'd say take 2 grams with lemon juice if you think it'll work for you.

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Re: The Lemon Experience... [now a community experiment - please contribute] [Re: DrGeek]
    #5846704 -

yea i know, i was just rounding up with the 1/8. Have you tried the lemom juice, did it work for you, and at what amount of juice and shrooms?

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Re: The Lemon Experience... [now a community experiment - please contribute] [Re: Underhillmaster]
    #5847214 -

I've done the lemon juice three times.. well the first time I used crushed up vitamin C and 1 g, but it didn't do much so an hour later I ate another 2g. The second time I used lemon juice and 1.5g, not very much happened. The last time I used lemon juice and 2.5 grams, it just felt like a normal 2.5 trip to me. For most of the people here though, it seems to potentiate the shrooms twofold, I guess it just doesn't work for me.

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Re: The Lemon Experience... [now a community experiment - please contribute] [Re: DrGeek]
    #5847293 -

alright, well thanx for your input

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My first lemon juice trip [Re: ludicrous50]
    #5940817 -

# What liquid are you using? Orange Juice and squeezed lemon blended.
.
# How much liquid did you drink the powder with? About 200ml of OJ and one squeezed lemon.
.
# Time to "first alert" (aka, "whoa, something's definitely going to happen")10 minutes for the sedative effect, 20 minutes for the first signs of euphoria.
.
# Time to onset of visual disturbance 25 minutes
.
# Time to peak (rough estimate)90 minutes
.
# Time to first sign of diminishing effects 4 hours
.
# Time to baseline (indiscernible effects) 5 hours


I wish I could tell you how many grams, but I don't have a scale for safety purposes. Anyway, this was my fourth trip, my first trip was in March. This was by far the most intense one. It came on very smoothly, over the course of about half an hour I went from completely normal to tripping out of my head in a very smooth line. It was a strong level 3 or level 4 trip. I lost all perception of reality and time for about 2 hours. I kept getting stuck in moments, like they seemed to never end. One example was a never ending cigarette that really confused me! I kept smoking it and it seemed to just grow back! Fascinating stuff.

In any case, I took slightly more than my last trip a month and a half ago and the trip was much, much stronger. I would say that the lemon juice helped me digest the mushrooms easier, I had no problems with stomach pains, like I did sometimes in the other trips. Of course that could have been because I decided to not eat during the morning before this trip.

So my tips are, fast before and add lemon juice!

Thanks for the great tip!


--------------------
"I'm not serious of course,
um, but I am peculiar."
-Terence McKenna

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Re: I may have discovered something... [Re: Underhillmaster]
    #6388839 -

So let me get this straight. When people are saying that lemon makes a trip 2x to 5x stronger, are they saying a level one trip is going to anything between a level two trip to a level five trip? Or are they saying something like 2 grams now becomes like 4 to 10 grams? This is an important distinction. I wouldn't mind my shrooms taking me to a higher level, maybe a level one up to a level three.
But I don't want to go from 2 grams to 6 grams in potency! That's a definite level 5+ for me. Way too much -


--------------------
Good judgment comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgment. --  Jim Horning

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Re: The Lemon Experience... [now a community experiment - please contribute] [Re: ]
    #6389941 -

werdnaeroom8 said:
so this lemon tek works because the chemicals are broken down before they enter your body which means an instant trip with no come up thast how i get it.


If that's what people are using as an explanation then the explation is wrong. Here are the facts:

- most psilocybe cubensis flushes have more psilocybin than psilocin [1]
- psilocin is stabilized by ascorbic acid (vitamin C) [2]
- psilocybin is relatively stable on its own
- psilocybin is converted in the gut, kidney (I think) and blood by alkaline phosphatases very rapidly but it is unknown if the conversion is 100% - one study showed that IV psilocybin resulted in peak plasma concentrataions of psilocin within two minutes [2]

Regarding the third fact: this is widely cited and relatively easy to find, so I see no need to reference it.

Therefore, I can suggest a few explanations for the effects:

- Placebo (if you find this explanation offensive then I simply remind you that you're taking a strong psychedelic drug under uncontrolled conditions and NO you CAN'T tell the difference between placebo and the effects of the drug)

- protonation of the phosphate substituent may allow for increased uptake of psilocybin due to reduced ionic character

- the presence of ascorbic acid in lemon juice may prevent psilocin from oxidizing in vivo, meaning increased biological availability of psilocin

Please note that at this point the evidence is not conclusive (and no your bioassays don't point to one explanation over another)

Now, regarding speculation on the effect of the acid on chewing up mushroom fibers or allowing for a sort-of 'pre-extraction' of the active ingredients, I highly doubt that this would make a noticeable difference. Chewing them thoroughly should be just as effective as blending them in a blending with OJ (and I LOVE the taste of shrooms).

references:

1. Bigwood, J. and Beug, M W. Variation of Psilocybin and Psilocin Levels with Repeated Flushes (Harvests) of Mature Sporocarps of Psilocybe Cubensis (Earle) Singer. Journal of Ethnopharmacology. 5, pp. 287 - 291. (1982)

2. Hasler, F. et al. Determination of psilocin and 4-hydroxy-indole-3-acetic acid in plasma by HPLC-ECD and pharmacokinetic profiles of oral and intravenous psilocybin in man. Pharmaceutica Acta Helvetiae. 72, pp. 175 - 184. (1997)

Edited by Chemiker (12/20/06 12:33 PM)

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Re: The Lemon Experience... [now a community experiment - please contribute] [Re: Chemiker]
    #6389974 -

tried this, didn't see a difference in the trip. that's just me though :shrug:


--------------------
I Don't come to fight flesh and blood but spiritual wickedness in high and low places

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Re: The Lemon Experience... [now a community experiment - please contribute] [Re: VampireSlayer]
    #6396148 -

I had a bunch of shrooms from the same batch, and saw this experiment going on and thought I would test it out and see if it actually worked. I took about .5 of them without lemon juice 3 or 4 different times to see what they were like normally. Then I took the same amount and crushed it up into lemon juice and let it sit for about 15 min. The result wasn't what I had hoped, I've used the lemon juice method about 4 different times as well and each time there was no noticeable increase, it was exactly the same as when I took the .5 normally. So my conclusion is this is just a placebo effect, ill keep trying it out though since the lemon juice does do a good job of covering the taste lol.

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Re: The Lemon Experience... [now a community experiment - please contribute] [Re: briant230]
    #6409297 -

It can't be unhealthy so I'll try, but I think the most natural test would be to try it beside tea of the same concentration.

I've always found liquids hit more quickly in general.

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Re: The Lemon Experience... [now a community experiment - please contribute] [Re: mrEdude]
    #6411392 -

liquids have more surface area which means more rapid absorption, so yes it will hit quicker


--------------------
"The real voyage of discovery
consists not in seeing new landscapes,
but in having new eyes."

"Small doses suck dogs cocks, smoke that shit until the elves piss in your eyes. " -Hanky

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Re: The Lemon Experience... [now a community experiment - please contribute] [Re: Cryptix]
    #6411696 -

Potentially 5 times as strong, huh?

Shit, next time I have some I'll try 1.5 grams with cranberry.

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Re: I may have discovered something... [Re: Cryptix]
    #6411825 -

Dude i've done this before. It explains why i trippped my ass through my own head.

Before i thought they were just strong shrooms, but after reading that lemon juice enhances the trip, this is the only explanation.

Bonnaroo 2006- I get some shrooms about 1/8 or so, or $30 worth. I put some on my pizza, and begin to eat happily. I eat the remaining raw, I had a lemonade to drink adn wash things down with. A big glass of lemonade, like a $5 glass. It makes perfect sense after reading that lemonade fucks your ass.

I've done shrooms before this trip, but i still consider myself relativley inexperienced.

I had a 'lv 5', hell maybe even more if it can be said so. The story goes as follows. This is as much as i can remember, and the timetable of events is probably way off.

I eat em with my friend. He had the same amount. I dont think he had a lemonade, i'll check on it. I eat em as described before, then head into the Roo to catch some bands. It was the first day of activites, so no big bands going on, i think the Wood brothers were what i saw. Oh yea i ate the shrooms for dinner. maybe 8:00?

My friend has never done them before, and couldn't handle the onset stomach burps bleps, and bites. He went bakc to the camp site. I didcided to go check on him and left maybe 20 minutes after him. On my way out, it hits me. I went from the burps, past yawning, and straight into blur. I remember seeing a wall of people, a big blur of people running everywhere. I thought' they were running, and i started to run too. I somehow made it out of the gate, after getting lost a bit, and probably running numerous people over. its hard to tell.

I find my way to the camp site and take a seat on an inflateable seat. I can hear my friends voice, but cant see em. I call asking him if hes alright. Hes just laying down for a bit in the tent.

I hear some fireworks, so a stay a while and enjoy the show. The fireworks spirl out of control, and the smoke left behind turns into weird Greek Gods or something like that. I turn back to the tent and the metal frame holding it up turns. I start to see too many colors that shouldn't be there. Not even an hour has gone by now. This is the last piece that i can remember being remotely in touch with reality. My timelime is ripped to pieces from here on. This is what i can remember, sort of.

At some point, i think that i died. I thought that i had gotten a blood transfusion. Changing all of my blood with herion. After realizing i did this i tried drinking some water and breathing deeply to save my own life, but it was no use. I felt the life sleep out of me. I fell into the depths of space.

I thought i was in hell. My idea of time was no more, so it felt as though icould have been in hell for a million years for all i knew. Hell was a sequence of events that i can't remember, but were horrifying. Once i realized that i was in hell, i left it. It was now that i realized that i remember i had died.

I began to think that my memories of life were just a dream. THat my family and life never actually was. I had created my own life, simply by realizeing my own existence, in whatever shape it was. Was i God? I thought that the universe was created by me and for me.

I somehow transitioned to thinking that the world was ending. THat mother nature had finally had enough and was somehow giong to end it for all of us.

I thought that the universe in all of its form, every single action or movement within it was done for the sole purpose of what was about to happen. Every prior moment had been building up to this one step i was about to take. I thought that 'Bonnaroo' and the Earth had called on me to save everyone, to find a new planet for us all to live on. I remember thinking i flew off the earths surface, but not out into space. I failed. The whole thing ended. Everything. The universe was waiting on me to do some meraculous act, and i just fucked it up, and know we all died. time stopped, game over.

Just then, i had another chance. I didn't know what i did, but somehow i did it. I just solved all the worlds problems and life had become perfect. No harm would come to the people of earth. It was 2006 and the future of living had come upon us. no illnesses, only life. Lets party.

A rush of euphoria, happiness, overwhelming joy was on. Somehow everyone knew i had saved us, they knew of the mistep on my first attempt at whatever i did too.

Everything, the people, the tress and the tents, were up and partying, dancing and alive.

This is the last of what i can really remember. i'm sure there was more tho.

when i came too, i was walking back into the roo, it was almost dawn. a complete automatron, i was walking to a porta-john. There were still kalidoscpoe, and line diagrams over everything. I was on auto-pilot. I ended up back at the camp site and crashed.

oh yea, at one point i thought that 'something' was going to get me, and if i just kept my eyes shut id be alright.

I remember twisting my head right off my body. maybe that was how i died? I was laying down and my head twisted off, broke my neck and spinal cord, twisting down and off. I also remember my hands and fingers, probably my whole body, twisting, contracting. Like they were hard rocks scraping at the joints. twisting and my bones cracking. like the "bone-itis" guy on 'Futurama. The exec from the '80s.

I also remeber pee-ing myself. and everything laughing at me, i felt like a little insignificant nothing and wanted to run away.


The timeline of events is, as i say, way off. This is what i can rememebr of that night. Waking up the next day, at noon-ish, my friend awoke me.

He was trying to give me an air-pump for the airmattress. I thought i was dreaming. I didnt say a word to him. I was waiting to wake up or something. he asked me if i was alright. silence. I didnt remember the trip right away, or that i had even done the shrooms really. I dint know where i was at first. Then what day into the festival it was.

The rest of that day was in a very dreamy state. i dont remember what bands i saw.

I cought back up with my friend a day or so into the event. He remember his trip much more than me. I dont think he drank lemonade. He thought he was God, and was walking around proclaiming himself to be so. Almost fought a few people, because he was god, "dude i'm god, back off" or something like that.

I think this f'd up trip was from the huge lemonade i drank with the 1/8 oz of shrooms. or maybe it was only the shrooms. But i've never triupped this hard before, or sence. My friend didnt trip as hard, and could remember almost the entire trip. He didn't have a lemonade with his yum yums.

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Re: I may have discovered something... [Re: nolongerinuse]
    #6500649 -

Could you try this with vinegar, if so how woudl u go about doing so with vinegar?

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