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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: EmbracingShadows]
    #4404209 -

So you are still in high school? You shouldn't even be on this board.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4404288 -

im experimenting and gaining knowlage on psychedelics i am 18 years old i can be on this board who are you to say i shoudlnt be on here and deny my thrist for knowlage and information and council on these subjects?

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: EmbracingShadows]
    #4404348 -

Welcome Shadowman! You will find everything you need to know here. And much you don't. :heart: :grin: :thumbup: :mushroom2:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: Icelander]
    #4404741 -

This is without question the funniest topic we've had recently.


EmbracingShadows: Punctuation is your friend.


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Live by the foma that make you brave, and kind, and healthy, and happy.

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: Jellric]
    #4404851 -

I've worked in junior high and middle schools for 19 years now. I also remember my own junior high experience very well. I was a late bloomer and on top of that, being an INTP which accounts for about 1% of the American population as an Introverted Thinking Type didn't help my cause either.

When puberty dawns, the former emphasis on intellectual interests becomes overwhelmed by the hormonally fired, sexual and aggressive impulses. If one's dress, mannerisms, walk and talk do not adequately reflect one's budding instinctual life (which comes to rank as the most real, most exciting, most 'adult' thing going on in adolescent life) - then one is deemed a nerd.

In my home town the most aggressive males and the most sexually promiscuous girls in my high school came from the one Catholic school (which only went to the 8th grade) in town. These behaviors were in good measure a sudden relaxation of the inordinate suppression that was imposed upon their instictual lives in Catholic school. For example, when my friend Ed stepped on the girl's playground (completely segregated by gender), a nun decided to humiliate him saying 'so, you want to be on the girl's playground - you must want to be a girl,' and forced him to remove his necktie and tie it around his head with a bow on top! I have to say that all that suppression ill-effected the intellects of those kids who were the least academic oriented of all the kids in the public high school, but the biggest fighters and f**kers!

In Miami's middle schools, aside from the 'gifted' kids who are in a world of their own - being groomed for ivy league schools and high paying positions - a huge proportion of kids make up an 'underclass' (there is, for example, practically no African-American middle class in Miami, and among Haitians, a small monied population and a huge illiterate adult population. Among Latino cultures (of which there are many) the picture complicates tremendously. Whites are a small minority in Miami-Dade County. But aside from the gifted kids, there is the mind-set that being 'hard' is more important than being educated. In fact, being a student means that one is listening to teachers, counselors and other adults and therefore is being 'soft.' This attitude comes from the street and is a consequence of kids whose fathers, uncles and brothers are incarcerated. I ask classes of kids if they have anyone in prison, and there is often 5-6 out of 30 kids who raise their hands.

A good number of kids try to turn their attitude around after floundering 2 years out of high school, try to go to Miami-Dade College, but maybe they dropped out of high school or their reading-writing-arithmetic skills are so pathetically poor that they can't cut it. My Lady has taught at that college and at my middle school. College-age kids have middle school skills and some of her 8th graders read on a 2.7 level, which is to say, 2nd grade plus 7 months!

Sorry for the ramble. I could go on about the interactions of adolescent-thinking adults who are by correlation, morally retarded, criminal and who effect kids in middle school. One of my former 14 year old female counselees would go on 'shopping sprees' with her 29 year old father who is a career criminal - a thief. She would show me this necklace or this blouse - stolen for her by Dad. This is her parenting - what can one expect of her? She knows better, but is she to lecture her father about the wrongness of it all?


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: EmbracingShadows]
    #4405484 -

Sorry, most high school juniors are often 16, my son is.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4405692 -

" If one's dress, mannerisms, walk and talk do not adequately reflect one's budding instinctual life (which comes to rank as the most real, most exciting, most 'adult' thing going on in adolescent life) - then one is deemed a nerd."

I disagree. Most people who know me would tell you that I am a severe nerd. When I turned seventeen, though, my years of verbal abuse taking overwhelmed me and I joined the Army. By the age of 18 I was as obsessed with lifting weights, weapon systems, explosives, and hand to hand combat as I am with computers now. At that point I felt so aggressive that when I returned home on leave I confronted several of my still in high school abusers (I graduated early) and offered them physical violence...all I got were apologies and offers of friendship. Even nerds can feel aggressive.

"One of my former 14 year old female counselees would go on 'shopping sprees' with her 29 year old father who is a career criminal - a thief. She would show me this necklace or this blouse - stolen for her by Dad. This is her parenting"

That is a site better parenting than many parents I know. At least in his horribly fucked up way he cared enough to spend time with his kid...


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4405959 -

You can disagree if you want to, but that's how it's been for middle school adolescents in my experience over the past 19 years. I was a nerd who also took a couple of martial arts as early as age 12, wrote my 11th and 12th grade term papers on weapons-system (Civil War and the arms race 1960-1970 respectively), who became fairly good at compounding rocket fuel and low-power (non-nitro) explosives, but I did not flaunt any kind of aggressive behavior in terms of fighting, and detonating explosives or launching rockets was purely for the phenomenon - an intellectual pursuit - not for destroying property. I was completely exempt from the socio-sexual domain of adolescent game-playing, and I was completely repressed psycho-sexually until I was 18.

You might have considered yourself to be a nerd, but those who offerred friendship (not from fear) must have thought you were 'cool.' A nerd is not merely socially inept, but inept and disliked sufficiently to be labelled. Labelling is a very real aspect of bullying. Perhaps your physical prowess and your intelligence was recognized and respected despite the strangeness of Asperger's symptomology. Besides, I hung out with a number of guys who were later diagnosed with Bipolar Disorder (which accounted for tremendous manic-phase drug use), Depression (which resulted in suicide), alcoholics, and other things. Who knew the kids were ill or what their diagnoses were? You liked them despite oddities or not.


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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #4405995 -

I AM THE NERDIEST!


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Live by the foma that make you brave, and kind, and healthy, and happy.

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: orechron]
    #4407306 -

One other thing pops to mind...

The ability to interpret culture and fashion allows someone to manipulate their social appearance. From the clothing you wear, to an understanding of what kind of music, culture, body language and behavior is interpreted by the people around you in different ways.

It's quite easy to sit on the sidelines and complain that the popular people are shallow or stupid, but they've in fact mastered the ability to manipulate how they appear in the eyes of others through the use of very subtle social cues.

I think that dismissing people who are able to do this as shallow is very closed minded. Not everyone has this ability, and looking down at those who do seems to be the result of jealously more than anything else. There are actually quite a few people who are very good at being cool, and are still very open and accepting people. There are others who simply follow the cool people around and try to become cool through straigh mimicry, but they usually aren't quite as successful.

Often the coolest kids of all have nerd friends.

(High school may be a bit different than life after it, people tend to become more reasonable as they get older).


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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: Phluck]
    #4407317 -

Good point. :thumbup:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #4408255 -

" those who offerred friendship (not from fear) must have thought you were 'cool."

No none of them liked me. The three individuals I confonted were trying to weasal out of an ass beating that I told them they would get if they offered even the slightest provocation to my threats. The funny thing was that after this point, having resolved a long standing issue of pride, the Army had served it's purpose and I was ready to move on....unfortunately Uncle Sam had other plans. To pay for this experience I still owed the Army 3 1/2 more years. I have later reflected on the fact that I even recognized this abuse as one of the greatest character failings of my entire life. For the record I did not accept myself as a nerd until I was 36...I just thought everybody else was wrong, but when you awaken from the daze of a 14 hour coding session you just have to face facts.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4409107 -

A view from my world :

From when i was young i had an innate tendency towards what i would later find out was scientific inquiry.Some have drawing skills ,some have musical skills,others know how to interact with fellow humans, and i had that. I HAD TO KNOW the "what if's". I was the child that when i set my grandmas curtains on fire they would search me for matches or lighter but they would find only a magnifying glass on me. I would dabble with fireworks a bit of unintentionally very disastrous rocketeering (Heh,i could be working for Bush or al quaeda!).I would mix different chemicals and observe reactions. No,i wasnt a straight A kid,i was more on the upper middle of grades,because i easily lost my attention on classes ,but always when asked i would provide a more or less "sufficient" answer to the teacher.

I was seriously lacking social skills,and popular kids used to pick on me sometimes but i took it very to the heart and started thinking i was some kind of "weirdo".This behaviour has followed me over to high school,where i felt an "outsider" having only 1 friend, usually picked from the rather weird but kind at heart fellows. Same more or less at what i could call "college".

My eyes where opened abruptly at a ...gym session after the college had finished and i was ready for uni.I stumbled accross on of the popular,"good looking" guys of the school -heh,at the time i dreaded meetings like that- where after chit chating he revealed to me some astonishing facts:

1)The popular cast didnt consider me a weirdo,but thought at times i was snobbish because i always turned down their jokes or invitations to hang out with them! I had some serious issues and thought that whenever they invited me with a slightly joking mood they were doing it to make fun of me so i shyied away

2)Popular girls that were univoqually beautifull had crashes on me,but with my behaviour i turned them down! I was so defensive ,that i even thought girls approaching me in a silly mood actually wanted to point out my "nerdiness"-"weirdiness"

3) Bullies were ...afraid of me after just one fight. I was quite of a pressure cooker without a safety "whistle". Many guys would take the piss out of me or bully me and i would cower away and -the guy in the gym told me - has seen me with quite an astonishment to give rather violent and impressive beatings to the bully of the bullies just after a single provocation. Heh,i bet that confused lot of people , being a coward in front of the "silly rabbit" but beating in a pulp the "king Lion". Im not a muscular guy ,not a strong one but at times when my lid blew of i somehow tapped into great strenght (propably in my fit pulled some Maori Faces as well) that left the attacker quite dumbfounded and susceptible to manic attacks from my part. I had to fight all in all 3 times ,one in junior school,one in highschool and one in college. I wondered why ,until i realised that i was actually a rather scary guy when my lid blew off...

All in all i realised how flawed my self image was. I came to the bitter realisation that a certain "nerdiness" or "weirdiness" which was a part of me ,i let it become a self fulfiling prophecy and react with bad defences to people that meant me no harm.Still, from a primate point of view, Alpha males wanted me in their company,alpha females prefered me and on rare occasions i exhibited fight-or-flight (fight in this case) responses with aggresivness that...scared even "established" alpha males.

It took me some time (and some psychedelics) latter on for these realisations to sink in and....i found myself over to the other end...Displaying full "alpha male" behaviour ,causing "flight" behaviour in "aknowledged" alpha males (never abusive but rather intense when they displayed their.."alphaness") and a ladiesman that reached almost scandalous heights compared to the old lil' selffulfiled weirdo that fucked his palms and almost ejaculated to the scientific breakthroughs announced through magazines. Since then i have deflated a bit and found my place somewhere in the middle.

I still retain my "scientific quirq" (Yup im a geek for science),but still score on popularity,opposite sex,friendship and generally in what i choose to do.Quite of an ugly duckling turning into a swan dont you think?

If only i could tell to my "highschool self" that all he needed to do was "take it easy",that he is "normal" ,people like him and his scientific quirq is a bit weird for his age but thats just it.

I guess teenagers could benefit from my post since many people went through the stages i mentioned,but since thay arent allowed in here ( :p ) i just state it for the records.

By the way what is the "asperger" (sp?) syndrome? First time i hear of it!


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Entheomation's SEED Ethical Vendor Project.Please support it if you value your plants!

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: Psiloman]
    #4409256 -

Great post. :thumbup: :smile:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: Psiloman]
    #4409378 -

Your experience is probably universal among nerdy types. Mostly the wall we may percieve around us is the product of our own handiwork.


--------------------
"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: Jellric]
    #4427546 -

Jellric said:
The key to this mystery is to rephrase the question slightly. Why don't smart kids make themselves popular? If they're so smart, why don't they figure out how popularity works and beat the system, just as they do for standardized tests?"


intelligence is usually very local, meaning within one individual, he/she has one type of intelligence, and this intelligence is developed through practice and knowledge of that specific field. Just because you understand algebra 10 times quicker than others doesnt mean youll ever be able to understand how to seduce and intrigue beautiful members of the opposite sex.

too bad nerds! haha, get back to your cubicles!

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: Doom]
    #4427566 -

My wife made the argument the other day that anyone who spends a lot of time posting on a philosophy forum is most likely a nerd for that reason alone.


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"A warrior is a hunter. He calculates everything. That's control. Once his calculations are over, he acts. He lets go. That's abandon. A warrior is not a leaf at the mercy of the wind. No one can push him; no one can make him do things against himself or against his better judgment. A warrior is tuned to survive, and he survives in the best of all possible fashions." ― Carlos Castaneda

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4427572 -

sounds like she was itching for a shag, mate.

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: Huehuecoyotl]
    #4427575 -

Busted. :thumbup: :blush:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC

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Re: Why are nerds unpopular? [Re: Jellric]
    #4427649 -

Jellric said:
Why are nerds unpopular?


We're unpopular? I never noticed. I guess popularity really isn't very important to some people. One thing that has always baffled me is, where does the insecurity come from among those who are with the 'in' crowd who would disparage those who are not?


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Money doesn't grow on trees, but deficits do grow under Bushes.

You can accept, reject, or examine and test any new idea that comes to you. The wise man chooses the third way.
- Tom Willhite

Disclaimer: I reserve the right to change my opinions should I become aware of additional facts, the falsification of information or different perspectives. Articles written by others which I post may not necessarily reflect my opinions in part or in whole, my opinions may be in direct opposition, the topic may be one on which I have yet to formulate an opinion or have doubts about, an article may be posted solely with the intent to stimulate discussion or contemplation.

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