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OfflineAsanteA
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LIBERTY CAP PEOPLE please lend a hand !!!
    #549707 - 02/13/02 07:23 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Hi! I'm one of those relatively rare people that tries to apply science to the Mushroom experience, and I've come up with some significant findings, I'll post some time in the future. I really need the help of all you people who've had a lot (preferably over 8 or so) of trips on the Liberty Cap, Psilocybe Semilanceata.

Tripping's an Aversive Stress Stimulus (ASS) to all mammals, including us. Only the content we derive out of our trips makes us take them again, setting us apart from every other animal. I divide the Experience into two major categories:
Generic Psychedelic Effect (GPE), meaning the usual intensity & effects one gets from consuming a particular dose of Psilocybin, and the activation of
Deep Psychodynamics (DP) that gives rise to uniquely wonderful & (personal) horrible stuff & is responsible for the fact that once in a while a low dose will hit you like the proverbial ton of lead. I've found that one can calculate alot of VERY useful things from a few variables.

One dried gr of Liberties equals 10 gr fresh and averages 10 mushrooms.
This quantity or more contains about 8-12mg Psilocybin and averages ~10mg.
1/8 of an ounce is about 3.5 grams.
One kilo equals 2.2 US pounds of weight.

WHAT I LIKE TO KNOW OF YOU: Most Lib-cappers measure their trip in grams/ounce-fractions or as a specific number of shroomies. If you've taken any quantity of LIBERTIES (no other shroom!!!) over 4 times (or better: more of those) I really like to know the following:

1...What's the weight or number of Libs you took over 4x?
2...How much do you weigh in kilos/US pounds? (UK people: no Stones please!)
3...How many times have you taken named amound of Libs? (specify if it's either precise or your BEST guess)
4...How many of these trips resulted in you NOT FEELING GOOD FOR OVER HALF THE DURATION OF THE TRIP? (again: specify Fact or Best Guess)

I want to know this to come up with a dose average that most'll enjoy most of the time, and the dose that's statistically certain to be VERY DIFFICULT everytime.
I've got mine; please help us Trip people help eachother & the newbies...
If you like to give info on best/worst Trips or the like: please do, but most important are your answers on 1 thru 4.
If I get enough of 'em I'll personally reward you by posting your probable averages for named responses. amounts between 1-2gr = 10-20 Libs are most useful since higher doses tend to give rise to DP's that will obscure the ratios I need to drop my Math Bomb.

If your info's about OTHER shrooms, please don't post: they're too variable in their Psilocybin content for me to make a good graph.
If you just like to f#ck around, please laugh your head off on the fact that I'd love to get anal on the amount of DP & ASS shroomerypeople seem to get, but DON'T POST LIES: Only true info an help us all gauge our doses better, and wrong info may wallop lots of newbies out of ever taking shrooms again.

I thank all (if any) for seriously participating.


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OfflineRoger_irrelevant
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Re: LIBERTY CAP PEOPLE please lend a hand !!! [Re: Asante]
    #549771 - 02/13/02 09:13 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

I've only had the opurtunity to trip one year on liberty caps (so far, lets hope the pickings good this year :wink:

I found 150 libs in a field
1st dose 30 mushrooms fresh = euphoric. Complete mind high, little or no body sensations very nice.

2nd dose 80 mushrooms dry in tea at mush after. = effects came on quickly, I was thrust into an amazing void (which I often descibe as a soup) ego loss, some unknown  character (tribal woman looking for her children) interaction, some difficult periods and confusion like not knowing where I was, thinking I may have been unconscious for long peroids of time but overall managable and very very nice.
The rest I mixed with homegrown cubies. Looking forwad to my next outing with these.

175 pounds
Hope this helps
You're theory about us being the only animals to experience something which may be considered pleasurable may not be correct
check http://mjshroomer.yage.net/news14.html
     


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Edited by Roger_irrelevant (02/13/02 09:39 AM)


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: LIBERTY CAP PEOPLE please lend a hand !!! [Re: Roger_irrelevant]
    #550006 - 02/13/02 02:00 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

RI: thanx for responding!

That second one must have been REALLY intense!!!
The highest dose I took was about equiv. to 60mg Psilocybin, but yours could very well have been 80mg, which verges on maximal intensity.
Ego-death? (this being a DP)
I don't doubt it one minute, as on average people frequently enounter DP-activation in doses over 40mg, a range most trippers cannot stand.
I think if I took that I'd be in BIG TROUBLE if unguided. My personal graph backs up that theory, too. Clearly you're either sucking this out of your thumb, you're relatively less sensitive than average or your among the most shock-proof persons there are. I think one of the latter two. DON'T RECCOMMEND 80mg !!!

Alas: too little info to base a graph on! When I tormented some friends with these questions, their dose that was mostly pleasureable (75% of times) was between 10 and 30 libs/mg. Their "breaking points" (100% sure to be extremely intense every time) were calculated to be between 40mg & 120mg, which sounded realistic to them.

I wish you ounes upon ounces of dried Libbies next season!
Thanx for the feedback !


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: LIBERTY CAP PEOPLE please lend a hand !!! [Re: Roger_irrelevant]
    #550028 - 02/13/02 02:14 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Oh yeah, BTW...

About that ALL mammals thingy: I've read that somewhere scientific, but new facts may well have emerged. I'll check it out. An extra from memory:

"in a rat colony LSD-laced water was introduced & regular water removed. Upon discovering that, the majority refused to drink that again until SEVERE dehydration set in. Over 10% chose death over another Psychedelic Experience. To the animal part of the Human brain Psychedelics were thus found to be more shocking and aversively stressful than just about anything. The average amount drank by the rats was roughly equal to 250mcg Lysergide, or 50mg Psilocybin (1/8 of the VERY STRONGEST Cubensis in a 80kg human (like you) Clearly the Neocortex (the thing that makes us human) is the only brain-part that can (likely) enjoy such a thing."

KEEP 'EM COMING EVERYBODY !!!


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OfflineRoger_irrelevant
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Re: LIBERTY CAP PEOPLE please lend a hand !!! [Re: Asante]
    #550057 - 02/13/02 02:45 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Firstly whats a DP? Second I'm not sure you can get a real acurate measure from these figures:

One dried gr of Liberties equals 10 gr fresh and averages 10 mushrooms.

This is a bit shakey to me as weight of specimens could vary considerably but then with only brief experience with these mushrooms I could be wrong .
As for lying not much point. The reason I decided to go for that particular dose was because of a sites dosage recomendations
members.tripod.co.uk/~shroommap. It doesn't seem to be there anymore (anyone know why??)
Anyway it gave indications of effects by *amount* not weight, saying strong =80, thus I ended up taking 80. I have read accounts of people dosing higher than this (100+), though not remembering much of the experience :crazy:
Yes that experience has been the most intense/pleasurable trip to date. I love Libs the quality is far superior to any other mushroom I've tried.
There could be a sensitivity issue as I find with cyanescens that the 4.5g dose (shroomery dosage calculator) just dosen't get me anywhere near to the lib experience. 
   


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: LIBERTY CAP PEOPLE please lend a hand !!! [Re: Roger_irrelevant]
    #550138 - 02/13/02 03:55 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Roger:
DP= Deep Psychodynamics. (ego death & death/rebirth experiences & such)

I've read that if you take over 10 Libbies, those are the averages!
Didn't mean to imply you were Lion... It's just rare to hear of someone to tripping over 60-70mg & having a good time. A site recommending 80 libbies while most people can only manage 20 when the goin' gets rough ought to have it's hardware examined.

LIBS ARE MY FAVORITE TOO!!!


BTW: did you get like weak muscles the day after those Wavy Caps? I've read something like that in "Psilocybin Mushrooms o/t World" (Stamets) Gotta readit!


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OfflineRoger_irrelevant
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Re: LIBERTY CAP PEOPLE please lend a hand !!! [Re: Asante]
    #550209 - 02/13/02 04:47 PM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:Didn't mean to imply you were Lion... It's just rare to hear of someone to tripping over 60-70mg & having a good time

What I'm trying to get at is mushroom size/weight/psilocybin content is going to vary between specimins, you're *assuming* the maximum psilocybin content for each mushroom (.98% by weight) and *assuming* average weight.

quote:A site recommending 80 libbies while most people can only manage 20 when the goin' gets rough ought to have it's hardware examined.

Shroommap was a good site with lots of info from experienced peeps IMO. + I did try 30 fresh beforehand. (I didn't realise that a certain type of maggot seems to like to sit in the gills of these mushies, glad I found out after the trip and not during...Tasty...Bleeeurrrr :crazy: 

Weak muscles the day after? No. I read somewhere (fanaticus has an exert mabye) that severe muscle weaking can occur at dosages of 7g+. During the onset probably half hour or so I seem to shake uncontrollably with these. Sometimes the *cybin vibin* can feel way to good othertimes just annoying as it's difficult to concentrate on anything else. There's another thread about shaking and mushrooms quite recent.   


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: LIBERTY CAP PEOPLE please lend a hand !!! [Re: Roger_irrelevant]
    #551065 - 02/14/02 11:13 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

RI: didn't mean to sound snotty or anything like that...

9.8mg/gr... I went straight for the Stamets book I mentioned before. Saw the same thing you mentioned, but also:
"Gartz (1993) reported an average of 1% PSB, with a range of 0.2-2.37% PSB"
This sounds realistic since I once took 5 = 0.5gr and had a fullblown trip develop on me, which according to several sources isn't possible on just 5mg, an amount I've taken several times as an meditation-aid. A Dutch info for Smartshops (I'm Dutch) reported that average to be consistent and every amount of Libs I've had I counted & weighed (generally 1-3gr). Every time this weight average proved correct without even a 0.1gr deviation. (own notes) In a Dutch book on Psychedelics it was recommended never to exceed 40 Libbies. The Stamets book backs up my ~1%PSB assumption and strongly advises against taking over 70mg = 7gr average Libs.

Good you got me thinking & re-checking my assumptions. Hope you didn't feel offended...


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Re: LIBERTY CAP PEOPLE please lend a hand !!! [Re: Roger_irrelevant]
    #551073 - 02/14/02 11:25 AM (14 years, 9 months ago)

Oh, Yeah...

Read the sheep article. The grasslands of the UK are in some places riddled with Libbies. It might well be those pastures were so full of 'em the sheep couldn't avoid eating them while grazing.
And then there's the fact that there are several species of grasses (like Phalaris Arundinacea, that happens to contain like 1-2% N,N-DMT) that makes sheep appear quite intoxicated, like drunk.
All I've read on Mammals + Psychedelics says that the overwhealming majority of them'll go to extremes to avoid the Psychedelic Experience. I'll check the Net sometime to see if anything new has popped up.

On your shakes: I had 'em too, even on LSD, so I don't think it's that particular kind of shroom.
Thanx for sharing!


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